I agree with a lot of that, but one could say AMD restarted it and turned it into a success.
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AMD VEGA confirmed for 2017 H1
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I agree with a lot of that, but one could say AMD restarted it and turned it into a success.
Soldato
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So you do you believe it was PowerVR/Imagination Technologies who got Microsoft's attention and made DX12 into what it is?
I don't agree well before AMD turned mantel into a success the PowerVR Metal API was already in use in over 100million devices and supported by countless games and developers. That is what kick started the modern day low level API's. PowerVR also being a key member in Khronos Group where pushing for the next API to be low level and cross platform. That's why AMD and PowerVR teamed up on Vulkan.
Where is that API now and what did it actually contribute to mainstream API's like Direct3D?
I'm glad it is 1000 posts as I wouldn't deal with people with 250 posts and no trust.
I believe it played a role as while DX12 was being developed PowerVR already had a low level API out in the wild use in over 100million devices and well documented by a large amount of game developers as being a great thing.
Surly MS would have looked at the most popular low level API's on the market learning form them while developing DX12.
Android mobile phones, X86 is a bit more complicated than that, for a start its not a closed system... that's a massive complication.
There isn't much you can port over from a one fits all system to one running thousands of different configurations.
There isn't much you can port over from a one fits all system to one running thousands of different configurations.
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It makes up key parts of Vulkan, Apple are a big believer in it using it in mobile and desktop space and PowerVR did contribute to Direxct3D over the generations. PowerVR low level API was also used in the Dreamcast and Vita back in the day. EDIT: I don't see how AMD restarted it, AMD joined in later.
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Consoles are low level because there is only one, just like Tablets and Phones they are all the same architecture and base config, its actually quite easy.
The real difficult bit is to make it work directly at the silicon wall with an endless array of different configurations around you. that's really hard and thats not PowerVR's contribution.
The real difficult bit is to make it work directly at the silicon wall with an endless array of different configurations around you. that's really hard and thats not PowerVR's contribution.
Soldato
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Likewise. My 290x is running both Elite Dangerous and DayZ at 4k, ok not full ultra settings but not far off. I'm looking forward to Vega or value from Nvidia which ever comes first.
I really don’t agree as that precisely what PowerVR was pushing for and that was a large part of their contribution. What makes you think PowerVR didn’t contribute to that?
There are more different GPU architectures in the Tablets and Phones world then the desktop. You have 2 main architectures on the desktop. I can think of at least 5 of the top of my head for Tablets and Phones. Same for CPU’s there are more differing architectures in the mobile world then desktop right now I could name 3 in the mobile world and I bet there are more.
Desktops are simple in comparison in that there are fewer configurations.
Anyway I don’t see how you can say a PowerVR low API used by millions didn’t kick start the low level API’s return. But a low level API from AMD used by barely anyone did kick start low level API’s.
Mantle makes up the largest bulk of vulkan. The majority of the functions have the same names as mantle functions. The only difference being the namespace prefix.
An example.
I actually rolled my eyes over "It makes up key parts of Vulkan" and somehow didn't take it in.
So suddenly the core of Vulkan being Mantle is now actually PowerVR.
That is now in the realms of the past as present but more over delusions of grandeur, really?
There is being a self proclaimed fanboy and then there is something else entirely.
So suddenly the core of Vulkan being Mantle is now actually PowerVR.
That is now in the realms of the past as present but more over delusions of grandeur, really?
There is being a self proclaimed fanboy and then there is something else entirely.
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What’s that got to do with the return of low level API’s? It wasn’t X86 that made low level API popular again. It was PowerVR’s Metal that made low level API popular again and devs seeing how good it was pushed for low level API in the X86 world.
Also PowerVR have been in X86 over the years as Intel used them.
You do realise Metal is an iOS API? nothing to do with Khronos or X86.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metal_(API)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metal_(API)
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Mantle makes up the largest bulk of vulkan. The majority of the functions have the same names as mantle functions. The only difference being the namespace prefix.
An example.
When did I ever say the core of Mantle was PowerVR everyone knows the foundation of Vulkan in Mantle. Mantle was based around IMR architectures and had zero optimizations or changes to work on other architectures in fact at times it hurt other architectures. PowerVR and the others did a lot of work making sure Vulkan worked well on TBDR architectures which is what most of the rest of the world use. A key part of what makes Vulkan great is working on cross platform and cross GPU architectures and that did not come from Mantle which was next to useless for other architectures. The cross platform stuff was added in after Mantle was givein to Kronos. Who do you think worked on the cross platform stuff? It wasn't just AMD.
Anyway I was talking about who made low level API popular again and its clear that was PowerVR Metal not Mantle. Vulkan is clearly superior to Metal but it wasn't Vulkan that made low level API popular again.
Mantle makes up the largest bulk of vulkan. The majority of the functions have the same names as mantle functions. The only difference being the namespace prefix.
An example.
Yup, i remember a video on Khronos Youtube channel where they(khronos) at a presentation said thank you to AMD for supplying the Mantle code as they have had serious issues getting vulkan started due to complications which Mantle solved for them. Without Mantle Vulkan would have been dead in the water or the very least a few years delayed.
Now personally im not gonna say that the Khronos group didnt look at PowerVR or other APIs and got the inspiration to start vulkan from that/those but the foundation is Mantle. Its just simple fact supported by Khronos's own statements.
No it doesn't, what you wrote here implies that major parts of vulkan were determined by PowerVR and mobile GPU makers, which they weren't.
The functions added by PowerVR and other mobile orientated manufacturers were to add better support for Defferend and tiled rendering hardware.
Its PowerVR own API which Apple adopted. It started life as SGX then turned into a background low level to the bone metal API used in Dreamcast and Vita. Its always been there in the background of PowerVR drivers and later resurfaced as Apples low level API for PowerVR GPU's which is when low level API becomes popular again. Hence why I said AMD didn't make low level API popular again that was Apple using PowerVR GPU's that brought low level API back into the mainstream.
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