Anyone think the complexity is ruining games

I guess gamers need to be rewarded constantly to maintain interest and stop them playing the competitions products. Not to mention if you release game now with less unlockables, it is considered less features and poor development choice for your money.

Unlocks are an easy not-so-gamechanging way to do this.

I don't really mind if there are unlocks or not, i've played old school shooters with none, and the modern ones (like BF3) where walking 10 feet rewards you with a new gun, a new perk and a camoflauged mankini. One thing rings true though, if the game is carp, it doesn't matter how many gold chrome plated guns with a built in fleshlight you get, it's still carp.

Blame all this 'complexity' (it isn't really complex...) on **** children with bad parent input, no attention span and an inability to engage their brain. If one more rubbish parent tells me their little timmy is misunderstood and he has asperges i'll batter them, and timmy.
 
krooton said:
Because the games he mentions are primarily console based? Then he should be complaining about it in the console games section. :p
Click to expand...

i meant i had more fun with

cod4 and bf vietnam

but maybe its my memory playing up

Like I say I recall having lots of fun with goldeneye, but i played it not long ago and its terrible now
 
I agree about complexity ruining gaming in general. Some games benefit but some don't.

Fps in the 90s you had a few classes with a few weapons per class no perks, no upgrades etc. Pick and hop in and have fun. Mohaa classic example. Loved that gameplay. Now try playing like that with cod4 for example and its just not fun with all the modern stuff with perks, tactics, unlocks and whatever. Just too much to really track and do it spoils it for me personally.

Simcity4 which was ok but a little too complex at times. I much prefer the snes version. Easier to get into quickly without too much to worry about well compared to simcity4 anyhow.

Yep its personaly preference and vote with your wallet etc but their just arnt many pick and play games these days that arnt console ports.

A classic example of over complication for me is Witcher. 3 fight modes and the menu system for all sorts put me right off playing it. I personally would prefer a simpler menu system (less icon driven more textual based instead) and one fight mode. Tho ppl seemed to like it others like me would have enjoyed the game just as much if it was much simpler and less to think about so i can just enjoy the gameplay and story.
 
I think if anything games are being dumbed down over time to make PC games more in line with console games. For example in BF1942 you had a huge range of land sea and air vehicles, in BF2 they removed sea, in BF2142 onwards they removed most fast air. They also reduced the number of classes, making them more simple and joining all of their abilities together (like assault having medpacks or ammo packs, or the 'support' class with the machine gun also having defib paddles). Maps and game modes over time have also been made smaller, for fewer players to make it more in line with consoles.

I miss some of the complexity, I liked in BF1942 that I could be flying a plane doing a bombing run on an airfield at one point, and then be called in to bomb an enemy sub that has surfaced during a fleet battle, and the servers were big enough that you could have separate land/sea/air battles that crossover at times.
 
I don't think it's the complexity of the games per se that is the problem, i trhink that is just a side effect of how games are designed nowadays. It's that developers are there to make money, they make the most profit by selling more copies so they need to appeal to as wide an audience as possible. The majority of people who play video games these days, especially the kids have different priorities than even 5 years ago and it's not so much about a challenge as games used to be, or skill and improving until you're good; it's just like watching a movie for entertainment that happens to last 20+ hours for sp (if you're lucky) and longer for mp.

So as an effect of this the games are dumbed down and appeal to the mass market and lets face it, people on the whole are not that smart. This dumbing down may be making the game more complex for fps's with unlocks etc which is just giving one person an unfair advantage. So in that respect the goals have shifted from attempting to get better at the game to improve your k:dr to the easier option of unlocking something rediculously overpowered (or buying it in DLC's which seems to be the latest thing) to make you artificially good. Take Jets in BF3 Beta for example, if you have heatseaking missiles and everyone else doesn't you're pretty much going to dominate any server in the jets at present as they're so much better than the MG and it's going to be very hard to unlock that if you're a late comer to the real game as the MG on jets is pretty pathetic.

With strategy games the exact same thing is happening except the dumbing down and making the game easier is made by simplifying everything.

IMHO there still hasn't been better FPS's than CS:S or BF2 since (and they'e infact getting worse like COD) and those games are 6+ years old now. As for strategy, Total war is nothing nowadays in ciommparison to the first few games.

Thenj there's the issue of graphics which in FPS's especially seem to detract from gameplay more and more becuase they look shiny.
 
You don't have to avail of all of the features if you don't like them, they are called choices for a reason! Why you would want less choice in a game is a mystery to me tho, I love being able to customise the way I play games. Adds replay value being able to try a different playstyle.
 
I think the op means that content is being shoe horned in as a cheap hook to keep people playing and to disguise a lack of depth. I played RTCW/ET and CS for years and years - the gameplay and leanring curve alone were enough. With CoD and BC I found little reason to continue after unlocking everything - the gameplay alone wasn't enough and if anything was dumbed down compared to games 10+ years old.
 
I know what you're getting at, to me modern warfare 2 is a bad example of over complexity.

It had shotgun snipers for **** sake, they obviously didn't spend a lot of time niggling it out over the different complexities of the weaponry.

Call of Duty since 4 has just been a exercise of throwing **** at a wall and seeing what sticks.
 
Warbie said:
I think the op means that content is being shoe horned in as a cheap hook to keep people playing and to disguise a lack of depth. I played RTCW/ET and CS for years and years - the gameplay and leanring curve alone were enough. With CoD and BC I found little reason to continue after unlocking everything - the gameplay alone wasn't enough and if anything was dumbed down compared to games 10+ years old.
Click to expand...

yes I feel that games are being over cusotmsied...xtra options, extra perks,extra moves, extra animations, extra dlc, extra this extra that

BUT at expense of the core gameplay? Or just overwhelming for a pick up and play fun game.

How good was Desert combat BF, how good was COD1,2 MW1 to a point, how good was Counter strike, how good was bf:veintam. These games were as good as choose a server, chosse a class, play the game.


ALso,things liek destructible environment and excess foliage, excess scenery whilst in some respects improve the game in others they make it harder to see whats going on and take away from the shooter element somewhat.

THough it jsut depends I mean I like the new stuff but is also miss the pick up and play addictiveness off old games.

So many games have to learn excess things, like fifa add in special defensive moves, skills etc...u need to know 50 different combos to play a footy game when it used to just be pass and shoot.

its liek football manager pekaed back in 2000-2002 now they add in all these interveiws, press stuff, training, etc...etc...the game is not as good though it has advanced...well i kinda liek it now but it takes a while to get into an is much slower


Sure if you have the time I guess its great you can get really deep into games and stuff but if you just want no brainer fun its not so easy to find.
 
Last edited:
Alternatively, download and play Eve Online for a couple of months. When you start playing other games again everything will seem simple.
 
if you miss the older simple games so much... why don't you go play them?

as you said about goldeneye - you'll find a lot of games you loved as a kid seem crap now (not that i'm saying i personally find goldeneye crap). this is just because everything seemed more awesome when you were young.

i don't think overcomplexity is ruining games, there is a "complexity spectrum" and there are games at both ends of it, as well as somewhere in the middle. take the recent total war games for example - you can miss out all the battles, and automanage the settlements and the game is very simple. or you can do every battle yourself, manage all your building etc and learn all the battle tactics.

it's not complexity - it's PLAYER CHOICE. there is a difference.
 
compboyo said:
its not really complexity..its OTTity.....too much needless crap
Click to expand...

if it's needless crap then just ignore it. like in MW2 or black ops. i loved trying out all the guns and perks and figuring out what worked best for me, but if you can't be bothered then just choose randomly and stick with it. everything is reasonably balanced in most games so it doesn't matter, and if it's not then surely the lack of balance, rather than the abundance of choice, is the fundamental problem?
 
SheepBeast said:
if you miss the older simple games so much... why don't you go play them?

as you said about goldeneye - you'll find a lot of games you loved as a kid seem crap now (not that i'm saying i personally find goldeneye crap). this is just because everything seemed more awesome when you were young.

i don't think overcomplexity is ruining games, there is a "complexity spectrum" and there are games at both ends of it, as well as somewhere in the middle. take the recent total war games for example - you can miss out all the battles, and automanage the settlements and the game is very simple. or you can do every battle yourself, manage all your building etc and learn all the battle tactics.

it's not complexity - it's PLAYER CHOICE. there is a difference.
Click to expand...

yep, old games:

1. the graphics suck

2. theres no players online

3. the +ves of progress in newer games means they are missed when playing old games

4. Memory sure was fonder back then

5. I was younger


I think games are progressing nicely. But I think they are just going OTT with a lot off games. I mean MW2 for me was a joke off a game. Whreas MW1 was nice balance of simple shooter plus extras.

Its like borderlands says it all they base there advert on the fact the game has 10000000000+ gusn or whatever....thats what they sell games on now.

Not this game has great story or playability but no this game has 47000 unlocks, 25 kill streaks, 3000 upgradable mods for your wepaons, 200 different weapons, plus 7 DLC packs within next 6 months at a cost of 10 pound per DLC, plus pre oredr for extra eclusive perks, special limted edition perk where you unlcok 45000 more perks than anyone else just buy pre oredering the special perk pre order perky derky smerky perk da perk limited gold edition, also comes with 73 bonus weapons with 45 unique exclusive mods, the game also fetaure 700045454 different online modes and 1000000338 unique ways you can play this game, we have specially designed pad you can use your feet, hands, ass or 3rd leg to play this game, inculding special 3d glasses so you feel like you are in the action comes with limited edition gold plated 3d glasses in special 3d pre order pack which can only be pre order 3 days before release...in gmae players with new created models have unique animation and can move in 720 degrees and 7 different planes, circular dynamic movements, including flying upside down quick jumps, auto fast reload, extreme sniper mode 200xxx, flying tiger shotgun scope modeled with RPG grenade explosive time detonated plasma attacks.
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom