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6870 is here! for £170, WTF?? HELP!!

kylew said:
I've known people who have called themselves "IT Technicians" who though an 8500GT was top of the range, and the 512MB of RAM it had meant it was "really fast". They also thought 1024x768 was high res.
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Reminds me of old friend of mine which opened a PC shop few years ago, he used to think that 3850 was a top end card ( at the times where we all had 4870s and 4890s and GTX 270/280 was already released ) because it plays all games great - forgetting the fact that he played on 17" monitor with 1024x768 res and without stuff maxed out but obviously he didn't know that it makes any difference.

I'm wondering if the business is still up and running...

Funny thing is that I still see people go to ( a week ago even ) ****** (ah forgot 'competitor' - well known store with mainly tools and electric stuff rather than any pc hardware ) and pay 150quid for 9500GT. I don't think anyone would be hurt in any way if he's got 6870 for 200.
 
Hey all!
I'm an average Joe that has had his 4850 for a good few years now and have decided to have an upgrade. I've not kept up with gfx card technology since buying my last card, so was curious about the current cards.

Anyway, to get on to my point - I was initially a tad confused about ATI cards, but not for the reasons people state in this thread. The reason I was confused is because there were seemingly so many different cards, and every time I researched one I got conflicting views on where they fit into the range - is a 5770 better or worse than a 5830?????? I still have no idea!
Anyhow, I then noticed this new 6870 was released at a bargain price, and after 10 mins I knew it was actually (not unexpectedly considering the price) a slight downgrade from the 5870. A tad more research taught me the reason why, and the fact that ATI are trying to differentiate their respective cards positions in their range - this is something I totally approve off, though they really should have chosen a totally new numbering structure, but it's not difficult to understand.
 
t@xman said:
Anyway, to get on to my point - I was initially a tad confused about ATI cards, but not for the reasons people state in this thread. The reason I was confused is because there were seemingly so many different cards, and every time I researched one I got conflicting views on where they fit into the range - is a 5770 better or worse than a 5830?????? I still have no idea!
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For a quick glance at how things fall, take a look at this graphics card ranking list which, imo, is accurate:

http://www.overclock.net/graphics-cards-general/502403-graphics-card-ranking-5th-time-last.html

The 5830 is a touch better than the 5770, but pretty much no one bought it as it was overpriced and didn't offer a big enough performance increase over the much cheaper 5770. The new 68xx cards have corrected ATI's mid-range market and has pretty much put them into the market leaders. Whereas before, people were buying the GTX 460 in their droves, the mid-range market is now much more competitive.
 
kylew said:
Sly, really? You work for a reasonably large computer store, and you think this is sly? :confused: Surely you've got a bit of experience with naming schemes, and what happens when a company wants to change its naming scheme.

A 6870 at £300+ = sly, 6870 at £170 = blatantly not a 5870 upgrade. Come on, it's half the price of it pretty much. Same goes for the 6850, it's pretty close to half the price of the 5850, yet you call it sly? What about the single GPU 6900s, is that sly too? How would you propose them to implement a change in their naming scheme?

If you think about it, now is a good time as any for them to restructure their naming scheme (as they've chosen to) with them dropping "ATi" and branding their graphics cards as AMD Radeons.
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Someone has definatly got egg on their face.

I am stating that the majority of people will assume that a 6870 is superior to a 5870 and whilst also cheaper which makes it a very good deal to the unwise.

a lot of people do not either look/research at what they are buying, they check title and price. I am saying that the naming will cause confusion, until the 6900 series are released.

And yes surely I do have experience with naming schemes. But what has that got to do with the price of fish?

They didn't really reconstruct it at all, just changed the 5 to a 6. Which is pretty much what they do every year/refresh.

Do not quote and reply back to me with moaning drivel.
 
It is a good time to start the naming convention again yes, But why not start with totally new number scheme ?

Unless you know that you could get a few more sales by clouding the matter ?

(They are a company trying to make money, not a charity at the end of the day)
 
Stanners said:
It is a good time to start the naming convention again yes, But why not start with totally new number scheme ?

Unless you know that you could get a few more sales by clouding the matter ?

(They are a company trying to make money, not a charity at the end of the day)
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I agree, I think AMD like the added "clouding" matter to get a few more sales in. Not a very friendly practise but business is business.
 
NathWraith said:
Someone has definatly got egg on their face.
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I must have, because you say so...

I am stating that the majority of people will assume that a 6870 is superior to a 5870 and whilst also cheaper which makes it a very good deal to the unwise.
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Are we talking about "Average Joe" again? "Average Joe" only buys pre-built PCs, and generally keeps them for longer than they should. That is most people. So yes, most people don't read reviews on graphics cards, but they also don't buy them. Add to that the fact that stores like the Purple Shirts often don't even stock 5870 priced cards, the likelyhood of "Average Joe" who wants to upgrade his 5870, buying a 6870 thinking it's faster is extremely slim.

a lot of people do not either look/research at what they are buying, they check title and price. I am saying that the naming will cause confusion, until the 6900 series are released.
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Define "a lot", and also "a lot" of people aren't in to buying graphics cards. In the grand scheme of consumer products, it's a niche market. Any one who has bought a 5870 for them selves and installed it in their own PC, is going to read reviews of graphics cards and be relatively "in to" PC gaming. As for the confusion, all these people that don't research or look at what they're buying (when spending hundreds of pounds), what's to say they have, or even know what a 5870 is? If for some reason "Average Joe" is looking at decent graphics cards and comes across a 6870 as that's his budget, he won't have a 5870 anyway.

The "a lot" of people you're talking about simply don't exist.

And yes surely I do have experience with naming schemes. But what has that got to do with the price of fish?
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I'm guessing this was is a joke, as you surely see the connection here.

They didn't really reconstruct it at all, just changed the 5 to a 6. Which is pretty much what they do every year/refresh.
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What? :confused: They didn't reconstruct what? It's a completely different GPU at a completely different price point, of course it's down to restructuring. Upgrades come at the same price point (give or take say 5%), not bordering on half the price of the previous *item*. Come on, it's like saying some one who owns a £40,000 car, thinks a new car that's come out at £25,000 is an upgrade because it's got a higher number on it.

Do not quote and reply back to me with moaning drivel.
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:confused: is that some sort of order?
 
This whole debate puts me in mind of a saying:
A fool and his money are easily parted.
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Say what you like about the AMD naming changes, and I don't agree with them myself, they are trivial compared to the marketing tricks played by other companies all the time. Intel are particularly notorious for seemingly random naming schemes but producers of everything from Vacuum Cleaners to Cameras to Ready Meals have been guilty of similar crimes.

Any consumer who spends £150+ on something technical without at least some research is gambling on blind luck. This is particularly inexcusable in the GPU market, if you know enough to install a GPU you sure as hell should be able to google a benchmark.
 
ATI could have just replaced both the 5850 and 5870 with the new cards and said nothing if the plan was to make as much money from the early buyers.

I can only think ATI have 6700's cards planned and the 6950 and 6970 have some type of features or performance to set the cards apart from the 6800 range. It would have been simpler for everyone to understand if ATI held the release of the 6800 series cards until the complete 6000 range was ready, but like people say its a business and the cards are well overdue as it is.

The main thing as easyrider said, is the cards are very high performance midrange models.
 
I do not see what the issue is, its not like they have priced it as a rival to the 5870, its a new product and it is not as if anything <majorly> cynical has gone on.

I see it this way; if someone hasnt got the brains to actually check the card they are buying, then they very likley dont need the power in the first place. Given the card is priced fairly, they are probably doing the crowd with more money than sense a favour.
 
I've already had 3 people ask me why the 6870 is cheaper than the 5870... so yes it is causing confusion - atleast they had the sense to ask before buying tho.

AMD really should have named them better or gone for a whole new name scheme.
 
Rroff said:
I've already had 3 people ask me why the 6870 is cheaper than the 5870... so yes it is causing confusion - atleast they had the sense to ask before buying tho.

AMD really should have named them better or gone for a whole new name scheme.
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That's the point though, they are asking.
 
Rroff said:
I've already had 3 people ask me why the 6870 is cheaper than the 5870... so yes it is causing confusion - atleast they had the sense to ask before buying tho.

AMD really should have named them better or gone for a whole new name scheme.
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Really???? I seriously doubt I know 3 people that'd know what a gfx card is, let alone wish to change one, let alone happen across the 6850/70 being released, let alone ask or notice about the pricing!!!!!

You must have some particularly geeky mates, and if so then I'm surprised they haven't the gumption to google "6870 review" and see for themselves!
 
t@xman said:
Really???? I seriously doubt I know 3 people that'd know what a gfx card is, let alone wish to change one, let alone happen across the 6850/70 being released, let alone ask or notice about the pricing!!!!!

You must have some particularly geeky mates, and if so then I'm surprised they haven't the gumption to google "6870 review" and see for themselves!
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To be fair, I can think of more than three of my own friends who are in to all that.
 
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