And boomers wonder why millennials are bitter towards them..

[The Running Man]

That is NOT the point I was making and I'm lucky enough to be in a position to buy in that range (I have to be, living/working around here) - but rather the wealth generated by sitting on these house for 3 decades has not been invested back into the property, and the price is still high. In principal I won't offer on those places, it just feels wrong and definitely makes me feel bitter.

So you're suggesting they list at a lower price below market value just because?

Maybe they put everything they had into buying the house, then as their career tailed off and pensions began they were unable to afford spending 10 grand on a new kitchen .

Some of the real tragedies I see are ex ww2 vets or that era still living in single glazed houses with no central heating because that's the life and struggle they lived through. Make do with what they have ... not what they want.

 

[Fubsy]

So you're suggesting they list at a lower price below market value just because?

Maybe they put everything they had into buying the house, then as their career tailed off and pensions began they were unable to afford spending 10 grand on a new kitchen .

Some of the real tragedies I see are ex ww2 vets or that era still living in single glazed houses with no central heating because that's the life and struggle they lived through. Make do with what they have ... not what they want.

Yes, because they are ruined houses. I've seen houses in the same street, same layouts/sizes, room numbers etc be merely 10K apart in asking price just because, yet one of them will be an absolute **** hole and the other been taken care of. They'll stay on the market until they crumble unless they knock down the prices. It seems the prices only come down to realistic levels once the owners pass away and the family want a quick sale.

 

[Dyson]

I'm in a fairly interesting position at work. I have a broad swathe of ages working for me from 65 year olds down to 17 year olds (apprentices). I have noticed a massive generational gap in work ethics and attitudes.

50-65 - Will graft all day, every day. Generally very good sickness records with the obvious age issues. With individual exceptions there is less absence amongst this age group than the rest combined.

40-50 - Good attitude to work, get on with the job. A few obvious long-term health issues showing.

30-40 - Good attitude to work, get on with the job. Very good attendance with the exception of school holidays where there's definitely an increase in sick days (child care issues being masked?).

17-30 - Remarkable sense of entitlement. More interested in their phones than anything else. Obvious patterns to absence, particularly Mondays or after bank holidays. Generally very high sickness, seem to have colds and the flu a lot, 'stress' seems to be a major factor.


I would genuinely say that I can see where the lazy tag for the younger generation comes in, at least in our workforce. I've recently been hunting for apprentices and the current crop are...well...appalling. CVs obviously written by parents/tutors, can barely string sentences together in interviews, inability to actually answer questions. I was actually looking to hire 2 with the specific request that we got some poor buggers that had lost their positions because of COVID, nah, they lost their positions because companies used it as an excuse to get rid of the dross. My two best workers are early 60s and will break their backs for you.

Couldn’t agree more, that perfectly sums up the different work ethics. Yes, there are obviously exceptions, but that’s the same where I am. Our younger guys have zero self initiative.

 

[fobose]

Yes, because they are ruined houses. I've seen houses in the same street, same layouts/sizes, room numbers etc be merely 10K apart just because, yet one of them will be an absolute **** hole and the other been taken care of. They'll stay on the market until they crumble unless they knock down the prices. It seems the prices only come down to realistic levels once the owners pass away and the family want a quick sale.

People always think their property is worth more than it is! I was surprised when I had my first house valued, it went on for 20k more than what I thought it was worth and sold for it too!

As I said in my previous post I spent 9 years saving a 70k deposit on a low income but I had to go without a lot of things. Mind you, back in 2003 I bought my first car (1.2 VW polo) brand new for £8k after saving hard for just over a year. I kept that car for 13 years! Saved me a hell of a lot on car payments as it was a reliable little car.

 

[Nitefly]

People always think their property is worth more than it is! I was surprised when I had my first house valued, it went on for 20k more than what I thought it was worth and sold for it too!

As I said in my previous post I spent 9 years saving a 70k deposit on a low income but I had to go without a lot of things. Mind you, back in 2003 I bought my first car (1.2 VW polo) brand new for £8k after saving hard for just over a year. I kept that car for 13 years! Saved me a hell of a lot on car payments as it was a reliable little car.

That rate of saving is not enough to actually keep up with the house price increases if you are stretching yourself and hitting the limit of your borrowing, which most young people on average salaries will be.

 

[Fusion]

Yep, prices are an issue across the country. Even £150K 'cheap' houses in the north are 4x - 5x average local salaries (and often higher) so still out of reach for a lot of people. Those claiming 'entitlement' just can't put themselves in the shoes of others.

But in "cheap" northern and midlands areas, you can buy for substantially less than £150k.

 

[fobose]

That rate of saving is not enough to actually keep up with the house price increases if you are stretching yourself and hitting the limit of your borrowing, which most young people on average salaries will be.

I agree with you there. Interest rates being so low do not help those saving at the moment either. I was getting around 4-6% for most of my years savings so perhaps there were a few variables that assisted my purchase. I did have to settle for a house in a not so nice area, end terrace and it was super run down and needed everything doing to it. I didn't have any money to do anything to it for a good 2 years of living there (then my GF moved in which helped).

 

[Roar87]

Man is angry because person bought house which increased in value, despite them having no control over this or even possibly the foresight it would happen. What a ridiculous thread

 

[Martini1991]

Yes, because they are ruined houses. I've seen houses in the same street, same layouts/sizes, room numbers etc be merely 10K apart in asking price just because, yet one of them will be an absolute **** hole and the other been taken care of. They'll stay on the market until they crumble unless they knock down the prices. It seems the prices only come down to realistic levels once the owners pass away and the family want a quick sale.

This is exactly my feeling.

It's not easy to "Do them up" as that requires liquid really.
You can have two houses for sale that are attached as two semi's with there being a 50 year difference between them internally with very little difference in pricing.

 

[GGizmo]

What's it got to do with boomers that their house is worth a lot?

It must be a wealthy area for it to be valued like that.

So you must be paying a lot in rent too.

Typical millennials, always complaining.

 

[200sols]

What's it got to do with boomers that their house is worth a lot?

Probably because they always say.... 'we managed in my day' whilst having no idea how much things have changed. While sitting on their awesome pensions bemoaning young people and claiming if they stopped buying costa coffee they would be able to afford a house?

 

[The Running Man]

Probably because they always say.... 'we managed in my day' whilst having no idea how much things have changed. While sitting on their awesome pensions bemoaning young people and claiming if they stopped buying costa coffee they would be able to afford a house?

Life so difficult with all this counselling and tree hugging nonsense.

In the day you were told to man up you big girls blouse.

Or you lived in a world war, or after that lived in threat of nuclear war, but oh yeah life is so difficult now...

 

[Fusion]

Bonds and savings accounts aren't paying much more than 1%, at best. Many companies have been cutting dividends, even blue chip FTSE100 firms. That leaves property, which can still yield 7-8% (and even more) if you buy in the right area, though you need to deduct expenses and tax from that of course.

 

[Shoza]

Vote with your feet, it’s generally quite simple. I’m a 35-40 something so peak career opportunities for me started right at the last recession (2007/2008). I worked hard and took what I could at the time. In the end I moved out of London and bought up north a lovely house and I’m now set for life. London and the south is a mugs game for anyone under 40. So many great opportunities for work and housing in Birmingham, Leeds, Cardiff, Manchester, Liverpool etc.

You've just got to be prepared to let go of London and when you do, you realise it was never really worth it.

 

[dowie]

With dividends reinvested their 800k would've been about 3.1 million had they thrown that in the NASDAQ in 2006 and forgot about it

But yea, nice money I guess.

Difference is they perhaps didn't buy the house in cash, for most people it's a leveraged investment via a mortgage so gains can be amplified to some extent (ditto to losses but if it's your own home, particularly if it's intended to be your "forever home" rather than a BTL investment then) Their initial "investment" here might have been say 200 or 300k and they might still have some capital repayment left of make on the original 600 or 500k mortgage at the point where they've sold for 1.7 million... which of course is a negligible amount by then thanks to that big leveraged gain.

(Of course people can make leveraged investments that track the NASDAQ but they'd generally need to roll derivative positions or pay interest on the entire notional value of some CFD position.)

 

[GGizmo]

Probably because they always say.... 'we managed in my day' whilst having no idea how much things have changed. While sitting on their awesome pensions bemoaning young people and claiming if they stopped buying costa coffee they would be able to afford a house?

I'm not a boomer and I save. Maybe the reason 'boomers' have more money is because previous generations appreciated things more?

A lot of people are quick to flash the cash these days then moan about not having enough money to save.

 

[dowie]

That’s not equal though, you’d have to take off the cost of rent for the 14 years.

No one is going to give you 800k to throw at the markets.

The total amount repayable on the 800k over 25 years is what £1.25m???? They’ve barely covered costs really I suspect.

You'll find plenty of firms willing to let you throw 800k at the markets, in fact many would be very very keen on you trying.

(obviously assuming you're the sort of person who could otherwise purchase an 800k house)

 

[NickK]

I'm in a fairly interesting position at work. I have a broad swathe of ages working for me from 65 year olds down to 17 year olds (apprentices). I have noticed a massive generational gap in work ethics and attitudes.

50-65 - Will graft all day, every day. Generally very good sickness records with the obvious age issues. With individual exceptions there is less absence amongst this age group than the rest combined.

40-50 - Good attitude to work, get on with the job. A few obvious long-term health issues showing.

30-40 - Good attitude to work, get on with the job. Very good attendance with the exception of school holidays where there's definitely an increase in sick days (child care issues being masked?).

17-30 - Remarkable sense of entitlement. More interested in their phones than anything else. Obvious patterns to absence, particularly Mondays or after bank holidays. Generally very high sickness, seem to have colds and the flu a lot, 'stress' seems to be a major factor.


I would genuinely say that I can see where the lazy tag for the younger generation comes in, at least in our workforce. I've recently been hunting for apprentices and the current crop are...well...appalling. CVs obviously written by parents/tutors, can barely string sentences together in interviews, inability to actually answer questions. I was actually looking to hire 2 with the specific request that we got some poor buggers that had lost their positions because of COVID, nah, they lost their positions because companies used it as an excuse to get rid of the dross. My two best workers are early 60s and will break their backs for you.

However you have to realise the obvious flaw in this argument and statistics. If an individual lives to 50-65 and can still work, then they show up in your statistics. It is likely that those that have not shown up in your statistics have either died, have to have accepted a different role due to illness restricting their ability or on sickness benefits. Additionally - I would also remark as an individual ages they change. Those that are self-entitled change as they have to cope with family life and late life.

I agree - the child care aspect is true however having kids (as any parent will attest to) - children are illness magnets, then they come home and bring it all home. So it's not unexpected.

Companies under pressure will be more choosey - who can deliver more?

I am a firm believer in that a large portion of stress is caused by the broadcast 'reality' shows of millionaires etc. In reality a large portion are simply paper rich based on the cashflow from their reality shows - the cashflow simply goes straight out the door into the purchases to reinforce and perpetuate the cycle to drive the figures up.

I would also point to the "always on" culture in the iPhone age for young that also causes problems. Older generations have caught on and switch off, or are distracted by higher priorities. Unfortunately the iPhone/IM/FB etc has simply sped up the social interactions to a rate that the human brain has long term issues with. I think Covid has caused health and mental issues. There's no doubt.

The modern financial system really demands 110% of the 'ideal' family partnership. Couple with the strains of social, financial, covid.. I'm not surprised.

However... life is not fair. Life doesn't give a **** if your parents have died in a car crash, your job is under threat due to covid and you're the only one in the rented house to talk to. You gotta accept that.. live it. and fight for it.

 

[Maccapacca]

You'll find plenty of firms willing to let you throw 800k at the markets, in fact many would be very very keen on you trying.

(obviously assuming you're the sort of person who could otherwise purchase an 800k house)

what I’m saying is no one will lend you 800k to chuck at the markets but happy to lend you 800k to chuck at a house so it’s not a correct comparison.

 

[dowie]

what I’m saying is no one will lend you 800k to chuck at the markets but happy to lend you 800k to chuck at a house so it’s not a correct comparison.

I got that, I'm just highlighting that it's incorrect because plenty of firms will be happy for you to do just that!

The poster mentioned NASDAQ, well plenty of US brokers will offer you 4:1 leverage on equities... likewise plenty of mortgages will be 4:1 leverage. As with a mortgage you'll pay interest on this.

You can also do the reverse, which you can't do with housing as houses aren't all identical/replaceable, that is you can borrow equities, sell them and then buy them back later (profiting from the difference) and you can do this is a leveraged manner too financed by the broker - this is called short selling.

In fact you can get yourself in a bit deeper when it comes to playing the markets as derivatives, both exchange traded and CFDs potentially allow for even more leverage. Granted in the case of say a CFD positoon of 800k it's the CFD provider that makes the purchase and has that position then has a contract with you for the equivalent.