5950x optimisation advice

[TheSoupladel]

If its an ASUS, yes. Well, for the PPT, EDC and TDC limits. Under the Advanced AMD Overclocking section EDC and TDC are hard-limited at 190 and 160.

Have to use the AI tweaker section to set numbers higher for TDC and EDC.

Other than that I don't think so, just AMD bios jank where there is multiple sections that can do the same thing. The curve optimiser is under the advanced AMD section and that is the only place it exists. At least on ASUS boards.

Ryzen Master will tell you what your PPT, TDC and EDC values are.

I have the Asus Crosshair VIII hero and can confirm there are two complete seperate areas for setting curve optimiser and the limits, they look identical but they arent because i am getting different performance from setting this under "Advanced > AMD Overclocking > Precision Boost Overdrive" as opposed to "Extreme Tweaker > Precision Boost Overdrive".

Until this point i have been doing everything under the Extreme Tweaker menu, inlcuding the limits and curve optimiser and got improved multi core result after adjusting the limits. However after making the same adjustments (including Curve Optimiser) in the AMD Overclocking section the improvements are different again. For example, my CB multicore score had gone up by 1000 points from just over 28,000 to over 29,000. The core speed in the same test has gone from 4.325 after settling down to 4.45.

I also saw the maximum core frequency go up to 5Ghz on multiple cores when idling (info from HWinfo64) but thats where the good news end though, i am still not getting 5Ghz in any meaningful way in single core testing either in CB or in Games. I appreciate it wouldn't go to 5Ghz and stay there but its just not going there at all. I am currently redoing the dance with corecycler and my previous result (when set in AMD Overclocking) have caused a couple hard resets, therefore i am currently running with 0 on the best two cores -10 on the next 4 cores and -20 on everything else.

I still have fair bit to go but i am a little bit more hopeful i might actually get there now.

 

[TheSoupladel]

I am doing a second round of CoreCycler and Prime95 has thrown an error on Core's 0 and 2 which are untocuhed i.e there is no +/- entry against them. Might this indicate an issue with the CPU or just that occasional errors are thrown up that have nothing to do with the CPU?

Edit: Am i better running with Aida64 for Corecycler? have been using the default prime95 and wonder if that might be the issue?

 

[Audioboxer]

I am doing a second round of CoreCycler and Prime95 has thrown an error on Core's 0 and 2 which are untocuhed i.e there is no +/- entry against them. Might this indicate an issue with the CPU or just that occasional errors are thrown up that have nothing to do with the CPU?

Edit: Am i better running with Aida64 for Corecycler? have been using the default prime95 and wonder if that might be the issue?

When you say untouched you mean with a 0 on the curve? Best way to confirm is to turn the curve completely off by setting it back to auto and test CoreCyler with those two cores. They shouldn't be crashing if no undervolting is going on.

As for over 5ghz, you're unlikely to see it in games. My HWINFO can show my best cores touching 5.05ghz, and I've even once seen a 5.1ghz, but when games are running it's mostly up to 4.9ghz, and even that's fleeting boosts. When multiple cores are going it's more in the range of 4.7~4.8. Heavy benchmarking on all cores drops it to 4.6~4.65.

Maybe if you're playing a really low spec 2D sidescroller or something, you might get some higher boosts because it's running on one or two cores more often.

 

[TheSoupladel]

When you say untouched you mean with a 0 on the curve? Best way to confirm is to turn the curve completely off by setting it back to auto and test CoreCyler with those two cores. They shouldn't be crashing if no undervolting is going on.

As for over 5ghz, you're unlikely to see it in games. My HWINFO can show my best cores touching 5.05ghz, and I've even once seen a 5.1ghz, but when games are running it's mostly up to 4.9ghz, and even that's fleeting boosts. When multiple cores are going it's more in the range of 4.7~4.8. Heavy benchmarking on all cores drops it to 4.6~4.65.

Maybe if you're playing a really low spec 2D sidescroller or something, you might get some higher boosts because it's running on one or two cores more often.

It wasnt a crash as in BSOD or a reboot, Corecycle threw up an error talking about a rounding error of some description, then restarted prime95 and kept on going.

Currently doing an iteration with Aida64 instead, i want to get to a position where i can get through a single iteration without error before i set it on a longer multiple iteration run.

 

[Audioboxer]

It wasnt a crash as in BSOD or a reboot, Corecycle threw up an error talking about a rounding error of some description, then restarted prime95 and kept on going.

Currently doing an iteration with Aida64 instead, i want to get to a position where i can get through a single iteration without error before i set it on a longer multiple iteration run.

Yeah that's an unstable core then. Can you turn off the core optimiser if you have it on and test again?

I run AIDA64 sometimes myself, it's not bad, but the issue with it is it's not quite as intensive as Prime95 or OCT and more importantly if it were to crash you have no idea what core is unstable if you're doing per-core undervolting.

OCCT recently introduced a per-core test https://www.ocbase.com/ I haven't tried it myself as I was fine using Corecycle, but it's maybe worth a go.

 

[TheSoupladel]

I think I might have a lemon of a chip, I stripped the setting back close to default and ran corecycler just for core 0 and 2 and both cores threw an error, I am giving it one more shot, this time completely at default, not even DOCP enabled to just rule that out but it looks like it might be going back.

The only thing I can think of is to re-seat the chip, repaste etc… and perhaps do a complete reset of CMOS as well

any other suggestions?

 

[TheSoupladel]

right, i have re-seated the chip, cleared cmos and repasted aaaaand i am still getting errors on core 0 and 2 with 100% stock settings, back it goes...

 

[Audioboxer]

right, i have re-seated the chip, cleared cmos and repasted aaaaand i am still getting errors on core 0 and 2 with 100% stock settings, back it goes...

Ok, before you do that, download OCCT (get the latest beta) and do this



Change threads to advanced and on the window that pops up deselect all the physical cores apart from 0 and 2. Then run the stability test.

CoreCyler is basically just a "fancy script" that sets up Prime95 in a way which tests things per core. But it still shouldn't be erroring on cores like that with default settings.

Still, to rule out there being some sort of issue with it, you should run another stability testing app which can do per-core testing.

 

[TheSoupladel]

Thank you, i will give this a go, but i am reasonably confidient it is faulty, specifically just poor quality silicon.

I have done some reading up on the error and there has been some suggestion it can actually be caused by other elements of the system such as RAM, however in such instances the error is intermittant and not always the same core. The instability can be overcome by putting a +value against the curve optimise for that core and to that end i have put +5 against 0 and +10 against 2 and so far i think it has solved the problem for those two cores.

However, i am not happy accepting a brand new £700 CPU that in effect requires overvolting in order to operate normally because so far it has added quite substantially to the thermals for that CCD and has negatively impacted on the performance as well, so i think RMA is the only option for me just now really.

 

[alec]

any other suggestions?

Increase LLC and see if it helps.

 

[TheSoupladel]

Increase LLC and see if it helps.

As above, i ahve had to put +10 against core 2 and +5 aginast core 0 and am running a full run of CoreCylcer/Prime95 to test the current set up but i should have to be overvolting a new CPU to get it to run correctly, especially given the already high voltage these Ryzen chips run with.

 

[Audioboxer]

Thank you, i will give this a go, but i am reasonably confidient it is faulty, specifically just poor quality silicon.

I have done some reading up on the error and there has been some suggestion it can actually be caused by other elements of the system such as RAM, however in such instances the error is intermittant and not always the same core. The instability can be overcome by putting a +value against the curve optimise for that core and to that end i have put +5 against 0 and +10 against 2 and so far i think it has solved the problem for those two cores.

However, i am not happy accepting a brand new £700 CPU that in effect requires overvolting in order to operate normally because so far it has added quite substantially to the thermals for that CCD and has negatively impacted on the performance as well, so i think RMA is the only option for me just now really.

All the silicon out of the factory should be running within spec, meaning, on auto and with no other funky BIOS settings interfering (for example, you should leave LLC on auto when using PBO) there should be zero stability issues.

When people say poor silicon, all they should really mean is "I can't undervolt/overclock as high as some other chips". Which is normal. Just the chip lottery. But all chips sold should be capable of doing what they are advertised to/sold as.

Given that CoreCycler is just one stability test, give a few more a go. But I won't lie, if I was in your position and ruled out user error or a buggy stability app, I too would probably look at returning that chip if its not stable on default/auto settings. That is obviously not acceptable.

Default your bios settings and test a few apps. It's worth noting unstable memory can actually also trip Prime95/CPU testing apps. Do make sure if you're overclocking your memory it is actually stable. For now I'd XMP your memory settings, or even underclock them, just to rule out memory interfering with stability whilst you test this CPU.

It goes without saying the other thing to make sure is your motherboard BIOS is up to date. AMD have put out a few dodgy BIOS updates over the past 12 months.

 

[alec]

As above, i ahve had to put +10 against core 2 and +5 aginast core 0 and am running a full run of CoreCylcer/Prime95 to test the current set up but i should have to be overvolting a new CPU to get it to run correctly, especially given the already high voltage these Ryzen chips run with.

I agree that you shouldn't need to use Curve Optimizer to overvolt on stock settings.
Load Line Calibration takes care of same issue in essence, although in a different way.
It is not that your cores need more voltage to run at set frequency. It is that they ask for a set voltage, but don't receive in time. Zen 3 is incredibly agressive in its boost, and I find even good motherboards struggle to keep up at default LLC setting.

5950x being the closest to silicon limits at stock is more likely to expose the issue.

 

[TheSoupladel]

Ok, before you do that, download OCCT (get the latest beta) and do this



Change threads to advanced and on the window that pops up deselect all the physical cores apart from 0 and 2. Then run the stability test.

CoreCyler is basically just a "fancy script" that sets up Prime95 in a way which tests things per core. But it still shouldn't be erroring on cores like that with default settings.

Still, to rule out there being some sort of issue with it, you should run another stability testing app which can do per-core testing.

I have OCCT running currently on all cores just for completness and as its the demo it will only last for an hour, but if it does come across an error i presume it will tell me there and then or does it wait until the test is complete to report any errors?

 

[Audioboxer]

I have OCCT running currently on all cores just for completness and as its the demo it will only last for an hour, but if it does come across an error i presume it will tell me there and then or does it wait until the test is complete to report any errors?

Will tell you if there is an error. 1 hour should be enough to hit either both cores at once, or 1 each for an hour at a time.

 

[TheSoupladel]

Will tell you if there is an error. 1 hour should be enough to hit either both cores at once, or 1 each for an hour at a time.

that

Well it ran for an hour and said nothing, i have already arranged an RMA so will se wgat comes of that, they are collecting it tomorrow and should hopefully have the replacement by the weekend, have gone back to my 3900x in the meantime

 

[Audioboxer]

that

Well it ran for an hour and said nothing, i have already arranged an RMA so will se wgat comes of that, they are collecting it tomorrow and should hopefully have the replacement by the weekend, have gone back to my 3900x in the meantime

Let us know how you get on. I ran CoreCyler again last night as I was wanting to get as many cores on -30 as possible to see if it could work. I had a drop on one but managed to sort it. So Prime95/the script at least seems to be working for me.

This is my HWINFO after a few hours now



One core managed to touch 5.1, but more importantly most around 5~5.05, or at least over the 4.9 AMD wants to claim the 5950x should be hitting.

Thats with PPT 270, TDC 160 and EDC 190.

Temps are still low 70s during gaming (intensive 3D games), but I'm just going to accept the 5950x runs hot and not stress over anything in the 70s during summer. Some stability testing can go into 80s.

 

[TheSoupladel]

Let us know how you get on. I ran CoreCyler again last night as I was wanting to get as many cores on -30 as possible to see if it could work. I had a drop on one but managed to sort it. So Prime95/the script at least seems to be working for me.

This is my HWINFO after a few hours now



One core managed to touch 5.1, but more importantly most around 5~5.05, or at least over the 4.9 AMD wants to claim the 5950x should be hitting.

Thats with PPT 270, TDC 160 and EDC 190.

Temps are still low 70s during gaming (intensive 3D games), but I'm just going to accept the 5950x runs hot and not stress over anything in the 70s during summer. Some stability testing can go into 80s.

i really hope they dont send me the same chip back because i wasn't getting anything anywhere near that, most of the time i was lucky if as many as two cores got a sniff of 5Ghz, in fact 4.9 seemed a stretch for most of them.

What cooler are you running?

 

[Audioboxer]

i really hope they dont send me the same chip back because i wasn't getting anything anywhere near that, most of the time i was lucky if as many as two cores got a sniff of 5Ghz, in fact 4.9 seemed a stretch for most of them.

What cooler are you running?

Corsair watercooling loop. Just a Corsair XC7. I've got two 360 rads and a 120. There is a 2080ti in the loop as well which dumps in a lot of heat.

So my 5950x does run quite toasty but as long as it stays under 80 in seems to be all good.

 

[TheSoupladel]

I had two corsair AIOs fail on my which is why i ended up n with the Noctua, if i ever went back to water it would have to be custom loop so i dont have to repace the whole thing if a pump fails etc...