Another bizarre "equality" case
- Thread starter FoxEye
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Soldato
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We both know you didnt. 'I work in the industry's is really no proof of anything at all. I get it, you have an issue with me - cute, and all, but really can't you find something better to do?
This is ironic because:You're big on this "my half baked opinions are facts" thing aren't you
The only points you made... they weren't though, were they? You also stomped around telling people they dont know what equality means, you tried to pretend you didnt know presenters arent all paid the same and when I showed you that equality doesnt actually mean equal pay, you tried to deflect with your ad hominem guff and try to paint me as the guy who dishes out opinion as fact.... but it was you doing that. It's just very sad
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Why you would expect a barber who has trained doing mens' haircuts to attempt to do a woman's haircut, risk messing it up and having their reputation tarnished or being sued? It's like expecting a GP to do brain surgery because they're both a type of doctor.
I think if she's asking for a short back and sides, then surely a fair warning that you're not as well trained as a hairstylist and still doing the cut would be right. Anything beyond that is beyond the barbers' skill level.
For the woman in the OP, does this mean she now has to present a quiz show on BBC2 and her own radio show on Radio 2? Because whilst I don't even watch TV or listen to the radio, I know who Jeremy Vine (and his brother) is and what they do. But her.. not a clue. As far as I can tell, she should have been laughed out of court. She's being paid the same as her predecessor to do an identical job. If she couldn't understand that, how does she understand anything on her show?
Insurance?
I've been denied hair cuts as a man because the hairdresser wasn't insured to do patterns.
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I have to say that I've never heard of that before!
I guess if that were the reason here, they should have informed her, just like you were informed.
Soldato
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Move to China then.
Do people not negotiate their own wages? When I started my job, I negotiated my wage. After being there for a few years, I was offered a job at another business with what I thought was a big pay increase, and put in my two weeks notice.
My boss at the time called me into the office and asked what it would take for me to stay and I said they would have to match the new offer, but understood that was unrealistic-"Done." He said, " Welcome back."
The ease with which my employer increased my pay illustrated to me that I was being "underpaid" for years. (And should have asked for more) But since I'm a white male, no one ever taught me that I was being held back by others so I considered that maybe it was my fault.
I should have negotiated better.
When I hear someone claim an employer is paying (insert "victim" group of choice here) less than (insert "privileged" group here), I remember how I failed to negotiate good wages myself.
I expect employees and employers to try and get as much as they can out of their side of the employment negotiated. If you will do the job for less money, an employer will be happy to pay you less and not because you belong to such and such group, but because your pay, effectively, comes out of their "pay".
I just can't see myself going to any business and negotiating x salary only to be told something to the effect of "That's too little money, we want to pay you more because you are a man so for forget that number you said you would work for....here's more."
No. When I started that job, I agreed to just a little over minimum wage because it came with a company vehicle that I could take home and didn't have to put gas in. I thought it was a decent deal, but other people in the same job, "doing the same work", were getting paid much more than me until I renegotiated more favorable terms.
My boss at the time called me into the office and asked what it would take for me to stay and I said they would have to match the new offer, but understood that was unrealistic-"Done." He said, " Welcome back."
The ease with which my employer increased my pay illustrated to me that I was being "underpaid" for years. (And should have asked for more) But since I'm a white male, no one ever taught me that I was being held back by others so I considered that maybe it was my fault.
I should have negotiated better.
When I hear someone claim an employer is paying (insert "victim" group of choice here) less than (insert "privileged" group here), I remember how I failed to negotiate good wages myself.
I expect employees and employers to try and get as much as they can out of their side of the employment negotiated. If you will do the job for less money, an employer will be happy to pay you less and not because you belong to such and such group, but because your pay, effectively, comes out of their "pay".
I just can't see myself going to any business and negotiating x salary only to be told something to the effect of "That's too little money, we want to pay you more because you are a man so for forget that number you said you would work for....here's more."
No. When I started that job, I agreed to just a little over minimum wage because it came with a company vehicle that I could take home and didn't have to put gas in. I thought it was a decent deal, but other people in the same job, "doing the same work", were getting paid much more than me until I renegotiated more favorable terms.
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What does that even mean? Through a devilishly small use of words I don't know if you mean we're already an equal society and women get paid the same as men, that equality is a communist idea and it just happens that men are better at it that women or that you've been attracted by the catnip I outlined above and you fancy lobbing a vague dig.
Please elaborate? For clarity I don't think equality is the same as communism. I also see it's beyond dispute that women get paid less than men for the same work.
As I've already said I think this might be a daft example because they're both getting paid plenty but I don't see equality as a cake that isn't worth breaking some eggs to make. I sincerely hope the women doing what I do in my company get paid as much as I do.
Pople are paid what they are for *many* reasons. I pointed out my experience when I failed to negotiate a good salary. Had I been a female, many people would have blamed sexism, but I'm a man, so the social justice warriors have no use for such anecdotes and ignore them.
The discussion on pay gap starts a bit befor the 6 min mark if you care to hear some of those other factors that go into pay.
The discussion on pay gap starts a bit befor the 6 min mark if you care to hear some of those other factors that go into pay.
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Do they?
Last time I checked the pay was pretty equal until the time that a woman has her first child.
Typically afterwards, working patterns, experience and pay diverge substantially.
I wonder why? Must be discrimination, eh?
Yeah I guess so? Unless you decide the contribution of doing the thing you physically can't but which is literally the only thing that can continue the human race deserves a drop in wages? Dunno?
I mean if that's the logical conclusion then the best thing to do is for women to stop giving birth if they want to earn as much as men, which would do the planet no end of good but considering we're already in a declining population might pose some challenges?
Maybe immigration could fix it.. hang on...
Ah so here we get to the reality, eh?
From the employer's perspective the candidates aren't equal.
You're now saying the female candidates should be given special treatment (ie unequal treatment) to factor in the effect if they all chose not have kids.
So by your own admission this isn't equal pay for equal work/skills/experience.
Well we agree on one thing
Fact of the matter is men and women are NOT equal. Women expect a man to be the provider, protector, carer etc. I'm sure 90% of men in a relationship spend more than their (female) partners on most things. Going out for a meal. Holidays. It's always expected for the man to foot most of the bill, simply because they are the man and so are automatically supposed to give the woman safety and security. So why should they both get paid equal? They shouldn't, men should be paid more.
Yes, obviously. People should get paid equal money if they're doing the job as well, and to do a job well you need to actually be doing the job rather than having / raising kids. Otherwise it's not equality.
That's all irrelevant. Women should absolutely get paid the same as a man who's doing the same job, to the same standard, at the same level. The problem is that modern feminists are asking for something different to that, which isn't actually fair (look at matt100's posts for an example).
Caporegime
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I pay more. Not because it's "expected", but because I earn more.
If she was earning 3x more than me, she would have to pay for the majority of stuff. Simple as that.
Soldato
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Yep, hit the nail on the head there.
Soldato
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LOL I take it you havent seen the short back and sides on the women that was complaining about it.
Its like being in the stone ages on this forum sometimes.
I'd support your right to give birth Loretta.
If she earned 3x as much as you she wouldn't be your partner