AMD® Phenom™ II X6 and Intel® Core™ i7 Debate

[LeJosh]

"Think" about it LeJosh

So you would use the same GPU in the test to see what CPU would better?

Never seen such a test.

 

[Mr Krugga]

So instead of me trawling through this thread, say instead of buying a Q9550 or the like for my old system. What out of the below is the best bang for buck in real life?

Phenom 1090
Intel i7 860
Intel i7 930

And as a side note, what have decent M-ATX motherboards along the lines of the Asus Maximus Gene II type?

Depending on the tasks, it could be either of them

So you would use the same GPU in the test to see what CPU would better?

Never seen such a test.

I'll give you a hint. Does higher resolution increase or decrease load on GPU?

 

[arknor]

Call of pripyat at 800x600? :\

its so its not gpu limited

 

[easyrider]

So instead of me trawling through this thread, say instead of buying a Q9550 or the like for my old system. What out of the below is the best bang for buck in real life?

Phenom 1090
Intel i7 860
Intel i7 930

And as a side note, what have decent M-ATX motherboards along the lines of the Asus Maximus Gene II type?

The i7 has more power core for core so will be faster in games.

The X6 knocks on the i7's door depending on software and might get one foot over the threshold if the software supports more cores than hyperthreading.

The 1090 is to expensive when you can get a 920 for less.
1055 offers great bank for buck when overclocked but is slower in games due to the bolted on extra cores.

i7 will be faster in games clock for clock remember it has just 4 cores and the 6 core 1090 just about levels with it.

So think about the software,think about wether you want SLI/Xfire and think about budget.

I for one would not be buying a £250 Core 2 Quad now.

 

[gareth170]

on the Sandra 2010c memory test the cpu-NB on the amd rig would be bottlenecking the 1600 ram at stock CPU-NB tbh.

 

[Big.Wayne]

the Sandra 2010c memory test

I'm sure there is a little truth in what you say Gareth but sadly most people that buy these chips will be running them at stock . . .

Even in the hands of an Overclocker I don't think it would be possible for an AMD® system to come close to an Intel® 192-bit memory config in terms of "raw" memory bandwidth . . .

Thing is though, those Sandra bandwidth scores are "synthetic" and I feel not as relevant in realworld scenarios for most people? . . at least not for me or my clients as far as I know? . . . I'm not aware of applications that shovel such a humongous amount of data through the system . . .

I'm sure there are some programs that do but I am unware of what they may be? . . . still for those that benchmark and get off on "higher is better" synthetic scores or perhaps genuine power-users that do use applications that can benefit . . . the potential of the Intel® memory bandwidth is impressive! . . . just need to find out now how and where this would be beneficial to an end-user?

 

[arknor]

dual vs triple channel performed on an i7 http://www.tweaktown.com/articles/1...y_analysis_can_dual_channel_cut_it/index.html

http://www.insidehw.com/Reviews/Mem...l-Channel-vs.-Triple-Channel-Memory-Mode.html

Conclusion

After all these tests you need to ask yourself: What the heck is that triple channel mode useful for anyway, when it is obvious that is doesn’t provide performance boost that is expected? Maybe in the future and with some new versions of memory controllers, triple channel mode will provide better performances so transition to this platform will make more sense. Until that moment triple channel mode will be just another nice sticker on LGA 1366 motherboards and memory packages

more
http://www.overclock.net/intel-memory/681697-truth-about-i7-1366-memory-both.html

 

[Big.Wayne]

Intel Core i7 Memory Analysis – Can Dual Channel Cut it?
TweakTown Nov 24, 2008

 

[Mr Krugga]

That's surprising, I wouldn't have thought that Triple Channel may even help in games (even though just a little). We need more benches to see what tasks it really helps with.

 

[gareth170]

we need real benchs not from review sites.

 

[arknor]

get someone on the forums to take a stick of memory out then , non of the "review" sites have results that show triple really offers anything at all outside of synthetic memory benchmarks.

all the games are always 2-5fps or whatever which could be margin of error

 

[Big.Wayne]

Intel® Core™ i7 Dual-Channel vs. Triple-Channel Memory Mode
InsideHW Friday, 20 March 2009

 

[james.miller]

You have to be doing this for a thesis of some kind as no one really cares that much to invest the amount of time into something so meaning less to everyday life?

you were ready to defend the i7 till the cows came home lol. I dont really see the difference. At least he is trying to get to the bottom if it all and besides...its a hardware forum. for cpu's. Not much use if we dont actually compare cpu's once and a while

 

[easyrider]

you were ready to defend the i7 till the cows came home lol. I dont really see the difference. At least he is trying to get to the bottom if it all and besides...its a hardware forum. for cpu's. Not much use if we dont actually compare cpu's once and a while

I still do defend the i7 its a quad core against a 6 core and the quad core beats it in many benchies. They are close and sometimes the X6 is a tiny bit faster the Cinebench proves it by 1 point on the cpu when it has 2 extra cores so nothing special there really,

But its a 6 core so I would expect it to trash the i7.

Just goes to show how good the i7 actually is.

Wayne would never buy one so of course this would fall on deaf ears.

Is the 5870 worth the extra over the 5850 ?

To some it is...But posting review benchies is boring. real time benchies involving the community is interesting.

Anyone can copy and paste or do a google

 

[gareth170]

honesty if u go for the x6 you'll be paying less and not losing much performance, if that makes sense

what u save in money, your only losing a small % in performance wise..

But posting review benchies is boring. real time benchies involving the community is interesting.

Anyone can copy and paste or do a google

very true.

i agree

 

[Big.Wayne]

 

[RizlaKing]

Sorry but there is enough info out there on all cpu's available to buy so why are we having this argument fest on here that as so many have said has no real conclusion because personal preference\belief is playing the part of actual data. If your building a pc for someone else they dictate what they want and you give them the available options and allow them to choose or provide them with links for them to conduct their own research thus removing the customer complaining you didn't give them correct info.

If your building a system for yourself then do your own research and go with what you conclude to be best for you because i have no idea what is best for someone else and they don't know me enough to judge that. All of this 8 pages to be at the end of it where we were mainly at the start seriously it just isn't worth it and i read the whole damn 8 pages hoping to gain something other then a headache. Put simply the I7 is generally better then the X6 but in some areas however limited they may be the X6 can compete favourably and soemtimes better the I7.

So if your in those areas buy the X6 if not buy the I7 or wait until next year when i hope to god the difference will be easier to spot then it is now and we can debate without all this hassle.

 

[Big.Wayne]

Hello RizlaKing

I didn't have a chat for you for many years!

Sorry but there is enough info out there on all cpu's available to buy so why are we having this argument fest on here

firstly what do you mean by "out there"? . . . . I would guess you mean out on the internet right? . . . . if that is what you mean what is the point of OcUK forums? . . . why do I have to go "out there" when all the information anyone could need could be right here? . . . . secondly you may not realise it but there is only a few people that are arguing and I'm not one of them? . . . I made this thread for help and assistance in collecting fact? . . . Are you able to offer me any any help or assistance or fact? . . .

I'm pretty sure some conclusions can be made if enough "Fact" is gathered so if you get any spare time any useful data you can "contribute" to the debate will be most welcome!

so many have said has no real conclusion because personal preference\belief is playing the part of actual data

What relevance is it what "so many have said"? . . . all I am asking for is help collecting and digesting "Fact" . . . I don't know how "personal belief" is anyway related to "Fact" . . . there was a time when "so many have said" the world was flat . . . obviously there were all incorrect? . . . I think if enough "Fact" is gathered then a lot of peoples "personal belief" may change . . .whether it's people who think AMD® is the way forward or other people who think Intel® is the way forward? . . . empirical evidence trumps opinion and trumps "personal belief" . . .

If your building a pc for someone else they dictate what they want and you give them the available options and allow them to choose or provide them with links for them to conduct their own research

Not really? . . . my clients put 100% trust in me to deliver the machine that is perfect for them? . . . they don't know very much about hardware and look to me for technical expertise and ethical conduct . . . . I'm doing some research into hardware I don't know very much about and thought I may as well make a thread listing the process so that perhaps others could help me and at the same time create an interesting and useful resource? . . . I mean I'm going to all this effort looking at the "facts so why not make it public so that some other people in my position can benefit? . . . . community spirit and all that?

thus removing the customer complaining you didn't give them correct info.

My customers never complain, I never give them reason too! . . . I strive for excellence in most things I do . . . perfection is not possible but I give it a good go!

If your building a system for yourself then do your own research

Why? . . . there is a lot of people on these forums who have a good head on their shoulders and it would be foolish of me not to ask them for help? . . . I've spent years helping people so I don't see I am doing something wrong by asking for a little help myself?

i have no idea what is best for someone else and they don't know me enough to judge that.

That makes no sense at all?

the I7 is generally better then the X6 but in some areas however limited they may be the X6 can compete favourably and sometimes better the I7

That's a very ambiguous answer? . . . could you be a little more specific please? . . . . if you have any interesting data that would be much appreciates by myself and anyone else who wanders through!

or wait until next year when i hope to god the difference will be easier to spot then it is now and we can debate without all this hassle.

It's always good to read the O.P before you offer assistance!

Not waiting for Sandybridge/Bulldozer

The difference is "very" east to spot at the moment . . . it's called a large price premium . . . I'm hoping with enough research that I can decide either to pay the extra or not pay the extra!!

 

[easyrider]

So you may aswell go for the cheaper X6 surely that would be the best option?

In essence are your clients not paying the extra?

Have they not given you a budget?

If they have given you a budget then the solution would be to get the fastest PC for that budget would it not?

You have not once mentioned what they will be using their PC's for and this makes a huge difference to the decision.

I'm a little unsure what the problem with the decision is?

If I was a client and I was paying a company or individual to build me a PC I wouldn't expect them to research for days on end dithering on what components to buy...I would expect a professional decision and expect them to have the knowledge of the current market and hardware.

And have the damn thing built within a day at least.

EDIT: TBH all your time seems to be posting a justification for your research....ever wondered why? I mean its not hard is it really. I think people are starting to believe that your are either full of hot air or a simpleton.

There is enough info in the bench thread i started to make a decision on whether you want to spend an extra 120 quid on i7 over X6

Its really easy, simple and quite frankly I have no idea why you just can't choose.

I certainly wouldn't pay someone to build a PC for me if they were that indecisive...You started this thread 5 days ago..there has been clear benchies and results posted around the forums. You say you are not waiting for sandy bridge and bull dozer? well you better get your skates on as both i7 930 and X6 will be dead out of date tech and building a system around these components would not show either technical expertise or ethical conduct!

 

[gareth170]

Big.Wayne, when does your client/customer want the system by? within the next 2 - 3 weeks or in months.

doesn't take this the wrong way. but theres afew people that as gave u advice and information (included me) which all saying the similar thing..

the i7 is faster in most things but costs 10-20%+ more.

the x6 is slower in things thats not optimized for 6 cores, but is faster in programs that are optimized for 6 cores.

the way i see it is if u go for the x6 you'll be paying less but losing a small amount of performance in programs the are not optimized for 6 cores,

what u save in money, your only losing a small % in performance wise.. if that makes sense

basicly you'll be saving more than losing performance.