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Apple v Epic...ding ding round 1

Discussion in 'Mobile and Tablet Games' started by hyperseven, 13 Aug 2020.

  1. Mekrel

    Soldato

    Joined: 2 Aug 2004

    Posts: 7,162

    Location: Buckinghamshire

    You're right they don't make game streaming apps, but they very much get turnover from native games on the iOS store that xCloud would eat into. You can get PUBG, COD and the like on mobile that have IAPs that have to use the Apple payment system so they can take a 30% cut. Those sort of games are massive with over 100M installs on Android alone for just COD and I would imagine that both the install number and/or gross turnover of COD on iOS will be larger than that, considering Apple users buy more from the app store vs Android users from Google Play.

    There is literally no other logical reason why Apple won't allow game streaming services. Obviously Apple won't admit that's the case and they'll hide behind the guise that it's down to "user experience concerns".
     
  2. hyperseven

    Sgarrista

    Joined: 1 May 2013

    Posts: 8,262

    Location: M28

    It seems Apple have kicked epic off their development programme. So won't this will hurt app devs that unreal as their engine of choice? (I haven't the foggiest on Apple app development)
     
  3. b0rn2sk8

    Sgarrista

    Joined: 9 Mar 2003

    Posts: 9,275

    They haven’t kicked them off, they gave them 14 days to sort their apps out.

    No, apps are developed as standalone so it only effects epic themselves.
     
  4. hyperseven

    Sgarrista

    Joined: 1 May 2013

    Posts: 8,262

    Location: M28

    Sorry, it was just a tweet I read.

    They have until the 28th to sort it out.

    So games on iOS don't use unreal? Thought it was on everything.
     
  5. b0rn2sk8

    Sgarrista

    Joined: 9 Mar 2003

    Posts: 9,275

    Games do use unreal but they are sandboxed on the device and don’t share resources. Kicking off epic as a publisher isn’t suddenly going to mean loads of other games also stop working.

    Where it will get tricky is if epic decides to stop supporting/developing the iOS version of the game engine because of this spat. That will have an impact on 3rd party developers, but that’s ultimately an agreement between epic and the developer and not Apple.
     
  6. HACO

    Wise Guy

    Joined: 6 Oct 2009

    Posts: 2,334

    This doesn’t hurt existing apps that use it, but hurts further development on iOS (new titles, new Unreal engine releases). Unreal engine on iOS is a huge deal. No Unreal on iOS means a lot of developers will re-evaluate whether they want to use Unreal at all and may look into alternatives.

    I think Epic has no choice but to give in.
     
  7. mrochester

    Soldato

    Joined: 29 Sep 2003

    Posts: 5,632

    Location: Newcastle upon Tyne

    Does anyone know why epic defines the iOS app market as something different to the android app market and the playstation app market?

    Aren't they all just app markets?
     
  8. HACO

    Wise Guy

    Joined: 6 Oct 2009

    Posts: 2,334

    They make the same claims about the Google Play market.

    Their CEO said the difference between mobile platforms and game consoles is that game consoles are sold at no margin, so Sony and Microsoft take their profits from the video games, while the phone industry is highly profitable and don’t need to take extra from the app/gaming revenues. I don’t think there’s any validity in this logic. And Nintendo sells their devices at similar margins to Apple’s, they also charge 30% and Epic has no issues.

    Real reason: Tencent’s WeChat app is iOS and Android, not PlayStation and Xbox.
     
  9. mrochester

    Soldato

    Joined: 29 Sep 2003

    Posts: 5,632

    Location: Newcastle upon Tyne

    Would stand up in a court of law? Can you be too profitable?
     
  10. HACO

    Wise Guy

    Joined: 6 Oct 2009

    Posts: 2,334

    Highly unlikely.

    Sony and Microsoft (despite their unhappiness with Apple on App Store policies) are also not siding with Epic here.
     
  11. mrochester

    Soldato

    Joined: 29 Sep 2003

    Posts: 5,632

    Location: Newcastle upon Tyne

    It seems like an odd argument to make in that it doesn't even make sense.
     
  12. Rilot

    Don

    Joined: 18 Oct 2002

    Posts: 21,005

    Location: Wargrave, UK

    Based on what I'm hearing the kids in the plaground say (I work in a school), this is hurting Apple's rep more than Epic's.
    "Oh, you've got an iPhone? Nah, they're crap. Get a Samsung for Fortnite"
     
  13. Pigeon_Killer

    Caporegime

    Joined: 21 Nov 2005

    Posts: 36,238

    Location: Cornwall

    That may be the case but considering Epic have gone back to court to argue that Apple's decision to block Fortnite from the app store has potentially caused irreversible damage to the brand it still looks like a massive own goal by Epic.

    EPIC: Breach contract, have a ready made legal challenge prepared against Apple, turn it in to a PR stunt = Profit :cool:
    Reality: Breach contract, have a ready made legal challenge prepared against Apple, turn it in to a PR stunt = Lose 60% of your Apple user base and go crying back to the judge :o
     
  14. Yaayuh!

    Capodecina

    Joined: 5 Nov 2010

    Posts: 21,875

    What a sad state of affairs :( . Kids these days..
     
  15. VortexA1

    Wise Guy

    Joined: 14 Nov 2006

    Posts: 2,409

    Location: Shoeburyness,England

    That makes sense, children are probably obsessed with fortnite so that would go over brand loyalty.
     
  16. goldy6660

    Gangster

    Joined: 12 Jun 2016

    Posts: 273

    Location: North West

    It actually surprises me that apple dont do a counter and back something as a competitive approach to fortnight along the same lines like pubg (obvs better) or other.
     
  17. Scougar

    Capodecina

    Joined: 30 Jan 2007

    Posts: 13,458

    Location: PA, USA

    What's the latest on this?
     
  18. b0rn2sk8

    Sgarrista

    Joined: 9 Mar 2003

    Posts: 9,275

    Nothing really, most of the suits in other countries got dismissed and told them to sort it out in the USA.

    A few tit for tat exchanges on social media.

    A few more companies looking to take advantage have piled on (Tile and Spotify) but no one really knows which way it is going to go.
     
  19. hyperseven

    Sgarrista

    Joined: 1 May 2013

    Posts: 8,262

    Location: M28

    Last thing I heard Apple were demanding all sorts or sales figures from Steam who wanted nothing to do with this and think the judge said they needed to hand over such information :confused:
     
  20. Scougar

    Capodecina

    Joined: 30 Jan 2007

    Posts: 13,458

    Location: PA, USA

    At that point it is Apple attempting to leach off of Valve.