5D mkiii or D800?

[Raymond Lin]

Whatever happen to all that palaver about "Please can they not put in video so it can be cheaper?"

I think if anything, (without wanting to stir the 5dii stuff up) it paved the way and took all the flack for it. As clearly it is a none issue now.

 

[D.P.]

Also a few points for the amazing 5D!

all these mega pixels are fantastic if the shot is in focus (sure its going to be most of the time) but the 5D is built to be almost completely reliable when it comes to doing your wedding shots.


I would pay the 2k price to have a camera bang every shot perfectly in focus! Nikon may have bundled in more MP but you know what two things I want from my next camera. Weather sealing in an affordable body (the Nikon flash ruins that)
I want AF that is truly outstanding which it is..

I think you'll find that composing a picture in the dark is hard on most cameras but on the 5D the live view is rated to see absolutely incredible when it comes to dark composing and even focusing!

I believe the Nikon bodies focus much better in he dark through liveview, but the Canon liveview implementation is better. I don't use liveview except for testing lenses calibration so I don't particularly care.

 

[D.P.]

Whatever happen to all that palaver about "Please can they not put in video so it can be cheaper?"

I think if anything, (without wanting to stir the 5dii stuff up) it paved the way and took all the flack for it. As clearly it is a none issue now.

I never said that, I have said and continue to not git 2 hots about video on my still camera. If I want video I will buy a dedicated video camera.


i was merely pointing out the fact that the D800 offers RAW video output, and I have read in quite a few places that this is making the D800 the camera of choice for production video through a DSLR.

Canon is quite clearly pushing for having dedicated 35mm EF-mount video cameras, these would seem like a far better choice for a videographer than any DSLR.

 

[Raymond Lin]

Or how about the numerous reports of 5dMKII compeltely failing relative to Nion bodies int eh sma econditions?
http://www.luminous-landscape.com/essays/antarctica-2009-worked.shtml



The same guy has several reports from earlier trips to Antarctica with the same findings, 1/4- 1/3 of all canon 5dMKIIs failing while no or very few Nikon bodies failing. And I have read similar reports all around the net over the years from safari workshops in South Africa, guided photo tours of Patagonia, Yellowstone photo guides, etc.

What about it? Lol

Where have I said the 5D, 1, 2 or 3 has weather sealing or at all? I was merely asking Rhys to be consistent in his posts if he were to pick holes in cameras and when being specific in one, at least be specific in the other.

People also forget something here.

For over a decade, Canon DSLR has 2 line of bodies.

A cropped and FF.

You obviously have alll the entry level with cropped as its cheaper to produce but even in the 1D, it always have had 2 lines side by side.

1Ds (studio) - FF
1D (1.3x)

It went on for 4 generations for the 1.3x. It wasn't until the 1Dx did they streamline the 2 together.

Under the 1 series you had the 5D and the 7D for the last 3-6 years with the mk1&2 for the 5D and 7D respectively. The 5D was designed and even market as a portrait camera and the 7D as a outdoor camera for wildlife and sports. It's built quality in weather sealing (I've said it now!) clearly reflect this.

Nikon on the other hand did not have such line up. They had 1 flagship and 1 under it. D3 and D700, the D3s came later on but they are all FF sensors. And they threw everything but the kitchen sink into these bodies rather than split them up.

It wasn't until the 5D3 they added the AF from the 1D, plus other bits from the 1D. It is clearly a change of strategy on their part, how much is it to do with Nikon's business model I have no idea as they sold both the 5D and 7D by the bucket load.

Anyway, the 1Dx and 5D3 is only the first incarnation of their new line up, a bit like when Nikon ditched the old Flagship D2N (or whatever the model number is) and moved the whole flagship/ top end model to FF. I'm not saying Canon isn't behind, clearly they are playing catch up in some areas, partly due to the split line up for a decade, but it will be interesting to see where they go from now on. They have the resource to pull it off if they want to, their budget for PR is probably bigger than Nikon's turnover.

P.s. Btw...giving all this credit to Nikon pushing sensor tech forward....shouldn't they give most of the credit to Sony? Whereas Canon design and build every part of their camera, including the sensor, Nikon buy theirs from Sony and tweak it. Although not really that important at the end of the day from a user point of view but I'd thought at least give credit where credit due?

 

[xaldub]

Have to agree with D.P - in my opinion the D800/E is in a different league to the 5DMk3 when it comes to sensor performance. Brand loyalty is a powerful force, and I can understand why some long-time Canon users are showing their frustations. People can have so much money invested into their camera systems that it's almost ( financially ) impossible to switch. To the OP though - if you have no existing ties to a certain brand then I would strongly recommend going down the Nikon route at this present moment in time. Buying a 5DMk3 would still be a good choice ... but not quite as much bang for your buck.

 

[An Exception]

You've heard? Says it all really.

I've heard that a water bottle tends to let water in fairly easily, stops working temporarily when the water loses its heat, but then comes back to life once refilled.

Utter hearsay nonsense!

Whatever dude...

I ended up using my Nikon D3x and the Leica S2 the most, primarily because I favored larger file sizes over high ISO noise performance. Most of my D3x images were shot at ISO 800 or under and the Leica S2 was shot at ISO 320 or 160. I did have to push it to 640 a few times, but I was more comfortable with the lower ISO values. I didn’t have a single mishap with any of my 3 cameras, however I did see a number of Canon 5DMk2 and 7D bodies give up the ghost.

http://www.theglobalphotographer.com/the-global-photographer/tag/antarctica

 

[Raymond Lin]

So that guy is comparing a Nikon D3s (flagship) against a lower tier Canon model?

 

[An Exception]

^^^
Please see the text that refers to 5Dii and 7D.
Lower end Nikon bodies (d300, d7000) similarly have an excellent track record as the Nikon flagships.

 

[Raymond Lin]

^^^
Please see the text that refers to 5Dii and 7D.
Lower end Nikon bodies (d300, d7000) similarly have an excellent track record as the Nikon flagships.

I saw that fine, hence lower tier. The fairer test would be the 1Dmk4 or the 1Dsmk3 don't you think?

Yes or no.

 

[An Exception]

I saw that fine, hence lower tier. The fair test would be the 1Dmk4 or the 1Dsmk3 don't you think?

Yes or no.

You could make it an unfair test if you like and compare a 1Dsomething to a D300, and the D300 would still probably be less likely to fail, just as the D700 or D3 is.

About 70% of the expedition members and instructors were shooting Canon, and some 30% were shooting with Nikons. Lots of D700's among the Nikon crowd. Of the Canon shooters a surprising 50%, a total of 26 people, had the new 5D MKII, while among the Nikon shooters there was just one D3x (other than the test sample I was carrying).
There were unfortunately a number of camera and lens failures. Weather was the culprit in some cases but salt spray and hard knocks in others.

In a summary session on the last day at the Peninsula I asked everyone to report on any equipment failures. Here's the tally.

The top LCD on a 5D MKII spontaneously cracked; Another 5D MKII had a jambed on lens caused by a loose screw, a 1Ds MKIII reported intermittent problems; a 1D MKIII kept reporting Error 99; one Hasselblad reported electronic lens connection problems; two Canon G9's failed (no G10s had any reported problems), and a Nikon 80-400mm lens came apart.

The largest group of failures through were among the Canon 5D MKIIs. Of the 26 samples of this camera onboard, one quarter (six) failed at one time or another, and while three recovered, the other three never did. In all cases it appeared to be water or humidity damage. Of particular concern were two cameras which stopped working while completely protected within Kata rain covers during a light rain ashore. They came back to life the following day though and were mostly fine for the rest of the trip, but one died permenently just before the end of our voyage.

No Nikon bodies (mostly D700s) failed in any way.

http://www.luminous-landscape.com/essays/antarctica-2009-worked.shtml

 

[Raymond Lin]

You should get into politics, can't even answer yes or no question.

My question mention nothing about D300 or D7000, nor here or in this thread.

It was a yes or no question between D3x and 1D.

 

[An Exception]

I guess you don't realise that what I posted wasn't a test but a real world testimony from a photographer. With particular info relating to the reliability of the 5Dii and 7D. Therefore it did not require a yes or no answer to your question.

If you were asking me hypothetically, then yes, a fair test is much more preferable, but I thought that would go without saying?

 

[Raymond Lin]

I am still waiting for a yes or no answer from the original question...

 

[An Exception]

yes or no

 

[D.P.]

What about it? Lol

Where have I said the 5D, 1, 2 or 3 has weather sealing or at all? I was merely asking Rhys to be consistent in his posts if he were to pick holes in cameras and when being specific in one, at least be specific in the other.

People also forget something here.

For over a decade, Canon DSLR has 2 line of bodies.

A cropped and FF.

You obviously have alll the entry level with cropped as its cheaper to produce but even in the 1D, it always have had 2 lines side by side.

1Ds (studio) - FF
1D (1.3x)

It went on for 4 generations for the 1.3x. It wasn't until the 1Dx did they streamline the 2 together.

Under the 1 series you had the 5D and the 7D for the last 3-6 years with the mk1&2 for the 5D and 7D respectively. The 5D was designed and even market as a portrait camera and the 7D as a outdoor camera for wildlife and sports. It's built quality in weather sealing (I've said it now!) clearly reflect this.

Nikon on the other hand did not have such line up. They had 1 flagship and 1 under it. D3 and D700, the D3s came later on but they are all FF sensors. And they threw everything but the kitchen sink into these bodies rather than split them up.

It wasn't until the 5D3 they added the AF from the 1D, plus other bits from the 1D. It is clearly a change of strategy on their part, how much is it to do with Nikon's business model I have no idea as they sold both the 5D and 7D by the bucket load.

Anyway, the 1Dx and 5D3 is only the first incarnation of their new line up, a bit like when Nikon ditched the old Flagship D2N (or whatever the model number is) and moved the whole flagship/ top end model to FF. I'm not saying Canon isn't behind, clearly they are playing catch up in some areas, partly due to the split line up for a decade, but it will be interesting to see where they go from now on. They have the resource to pull it off if they want to, their budget for PR is probably bigger than Nikon's turnover.

P.s. Btw...giving all this credit to Nikon pushing sensor tech forward....shouldn't they give most of the credit to Sony? Whereas Canon design and build every part of their camera, including the sensor, Nikon buy theirs from Sony and tweak it. Although not really that important at the end of the day from a user point of view but I'd thought at least give credit where credit due?

I completely agree that there has been a large shift in Nikon's camera lines int he last 5 years. WRT to Nikon-Sony sensor, it is a partnership for which Nikon shares R&D work so it is very unclear what parts of the sensor design Nikon helped develop. It is also clear that Nikon engineers can improve sensor read out, e.g. the D3x has 1 stop more high ISO noise performance than the Sony version in the A900. It also isn't clar at all if Sony will release a camera with the 36MP sensor. maybe SOn cannot get sufficient performance without the Nikon tweaks which Nikon wont share, meaning Sony will have to opt for a lower res sensor to account for lower quantum efficiency (or maybe Sony do something like go for a 48Mp camera, who knows).

Furthermore, the sensor in the D3/D700, D3s and D4 is 100% Nikon in house and shows their ability to produce high end sensors - nothing comes close to the D3s high ISO performance (lets see how the 1Dx and the D4 compare).

Nikon also completely designed the D3100 sensor, although this crop sensor is not as good as the D5100/D700 Nikon tweak Sony exmor, it more than holds its own against the canon crops to date.

It also really doesn't matter if the sensor capability was 100% down to Sony, Nikon decided to partner and use Sony technology to provide Nikon users with the best sensors money can buy. This was part of a 2 pronged attack in the D2 era when Nikon were clearly behind Canon - they completely revamped sensor technologies both in-house and with a Sony partnership. Sony does indeed deserve a huge amount of praise but this has nothing to do with comparing a D800 against a 5DMKIII. Are you not going to buy a D800 because the sensor is Sony made? You evaluate the camera based on what it offers for the price (and you also have to evaluate the whole system including lenses).

 

[D.P.]

I saw that fine, hence lower tier. The fairer test would be the 1Dmk4 or the 1Dsmk3 don't you think?

Yes or no.

or 7D/5dMKII vs D300/D7k/D700

Canon 1D may be just as well built as Nikon pro series, that is not the debate. The point is that even prosumer Nikon bodies offer good build quality and weather proofing, which is very well known.

 

[jonneymendoza]

If you were starting a kit from scratch which one would you go for and why?


I've currently got an nex5n with a few Sony lenses ,a few cheap older lenses and an adaptor ,I'm toying with the idea of selling this setup and buying either a 5d3 or d800 later this year.

I just can't decide which way to go, Each has it's own pros and cons and both really appeal to me, so if you were in my position which way would YOU go?

get the 5d3.

its a fantastic all round camera and the lens on canon are better then nikon apparently

 

[Alpherah]

the lens on canon are better then nikon apparently

If this is true, then the difference is smaller then that between the D800 and 5D III.

So with that in mind, my vote would go to D800, unless you really need a slightly faster burst rate.

Why? why wouldn't you when going from scratch? better IQ, equally as reliable AF (now the issue with the outer left has been fixed), amazing video features that (and i don't pretend to know first hand because I never cared for video) are 'better' then those offered in the 5D III although the difference in truth is probably minute.

Going back to the lenses - with Canon playing silly's with their 24-70 2.8 pricing, surely its a non contest?

-edit-
Should add, have no interest in getting into fanboy wars, i just feel that looking at the spec's the D800 is overall the better camera, and if starting from scratch why not go for the best? don't get me wrong, i wouldn't cry if someone gave me a 5D III though!

 

[Energize]

get the 5d3.

its a fantastic all round camera and the lens on canon are better then nikon apparently

I've been told the opposite. Certainly my experience with lenses are that the Nikon are greatly superior to the Canon equivalent models. Like the 50mm F/1.8 which I use a lot.

 

[Tachyon]

To the OP. Good question that got me thinking a bit. I've been shooting Canon for the last 10 years maybe and if I'm being honest I can't even really remember why I went down the Canon road but I remember at the time it was a toss up between a Canon G3 and a Nikon 4500. Have I regretted my choice of brand over the years? Not for a second. Thing is if I had chosen Nikon I probably wouldn't have regretted it for a second either. The only thing up to now that has ever made me glad I had a Canon over Nikon was because of the MPE-65, that's it, nothing else and I have seen stunning macros from Nikon lenses as well so it's kind of a moot point.

I recently got a 5D3 and honestly, I'm over the moon with it. I think I got it at a fairly good price and I'm not the sort of person who has to have the next best thing but I like to buy as good as I can at the time of purchase as I hold on to my gear for years, not until the next model comes out. For someone earlier to say the 5D3 is a crock of ****, ignore them, honestly I think it was a very unusual statement, I haven't even seen a review that comes close to making a statement like that.

Anyway, what would I choose now? Not 100% but possibly Nikon if I was starting off and it was a choice between the 5D3 and D800. From what I've read the sensor is superb, a real gem with excellent dynamic range. It seems to be priced better as well, I would say the 5D3 is overpriced compared to the D800. Regardless, see what lenses might suit you and accessories etc.. you'd like, price them, handle the cameras. The thing is, no matter which brand you choose you will be able to take first class images, both brands offer what is needed to do this, the main item of course is your talent as a photographer.

I love to read reviews etc.. before I make a purchase, it's part of the buying experience for me. Do that as well while you save up, I find it enjoyable. I'll also say take on board useful advice folks have to give but see all this brand bickering, unless your someone with very specific needs then for the most part don't worry too much about it, make your purchase and enjoy it because you'll have a great camera. After you've done that & your happy with your camera, don't give a flying **** what everyone else is using, lol.