Are earnings too low / living costs getting too high??

dr_volki said:
actually i think it's not that idiotic, however quite a lot of changes will need to happen for it to become viable.
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so it's not viable to rent with the current meta. this meta will never change. therefore it is idiotic to suggest people don't buy but rent.

you need to put those changes in place first. then you can say renting is better than buying. otherwise what he is suggesting is lunacy.

Also if everyone is renting, who owns all these properties? Germany and Switzerland are 2 affluent countries with a huge disparity in wealth. Basically the West Germans own all the houses in the East? So the guys in the West enjoy their Porsches whilst those in the East drive a VW. Renting isn't exactly a solution to disparity in wealth but house ownership is. As you can pass that house on.
 
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regulus said:
Never used to, but I started after realizing that a lot of the stuff I've seen in there are brand new or worn-once type clothes. Used to live next to a Salvation Army shop and got to know some of the volunteers in there. All of them buy their clothes there now. Most of my clothes are actually designer stuff, but only 2nd hand bought. Probably worn no more than your average 'new' clothes being tried on in store about 10+ times by others.
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I know of one shop which sells second hand designer stuff but never been in myself.

I have heard of people especially women from the new younger generation that buy all their clothes online. Go on holiday and keep all the tags on their dresses, etc and tuck them in (or safety pin them in if need be) and then when they go back home return it all. So they got brand new holiday clothes for free. I don't have the brass neck to do that but I did find it ingenious. The only thing women can't return is underwear or jewelry, etc.
 
rubberduck said:
You dont need to spend vast sums of money to get enjoyment out of life.... Plenty of people in 3rd world countries with no smart phones and sky TV who are much more content that you or I am... I am not saying cut modern tech off completely but is very easy to get 'good enough' tech these days while being froogle.
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some 3rd world countries have better weather then us and therefor have plenty of outdoor activities they can do for free
 
I don't know if this has already been posted, but yes clearly living costs are getting too high. We have a ridiculous situation where bricks and mortar houses are earning more than their owners. I mean seriously, wtf? :confused:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/property/house-prices/does-house-make-money-year-do-day-job/
In one in three areas of the UK, properties have increased in value more than the the average net earnings of the people who live in them, according to new research from Halifax. This is up from 28pc of local authorities in 2015.
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If that is not a ****ed-up economy then I don't know what is. There's a house around the corner from me that has "earned" roughly £90k a year for the last 6 years or so, it's easy to work out from the sold prices on Zoopla etc. Utter, utter madness and it doesn't just apply to London as most people think.
 
Almost all the new properties around here are marketed with their rent potential as the major selling point - just seems really wrong to me.
 
Psycho Sonny said:
2 people earning the median wage should quite easily be able to afford a £200K property once they have a 10% deposit together.

however they won't be able to buy new BMW's every 3 years, go on luxury holidays every 3 months, etc. but they should have a comfortable lifestyle, so long as they aren't stupid with their money.

changing from buying the latest iphone every year to a moto G and a giffgaff sim for instance would save the average person £600 a year per person, which would be their mortgage paid for 2 months with the savings.
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show us a house for 200k in london...
 
Psycho Sonny said:
Also if everyone is renting, who owns all these properties? Germany and Switzerland are 2 affluent countries with a huge disparity in wealth. Basically the West Germans own all the houses in the East? So the guys in the West enjoy their Porsches whilst those in the East drive a VW. Renting isn't exactly a solution to disparity in wealth but house ownership is. As you can pass that house on.
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i'm not sure about the swiss market, but in Germany it isn't as easy to buy as it is in the UK. Much higher % deposits are required, which is mostly achievable.
also houses aren't just owned by private investors. there are housing associations, funds, etc.
but the main difference is there are different rules to renting and the tenant is a bit better protected i.e. the rent can only change every 3/4 years and then it's tied to house value, etc.

some things may have changed as i haven't kept up with the german law :p

it would require some real work by the government to change, which we know it won't. ;)
 
FoxEye said:
So which of these things _should_ you ditch in order to have enough to put a roof over your head?

TV (Prime/Netflix is fine, ditch Sky)
Broadband
Phone
Car
Computer
Holiday (Have 1 every 2 years and spread the cost)
Smart clothes (lol, really?)
Eating out/take-away (Easy way to claim £££ back)
Going out (limit this to 1 per month)

Because down here there are people with only 1 or 2 things from that list, who pay 75% of their wages on rent, and basically subsist.

A lot here on this forum have always been middle-class, and have no idea how much of a struggle earning a low wage really is.

"Oh you could just ditch Sky and have heaps of money left over then."

No. No you couldn't. Plenty down here working full time jobs just to pay the rent, with few/none of the luxuries on that list.
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jonneymendoza said:
show us a house for 200k in london...
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As has been mentioned, take london out, and the median drops to around 24k, and outside a london there are plenty of homes at that sort of price outside of london.

A question, are people not earning more because they're not working harder or willing to make the sacrifices to achieve more? Or is it that there are no jobs available? Or that people expect to earn more than the commensurate salary for that particular position offers? Or something else altogether? Lack of training??

There are a huge amount of jobs out there that pay a modest salary up to more significant salaries. Even the modest salaries are way above the average. So why is there such a shortfall for so many people's lives? Are people also not willing to make the sacrifices for luxuries and thus have more outgoings than the average? Are people in more debt (without taking into considering mortgages) than the average?
 
Then train fares would skyrocket instead and the cesspool that is the British public on these migrations is depressing enough. Amazing eh.
 
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Freefaller said:
As has been mentioned, take london out, and the median drops to around 24k, and outside a london there are plenty of homes at that sort of price outside of london.

A question, are people not earning more because they're not working harder or willing to make the sacrifices to achieve more? Or is it that there are no jobs available? Or that people expect to earn more than the commensurate salary for that particular position offers? Or something else altogether? Lack of training??

There are a huge amount of jobs out there that pay a modest salary up to more significant salaries. Even the modest salaries are way above the average. So why is there such a shortfall for so many people's lives? Are people also not willing to make the sacrifices for luxuries and thus have more outgoings than the average? Are people in more debt (without taking into considering mortgages) than the average?
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Around a lot of the South West there has been significant wage stagnation or suppression while house prices have risen significantly sometimes doubled or more. It isn't just about luxuries but the affordability of a lifestyle that is commensurate with a wage.
 
Freefaller said:
There are a huge amount of jobs out there that pay a modest salary up to more significant salaries. Even the modest salaries are way above the average. So why is there such a shortfall for so many people's lives? Are people also not willing to make the sacrifices for luxuries and thus have more outgoings than the average? Are people in more debt (without taking into considering mortgages) than the average?
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It's poor money management and poor decisions.

Put it this way their is a girl in the team beside mine. She only just moved out her mums house 6 months ago (where she paid a small figure in digs) into rented accommodation and has taken up a second job at the weekends because she is in tons of debt and keeps on taking things out on finance. She also moved in with her boyfriend and he pays most of the bills. She has around half of her annual wage (before deductions) on credit card loans and it's been this way for years. Her car finance deal just ended and now she wants to take out another (sop she pays one loan off and straight away takes out another). When I overheard this I said "you love your credit don't you?" and she took the huff.

She isn't willing to learn from her mistakes. She wants everything and she wants it now.

She could have a home (on mortgage), a car owned outright with no debt like myself but rather keep on spending on finance / credit cards and work 2 jobs.

Whilst living at home with her mum she should have had zero debts and a healthy bank balance (savings). But it's the complete opposite. I doubt she will ever learn.
 
jonneymendoza said:
i work in LONDON and dont want to spend over an hour commuting to work.
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I used to commute over an hour to work around 10 years ago. An hour in the morning then another in the evening. it wasn't that bad. I would hate to have to do it now as my work is only 12 minutes away. But it's easily do-able.

You could get a job elsewhere, Birmingham for instance. However people that live in London like to think the only place to be is London. I hate the place. It's a cesspit. Nose to Nose standstill traffic no matter what time of day. I'd rather live anywhere else than a hugely overpopulated city. Bangkok is the same thing in Thailand, it's actually quicker to walk than take a taxi. Why would you choose to live somewhere like that. We had to queue for 3 hours to get into a car park once in London. LMAO why would anyone want to do that on a regular basis. Getting out would be the best thing you could do.
 
dr_volki said:
i'm not sure about the swiss market, but in Germany it isn't as easy to buy as it is in the UK. Much higher % deposits are required, which is mostly achievable.
also houses aren't just owned by private investors. there are housing associations, funds, etc.
but the main difference is there are different rules to renting and the tenant is a bit better protected i.e. the rent can only change every 3/4 years and then it's tied to house value, etc.

some things may have changed as i haven't kept up with the german law :p

it would require some real work by the government to change, which we know it won't. ;)
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Rent in Germany is still capped to local market rates, and can't be increased more than once every few years. Buying is just as 'easy' as in the UK, but because the government regulates the industry effectively, the housing market is fairly safe and steady with low-single digit growth, coupled with the high transaction costs (7+% sales tax for starters) property just isn't the default get-rich-quick-if-you-have-a-deposit ponzi scheme like the UK. Life as a tenant is *much* nicer than the UK as well.

Unfortunately, until the people that are getting screwed by the property market get out and vote, and the people that are gaining from it are still around, nothing is going to change.
 
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