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AMD Bulldozer Finally!

Perhaps he's just mistaken.
Who knows.
gareth170 said:
basicly these chips are waste of time as they are now, they have 2 extra cores but they not giving any extra performance....
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In many cases it's actually worse performance.
AMD's got to be trolling.

Despite what anyone says about what constitutes a core, etc etc, the FX4100, at 90 odd quid, with its performance in this day and age is absolutely shocking.
 
Only thing I can think of (aside from some difference with his setups) is some kind of performance throttling kicking in, given that it's a worse binned chip the 8120 probably hits the threshold earlier.
 
It just confirms that Bulldozer as it is is held back by Windows. It doesnt change things though. It is still a big chip that is unable to compete. AMD should have resolved this issue before launching the processor.
 
the windows scheduling wouldn't affect single threaded performance must or if any., which it perform poorly in anyway, also windows 8 preview as the "so called" fixed windows scheduling afew review sites as shown it only boost performance slightly in some heavy multi threaded apps
 
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gareth170 said:
the windows scheduling wouldn't affect single threaded performance must or if any., which it perform poorly in anyway, also windows 8 preview as the "so called" fixed windows scheduling afew review sites as shown it only boost performance slightly in some heavy multi threaded apps
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Exactly.

I can't fathom why anyone would consider it.
 
I agree! That is primarily why I'm waiting on the SB-e. I don't use Windows to start with! I'm not interested in single threaded applications! I'm really after the next cheapest 6 core offering from Intel.

I'm not a fan boy, but really disappointed that AMD isn't exerting some pressure on Intel, Intel prices will run wild and rampant over the next year I think!
 
It's quite scary to think here AMD are fumbling around and getting spanked by Intel's 4 core whilst Intel already have a 6 core waiting in the wings, unless BD's successor is about 60% faster overall with considerable IPC improvements then it's going to be beaten by 6 core SB which presumably by then will be more affordable.
 
Trunks9486 said:
AMD should have resolved this issue before launching the processor.
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And reduced their sales/profits?
No way.

AMD had to release this baby asap and start making sales. They are not a charitable or government backed organisation. They live and die by their sales.
 
sunama said:
AMD had to release this baby asap and start making sales. They are not a charitable or government backed organisation. They live and die by their sales.
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I'd love to see the figures for predicted and actual sales of BD... All the advertising hype in the world can't compensate for the fact they're selling a very specialist product to a technically informed customer base. Only chance they have of shifting this doorstop is with OEM system builders, and just possibly to render farms.

Meantime the vast majority those of us who waited oh so patiently have hopped to the blue camp. Fortunately AMD have plenty of other things to keep them ticking over while they fix things for 2013...
 
First off, the enthusiast market and people who are well informed form an extremely small percentage of the computer buying public.

Most of the time, potential buyers will pop into a shop and ask for the advice of a salesman. If the salesman wants to push a brand spanking new, 8 core amd cpu based machine, then he can do with ease.

A lot of people on this board seems to be under the assumption that the majority of the population know about BD or even care. The truth is, they don't. The CPU "nerds", which is what we are, form an extremely small percentage of the CPU buyers.

OEM is where it is at. This is where volume sales come in. If HP or DELL can be convinced to use BD, then this will help BD sales no end. I've heard that Cray has ordered 38000 of these CPUs, so that's a decent sale right there.

Price is the most important factor. Yes, BD is weak, but if it is priced correctly, given the right sales speech, it can sell.

Let me put it another way, if I worked at the purple shirt computer shop, I would find it much easier to sell a PC based on FX8150 than a PC based on the 2500k (assuming prices are similar).
 
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While I agree that the OEM market is massive, I can't find evidence that Dell, HP, or similar are using BD. Far as I can see, Dell puts Intel labels all over their site and restricts AMD to "everyday computing" down at the budget end of the scale. HP seem to have one PC with an AMD hex, and one with an Athlon x2 (admittedly I only had a 2 minute look just now :P)

And then, BD isn't the easiest to work with. The OEM builder has to supply a bigger PSU, better cooling, and pump up the price by a significant amount. Then there's that even Average Joe has heard of Intel (bom bom bom BOM!). There's a strong brand there, and people trust it. AMD is much less well known, to many people they're that weird "other CPU manufacturer."

Least, that was my reasoning as to why I think the BD market is mostly to specialists and enthusiasts. I could be quite wrong :)
 
Of course Intel is the daddy of CPU market.
I think they have 70-80% of the market (my memory fails me).

But, what AMD must hope for is to make some money out of BD. They have spent huge sums of money on this CPU and not releasing it, would be a very poor business decision and the man who makes that decision would almost certainly be out of a job, soon after.

I understand that AMD fanboys are disappointed, however, that doesn't mean that AMD should hurt their business. If their CPU can sell (and they will), why should AMD prevent/stop sales? It makes no sense to me.

In business, if you have a product available for sale and you have a queue of customers who want to buy the product....you sell it. Even if it isn't a great product.

Even Apple, which is one of the most profitable electronics companies in the World right now, sells products which are not class leading and are vastly over-priced. It doesn't mean that they should stop selling it. [I havent seen anyone suggest that Apple stop selling the ipad or imac, yet AMD release a product which is average and people are suggesting that the product should not be sold?] As long as they have people willing to buy the product, sell as much of it as you can. This is a golden rule.
 
I don't see why any OEM would want to adopt BD unless they want to splash "8 cores" around as if it really means something, if I were an OEM I'd choose 2500/2600 every time (they even have onboard graphics which most OEM's love).

A business will generally always try to make money out of a turd though, even if BD doesn't sell very well some sales are preferable to none.
 
It will be interesting to see what their performance figures financially will turn out.

Apparently Llano cpus have gave them a $96M profit already.
 
Of course I understand that AMD have to make the effort to sell BD... I just remain unconvinced that they will manage to. The entire business plan at current prices would have to be based on lies (i.e. that it's a step forward and better than their competitors) and that sort of thing doesn't get you a lot of repeat business.

LeJosh said:
Apparently Llano cpus have gave them a $96M profit already.
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That I would believe - for it's niche, Llano is a lovely product and would likely be the basis for any media pcs I might build :)
 
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eddiew said:
The entire business plan at current prices would have to be based on lies (i.e. that it's a step forward and better than their competitors)
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Nope.

No lies needed.

Check out OCUK's amd page:
http://www.overclockers.co.uk/LP/amd_bulldozer_fx.php

There is a lot of marketing schpiel on that page and it reads a way which would convince anybody who isn't a computer nerd (ie. 99% of the population) to buy AMD.

I think you are making the mistake of thinking that most people are computer nerds...they are not and most people haven't even heard of BullDozer. When a potential customer walks into a shop or logs onto a web page to buy a new CPU, they ask what is the newest batch of CPUs out there. Very few people do in-depth research to find out about IPC and cores sharing resources and modules.

Much like if I had £15k to spend on a new car, I would want to know what hte latest models being sold by BMW, VW, Ford, etc are. I'm not going to find out how each car was built and how each car transmits power from its engine to the wheels.

A lot of it will be down to the salesman involved as well...he can pretty much steer a buyer in almost any direction he wishes.

Put it this way, if we were both working in computer shop and I had to sell 10 AMD fx8150s and you had to sell 10 2500k cpus (1 cpu per uninformed customer)...I think I would sell my 10 cpus quicker than you. ;)
 
Oh and before it looks as if I am some AMD fanboy...I'm not.
I couldn't care less who has the best CPU...I buy the best CPU, at the time of purchase, regardless of brand.

All I'm saying is that AMD's new CPU is not bad...it just isn't the best. As such, as long as they price it lower than the the 2500k, they should be fine.
 
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