Advice Required - Resignation/Reference

[wndsr]

Afternoon

I was hoping to get some advice from people on here regarding an issue I have been having at work for a number of weeks, which has ultimately led to me being without a job. Forgive the length of the post, I just wanted to try and cover the main points.

On 9th September I was invited to a meeting with my line manager and his manager to discuss 'fraudulent hotel bookings' and also posting 'inappropriate comments on Twitter'. They alleged that I had booked corporate rate hotels without approval and as a result I was suspended for alleged Fraud. No mention of the 'inappropriate tweets' was mentioned in my suspension letter.

So two weeks go by and I am invited to an 'investigation meeting' on 19th September where we go through the hotel bookings line by line. I explain none of them were booked fraudulently as I was on work business at the time of the booking. What I did fail to do however, was follow the internal policy with regards to booking them. I must point out that at no point had I been briefed on the correct policy and method of approval and we established in that meeting that travel recently undertaken with my line manager was also booked incorrectly according to policy.

In the meeting I apologised profusely for my mistakes and continued to argue the use of the word Fraud is unnecessary as it's a simple case of not being aware of policy. I offered to reimburse the company immediately if that is what they were seeking. At the end of this meeting I was not given the opportunity to read and sign the notes they made which according to the disciplinary policy they gave me, I should have been able to do.

I was then verbally asked if I was able to attend a disciplinary hearing on 2nd October, to which I explained I would only be able to attend if my nominated representative was able too also.

I continued to call the office daily, as required to do so under the terms of my suspension. I explained to my manager that my nominated representative was unavailable on the date chosen so he advised they would be looking to book an alternative hearing week commencing 7th October. At no point was I given a formal written invitation to any meeting, it was simply an informal verbal discussion about my availability.

After taking advice from the Union and colleagues who had experience in this field, I felt like the result of the disciplinary hearing would be dismissal. Also given the reluctance of the company to stop classing it as 'Fraud' I felt like I didn't have a leg to stand on.

As a result, on 25th September I rang my manager on the phone to advise him of my intention to resign on the basis that my resignation serves as immediate closure to all allegations against me and the company agrees to provide me with a positive reference. I also offered to reimburse the company if required. He agreed to go away and liaise with HR and get back to me with some answers.

I continued to phone in at 9:30 every day as per the terms of my suspension. It was only four days after when he advised me there was no need to keep calling in. At the time I thought nothing of it and agreed.

Last week I received a letter from the company stating that they had accepted my immediate resignation on 25th September and that any reference will say I resigned pending a disciplinary hearing. I stress again, I did not offer my immediate resignation on that date, I simply shared my intention to resign on the basis that we come to an agreement. If I had resigned and they accepted on the 25th as they claim, why would I still continue to 'check in' each day and why would they continue to speak to me?

All in all this a huge headache for me. As if the prospect of having no income is bad enough, having the extra headache of a poor reference from my previous employer makes things even harder. As you can imagine it's been a crap four weeks and I've been really quite down about it all. I have already spoke to an employment lawyer who reckons I would have a good chance if he was to take the case on.

Would be interested to hear from other forum members who may have had a similar experience or know about this type of stuff.

Thanks in advance.

 

[Gilly]

How big is your company? You mention the union, are you an actual union member?

 

[wndsr]

It's a very large bank... About 130,000 employees. I joined the Union at the start of this drama and as a result they were only able to offer limited to advice. A contact of mine is a Union rep and advised me off the record.

 

[Firestar_3x]

IMHO, your offer to refund the money out of your own pocket is an admission of guilt, not following the policy aside, i wouldn't have been offering to refund anything!

I wouldn't have resigned, i would have waited to be sacked, then taken my case up via a tribuneral, provided you can prove you hadn't been given training in the correct procedure.

 

[wndsr]

IMHO, your offer to refund the money out of your own pocket is an admission of guilt, not following the policy aside, i wouldn't have been offering to refund anything!

I wouldn't have resigned, i would have waited to be sacked, then taken my case up via a tribuneral, provided you can prove you hadn't been given training in the correct procedure.

I see your point. I guess I just wanted all this to go away and was prepared to do anything to ideally keep my job, or alternatively find a new job with a good reference.

 

[Ascendancy]

Can they prove you resigned?

 

[Pestilence]

Seems like you handed them all the cards, and they duly played them.

Mind you, if they have nothing written, dated, and signed from you in terms of resignation then you didn't resign. Walk right back in there if you feel you need to fight this out.

 

[wndsr]

I would say no, they would say they can't. They are claiming I tendered my immediate resignation over the phone which my manager accepted there and then.

What actually happened was I told him I would be resigning IF we came to an agreement regarding the reference. I continued to call in daily as if I were still suspended and he continued to speak to me, so no idea how they can claim he accepted my resignation?

 

[antijoke]

You say it's a bank, are all your calls recorded?

Would you be able to request a copy of the call recording for when you phoned about your resignation and also when they told you not to phone any more.

 

[tom_e]

Everything else aside as soon as someone resigns when they've got a disciplinary in progress that just screams of guilt.
If you've done nothing wrong then don't back down.

 

[wndsr]

You say it's a bank, are all your calls recorded?

Would you be able to request a copy of the call recording for when you phoned about your resignation and also when they told you not to phone any more.

Calls are recorded yes, I didn't think of this. I will ask about this.

Everything else aside as soon as someone resigns when they've got a disciplinary in progress that just screams of guilt.
If you've done nothing wrong then don't back down.

I see your point entirely and maybe in hindsight I only saw two options. (a) Come to an agreement with them with regards to exchanging my resignation in return for closure and a reference (b) facing the disciplinary and probably face the sack.

Maybe I should have done more research before getting here, but that's hindsight I guess.

 

[ubersonic]

I have already spoke to an employment lawyer who reckons I would have a good chance if he was to take the case on.

Ask him to take it on no win no fee and see what he really thinks.

Actually on second thought: http://www.bettercallsaul.com/

 

[Westyfield2]

I'd recommend a specialist employment lawyer.

 

[Pestilence]

I would say no, they would say they can't. They are claiming I tendered my immediate resignation over the phone which my manager accepted there and then.

What actually happened was I told him I would be resigning IF we came to an agreement regarding the reference. I continued to call in daily as if I were still suspended and he continued to speak to me, so no idea how they can claim he accepted my resignation?

You've left it a bit long in between reacting to things, really, but if you want to continue this then you need to immediately do the following:

1. Call them and advise that you did NOT tender resignation verbally on the phone, but queried the possibility of doing so in exchange for a positive reference going forward. They have not offered this, so you are not offering your resignation.

2. If they dispute the above, request a recording of the call. Stress the fact that, if they state they have no recording so cannot provide you with one, they also cannot prove that you resigned and you will therefore be compelled to begin legal proceedings with a view to prosecuting them for constructive dismissal.

3. Once (if) reinstated, get back in to complete your disciplinary hearing(s), and during this time query, on record and with a witness, whether your line manager is also undergoing similar proceedings and accusation of fraud for the mis-booking made when you were travelling together. If not, why not. This must all be recorded in notes/minutes and provided to you at the end of the hearing.

Your actions so far have been screaming admission of guilt, which isn't good for you, however they aren't exactly playing by the book either.

What exactly has gone on here? Don't you have back office workers who book your travel and hotels for you? Have you been personally booking hotels under the company name/corporate rate when not travelling for a legitimate business reason?

 

[gandhi]

Constructive dismissal

Constructive dismissal is when you’re forced to leave your job against your will because of your employer’s conduct.

The reasons you leave your job must be serious, for example, they:

don’t pay you or suddenly demote you for no reason
force you to accept unreasonable changes to how you work - eg tell you to work night shifts when your contract is only for day work
let other employees harass or bully you

Your employer’s breach of contract may be one serious incident or a series of incidents that are serious when taken together.

You should try and sort any issues out by speaking to your employer to solve the dispute.

If you do have a case for constructive dismissal, you should leave your job immediately - your employer may argue that, by staying, you accepted the conduct or treatment.

Being disciplined for not following policy you have not been trained or signed off on is a good example of the above. Especially being accused of fraud with it as that then implies the involvement of law enforcement agencies as I believe there is a duty to inform.

Unless of course the policy relating to hotel bookings was in the staff handbook or on an email somewhere that you signed off as having understood?

Really, if all the above is true and there are no salient facts missing, this an outrageous abuse of authority/procedures.

Talking to ACAS might be useful as would an employment lawyer as mentioned above.

Do not take this lying down if you have done nothing wrong!

 

[atpbx]

Looks like they got you on this one.

Your first response to the questioning about the hotel bookings was to ask for a copy of the policy/training document you signed to say you had been made aware of the policy regarding this matter.

As above, I would be contacting a specialist, you probably have a decent chance of a constructive dismissal case if the facts have been represented accurately.

 

[Camalot]

As far as I can tell you have not resigned.

Contact hr yourself? The letter will have a number or an address to write to.

Ask hr if you booked a hotel the same way with your manager why isn't he in the same boat?

Don't back down from this.

 

[wndsr]

You've left it a bit long in between reacting to things, really, but if you want to continue this then you need to immediately do the following:

1. Call them and advise that you did NOT tender resignation verbally on the phone, but queried the possibility of doing so in exchange for a positive reference going forward. They have not offered this, so you are not offering your resignation.

2. If they dispute the above, request a recording of the call. Stress the fact that, if they state they have no recording so cannot provide you with one, they also cannot prove that you resigned and you will therefore be compelled to begin legal proceedings with a view to prosecuting them for constructive dismissal.

3. Once (if) reinstated, get back in to complete your disciplinary hearing(s), and during this time query, on record and with a witness, whether your line manager is also undergoing similar proceedings and accusation of fraud for the mis-booking made when you were travelling together. If not, why not. This must all be recorded in notes/minutes and provided to you at the end of the hearing.

Your actions so far have been screaming admission of guilt, which isn't good for you, however they aren't exactly playing by the book either.

What exactly has gone on here? Don't you have back office workers who book your travel and hotels for you? Have you been personally booking hotels under the company name/corporate rate when not travelling for a legitimate business reason?

Thanks for the response and appreciate it how it looks. As I said, this whole situation is new to me and I thought resigning would be doing the right thing.

I contacted them yesterday after an employment lawyer drafted an email for me to send. They today replied and said they have not changed their position.

I have booked the hotels for work related travel - they have not been just 'jollies at the weekend' or anything like that. At no point did I have any intention of gaining anything - if anything I was on business with the company that would have meant it was impossible for me to get home.

Being disciplined for not following policy you have not been trained or signed off on is a good example of the above. Especially being accused of fraud with it as that then implies the involvement of law enforcement agencies as I believe there is a duty to inform.

Unless of course the policy relating to hotel bookings was in the staff handbook or on an email somewhere that you signed off as having understood?

Really, if all the above is true and there are no salient facts missing, this an outrageous abuse of authority/procedures.

Talking to ACAS might be useful as would an employment lawyer as mentioned above.

Do not take this lying down if you have done nothing wrong!

I do not recall ever being given a travel policy or have my manager take time to discuss it with me. My role involved a lot of travel so would have expected them to have took the time to share this with me.

 

[WillyNelson]

Constructive dismissal

To be honest, that was my first thought. Go seek some professional, qualified legal advice.

 

[Pestilence]

I have booked the hotels for work related travel - they have not been just 'jollies at the weekend' or anything like that. At no point did I have any intention of gaining anything - if anything I was on business with the company that would have meant it was impossible for me to get home.

Can you give an example?

I'm finding it difficult to grasp why, if your role involved a lot of travel, this wasn't taken care of for you (in terms of hotel bookings, flights etc.) by secretarial staff.

Were you left stranded by work in a foreign country with no return flight booked, and were thus forced to walk into a hotel and book a stay? Do you have a policy in place for situations like that were you pay and claim reimbursement? It's a little hard to work out why any situation(s) involving legitimate business needs could lead to something of these proportions.

I could see a situation, for example, where you were on the other side of the country with a group of co-workers for the day, and they decided to hit the town on Friday night. You decided to join them, and being too far away from home would require a hotel. So you book one. On the company. This would be a mistake as it hasn't been approved, otherwise one would have already been arranged. However, in that situation I would also expect return travel to have been arranged prior by the company for the end of your trip. So, in this situation you would have had to had abandoned your arranged return travel in order to claim a hotel stay to go out on the lash... all on the excuse that if it weren't for the company, you wouldn't have been there.

I hope I'm a million miles away from the truth.