Apparently the difference in price is quite large because 16MB ROM's are extremely common, and 32MB's are not. When you're dealing with products that only have a small profit margin, a dollar here or there adds up very quickly.
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AMD Zen 3 (5000 Series), rumored 17% IPC gain.
- Thread starter AStaley
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Apparently the difference in price is quite large because 16MB ROM's are extremely common, and 32MB's are not. When you're dealing with products that only have a small profit margin, a dollar here or there adds up very quickly.
AdoredTV stated that the NDA they signed was for the release of the latest 4 core chips, at which point when going through B550 motherboard features thats when they were told about this.
Associate
Hypothesis: AMD have 'pulled an nVidia' with their desktop motherboard chipsets.
What i mean by this is it appears to me AMD have moved up the class of the chipset in terms of market placement and price in comparison to the features offered.
B550 now supporting Crossfire is my main plank for this.
I couldn't really fathom the price and the type of X570 boards that came out (think of the 'Creator' type motherboards) as they were tripping over X399 while costing more and offering less real value (usable functionality).
Now i'm forensically looking at the differences in terms of price and functionality it looks like AMD motherboards have lifted everything up in price while not offering greater or parity value from the introduction of X570.
PCIe4 rather than PCIe3 at the same price is an example of what would be equivalent value from a generational shift.
On the other hand, TRx40 actually look like good value by comparison to X570.
For my comparison with nVidia, commentary on how nVidia have moved previous mid-range GPU cores into an upper-level price bracket can be found on youtube. Start with AdoredTV.
Price equivalency of functionality of motherboards for B550 vs B450 will be interesting.
What i mean by this is it appears to me AMD have moved up the class of the chipset in terms of market placement and price in comparison to the features offered.
B550 now supporting Crossfire is my main plank for this.
I couldn't really fathom the price and the type of X570 boards that came out (think of the 'Creator' type motherboards) as they were tripping over X399 while costing more and offering less real value (usable functionality).
Now i'm forensically looking at the differences in terms of price and functionality it looks like AMD motherboards have lifted everything up in price while not offering greater or parity value from the introduction of X570.
PCIe4 rather than PCIe3 at the same price is an example of what would be equivalent value from a generational shift.
On the other hand, TRx40 actually look like good value by comparison to X570.
For my comparison with nVidia, commentary on how nVidia have moved previous mid-range GPU cores into an upper-level price bracket can be found on youtube. Start with AdoredTV.
Price equivalency of functionality of motherboards for B550 vs B450 will be interesting.
Associate
Yes he did. Confirmation the tech press have known about this for a couple of weeks.
Jim said in a previous video on his channel he wouldn't be signing any more NDA because he knew something he didn't like but didn't elaborate on it at the time. Now we know what it was.
Caporegime
It's a dollar difference if buying individually from a distributor who are price gouging. In China,where they probably will pay in Yuan,I expect its much less of a difference. Even 10 year old AM3+ motherboards could have 32MB BIOSes for example.Either way,things such as dual BIOSes and socketed BIOSes exist,if you want to use 16MB BIOS chips. The problem is if AMD after 3 chipset releases were having this problem,they should have just stopped the promise last year,and been open about it. Just keeping quite for a year,after they wrote a puff piece attacking Intel for locking down chipsets,really is taking the mickey.
Soldato
Seems most in here have the memory of the goldfish, jumping into conclusions without see how things will unfold in 4 months time.
Last May, WCCFTECH run an article, that someone from MSI told them that Zen 2 will only be compatible with X570 because of the BIOS size
For a month this had set this forum (and others) up in flames. The usual suspects crying above, especially those "I am switching to Intel" were writing the same drivel. Yet we saw how things unfolded.
As for the motherboard manufacturers, after Zen 2 release we saw articles they were dismayed that their 2+ year old motherboard wasn't obsolete for people to buy new, since they got used to sell a new round of motherboards every time a CPU is out. Same articles we saw in 2018 when Zen+ came out also.
You have to understand that they are not charities, and need to make money. We see how sub par their AMD motherboards are 4th year now, let alone the first 2 years (300/400 series) compared to the Intel boards. Why? Because they know they will sell motherboards with Intel to all those wanting to upgrade.
Same we will see now. They will try their outmost to sell the Z490 boards, especially since we know they are all faulty, knowingly well that they will sell to the sheep err I mean consumers Z590 boards in 5 months time due to proper (aka fixed) ethernet speeds and PCIe 4.0 support. And then next year with LGA1700.
So what's better for those manufacturers? A company who makes their 4y old product relevant still or a company who allows them to sell 3 different products to same people within year?
Why everyone attacks AMD who warned them 4 years ago, giving them the specs? AMD has said that is down to motherboard manufacturers to support Zen 3 on X370/470 & B350/450 and is not outright restricted. (eg excusing themselves for changing around 2 pins like Intel did).
Anyone who continues crying before we see how things unfold, surely suffers with AMD Derangement Syndrome, like a big majority in General Discussion suffer from TDS. See some psychiatrist please.
Last May, WCCFTECH run an article, that someone from MSI told them that Zen 2 will only be compatible with X570 because of the BIOS size
For a month this had set this forum (and others) up in flames. The usual suspects crying above, especially those "I am switching to Intel" were writing the same drivel. Yet we saw how things unfolded.
As for the motherboard manufacturers, after Zen 2 release we saw articles they were dismayed that their 2+ year old motherboard wasn't obsolete for people to buy new, since they got used to sell a new round of motherboards every time a CPU is out. Same articles we saw in 2018 when Zen+ came out also.
You have to understand that they are not charities, and need to make money. We see how sub par their AMD motherboards are 4th year now, let alone the first 2 years (300/400 series) compared to the Intel boards. Why? Because they know they will sell motherboards with Intel to all those wanting to upgrade.
Same we will see now. They will try their outmost to sell the Z490 boards, especially since we know they are all faulty, knowingly well that they will sell to the sheep err I mean consumers Z590 boards in 5 months time due to proper (aka fixed) ethernet speeds and PCIe 4.0 support. And then next year with LGA1700.
So what's better for those manufacturers? A company who makes their 4y old product relevant still or a company who allows them to sell 3 different products to same people within year?
Why everyone attacks AMD who warned them 4 years ago, giving them the specs? AMD has said that is down to motherboard manufacturers to support Zen 3 on X370/470 & B350/450 and is not outright restricted. (eg excusing themselves for changing around 2 pins like Intel did).
Anyone who continues crying before we see how things unfold, surely suffers with AMD Derangement Syndrome, like a big majority in General Discussion suffer from TDS. See some psychiatrist please.
Caporegime
Lol,so Intel is not a charity,all the people with Intel derangement syndrome crying and attacking them,as they owe nothing to others,and their motherboard OEMs want sales.
So why do some of the people in this thread keep going into Intel threads and start attacking Intel for its practices and products? You only have to look at some of the biggest "contributors" to Intel threads who just spent half their time piddling on Intel in those threads. The same lot,then piddle on AMD fans if they don't excuse make for all their decisions.
Yet if AMD was so worried about motherboard OEMs,they would have released B550 in 2019 but they did not,instead the usual suspects defend AMD.
If they cared so much,why did they tell the press,they are not releasing microcode for earlier motherboards?
All of you lot ,telling mainstream Zen2 buyers,that Zen3 would work,oh well...that was a shame. One socket generation for them.
Now it's all saying no,no its all OK,AMD isn't a charity. Intel isn't. Nvidia isn't. But then ignore the fact they lied to Schenker a German OEM that B450 would work until last week,OEMs told HUB,they were caught unaware by AMD's announcement.
So I expect 100% of the people defending this move from AMD,will stop going into Intel and Nvidia threads and accousting them over "their business practices". Intel and Nvidia can also point to their poor OEMs too needing more money too.
So we have all come to an agreement,AMD isn't a charity and neither are the OEMs. Neither are Intel or Nvidia,so they are all as bad as everyone else.
Thank goodness that is finally cleared up.
Oh one more thing,lets quote AMD:
Well AMD admitted what they did wasn't that great in retrospective,oh well,just another non-charitable company.
What this thread highlights is some who kept attacking Intel and Nvidia for doing certain things,have no problem accepting if AMD does the same.
Have some of these experts even understood why AMD was forced to add support for earlier motherboards?? Nvidia removing GPP. Because of the backlash. Oh! Noes! That dirty word.
So why do some of the people in this thread keep going into Intel threads and start attacking Intel for its practices and products? You only have to look at some of the biggest "contributors" to Intel threads who just spent half their time piddling on Intel in those threads. The same lot,then piddle on AMD fans if they don't excuse make for all their decisions.
Yet if AMD was so worried about motherboard OEMs,they would have released B550 in 2019 but they did not,instead the usual suspects defend AMD.
If they cared so much,why did they tell the press,they are not releasing microcode for earlier motherboards?
All of you lot ,telling mainstream Zen2 buyers,that Zen3 would work,oh well...that was a shame. One socket generation for them.
Now it's all saying no,no its all OK,AMD isn't a charity. Intel isn't. Nvidia isn't. But then ignore the fact they lied to Schenker a German OEM that B450 would work until last week,OEMs told HUB,they were caught unaware by AMD's announcement.
So I expect 100% of the people defending this move from AMD,will stop going into Intel and Nvidia threads and accousting them over "their business practices". Intel and Nvidia can also point to their poor OEMs too needing more money too.
So we have all come to an agreement,AMD isn't a charity and neither are the OEMs. Neither are Intel or Nvidia,so they are all as bad as everyone else.
Thank goodness that is finally cleared up.
Oh one more thing,lets quote AMD:
AMD in 2019 said:
Well AMD admitted what they did wasn't that great in retrospective,oh well,just another non-charitable company.
What this thread highlights is some who kept attacking Intel and Nvidia for doing certain things,have no problem accepting if AMD does the same.
Have some of these experts even understood why AMD was forced to add support for earlier motherboards?? Nvidia removing GPP. Because of the backlash. Oh! Noes! That dirty word.
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Associate
No, AMD have explicitly stated they will not provide microcode to motherboard manufacturers to support Zen3 on <500series chipsets. Right now it is AMD who are making the decisions.
If the motherboard manufacturers get the microcode support from AMD and then they choose not to support it they will get called out on it too. In this instance i can tell the future. Sitting around waiting for this to play out will end up in it playing out the way AMD wants. Some of us are not sitting about.
Companies getting a moral/ethical free-pass because they have to make money is a very strange, yet extremely common, philosophy. Companies will make money regardless if their goods and services are of sufficient quality and value to warrant it. I suspect the whole industry has not really warranted it for a long time but they've been getting a pass despite their many sharp practices.
Every company involved with Ryzen has dined out on the longevity/compatibility angle and now it doesn't suit them they try to walk away. Shame on them.
AMD and motherboard manufacturers have gotten MORE business out of me than they would have normally gotten due to the flexibility between CPUs and chipsets. I've paid my dues.
I think AMD and motherboard makers need to be careful that people don't start clocking up how many hours they've spent enabling their purchases to perform to advertised specs. I'm sure a lot of us are probably due a rebate if we apply an hourly rate to the time we've spent on stuff which is 'not working as advertised'.
Soldato
AMD defense league out in force here!
The same lot that jump on intel and nvidia for bad practices are now defending this from AMD, unbelieveable.
The same lot that jump on intel and nvidia for bad practices are now defending this from AMD, unbelieveable.
Soldato
Nobody defends anyone. I am on the idea to wait and see. Is that so difficult to understand?
I know you took the blue pill long time ago given your posts over the years.
Soldato
must be reading different posts then
Soldato
I swap and change hardware so regularly that I must be a junkie if I'm swallowing pills. My posts were valid, intel were faster. Now AMD have caught up they've done the same bait and switch.
What is there to wait and see? AMD have already announced it, even if they change their minds because of the rukus over at r/amd the bitter taste will still be there.
Its almost like AMD get a free pass on the internet because they are the smaller company, which you would think would help them. But no the left hand doesn't know what the right is doing.
Associate
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They will likely do a u-turn after all the backlash... not that I'll bother with ryzen 4000 anyway after spending all this money on my board, ram and chip.
Soldato
Actually AMD doesn't have to do a uturn. Motherboard manufacturers will, when they see one of their competitors motherboards getting support.
Same thing happened with Zen 2. MSI was the biggest mouthpiece of "we support nothing" and then even released "MAX" series motherboards because they were getting negative headlines.
Caporegime
Some more noise from the German system integrator,which AMD told through official channels,that the B450 would work. The same integrator,which only found out from the AMD press release,it wouldn't work!
Also,from that earliest possible Zen3 launch date is October this year but it could also be early next year.
Edit!!
This is one of the products affected that they sell:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KFTMBTDGTx8&feature=youtu.be
It's a laptop with upto a Ryzen 9 3950X.
Also,from that earliest possible Zen3 launch date is October this year but it could also be early next year.
Edit!!
This is one of the products affected that they sell:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KFTMBTDGTx8&feature=youtu.be
It's a laptop with upto a Ryzen 9 3950X.
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Caporegime
Wrong thread.
Soldato
My main annoyance with all this mess, is the issues AMD causes to XMG. None else.
Reason is that product is amazing and could create a new market for everyone including myself which was looking to move to mobile fully but CPU is always the limitation.
We have to wait to see but from what they say, if AMD provides Zen 3 AGESA, it can be done by cutting off support from all other CPUs except Zen 2.
Something even the AMD rep said on the interview posted on WCCFTECH.
Thats why I have said better wait and see. Is not like our systems will stop working tomorrow, or get slower because of Zen 3. At least AMD is not Nvidia
(Still grinding that axe since the September 2016 drivers crippling the performance of my GTX1080).
Fingers crossed.
Well assuming we do not live on the streets
We have more serious things to consider given the economy due to the virus, let alone Brexit.Well, everyone and his dog posted in here, put somethign irrelevant also.
Soldato
Supposed to be October from recent leaks
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