Of course you would. People don't generally like to think ill of themselves.
Are earnings too low / living costs getting too high??
- Thread starter Buffman
- Start date
Of course you would. People don't generally like to think ill of themselves.
Soldato
- Joined
- 30 Sep 2005
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Supply and demand
House prices are crazy high, yet every builder within a 50 mile radius of me are selling them before they are even built.
We bought our house 10 years ago and the main road near us has had four new build development sites since then. Each and every house sold straight away.
Where there's the tiniest of spaces a house will be built and sold.
House prices are crazy high, yet every builder within a 50 mile radius of me are selling them before they are even built.
We bought our house 10 years ago and the main road near us has had four new build development sites since then. Each and every house sold straight away.
Where there's the tiniest of spaces a house will be built and sold.
Soldato
its a lot of foreign investors buying properties here to then rent it out 
its a lot of foreign investors buying properties here to then rent it out
Yep, and they are having a field day since the pound tanked...
I find it hilarious/incredibly sad and ironic that the Brexit vote has just enabled more rich foreigners to buy up our land and property as everything is cheaper for them now!
Associate
http://www.countryliving.co.uk/wildlife/countryside/news/a1437/uk-least-affordable-cities/
http://www.zoopla.co.uk/discover/fe...ffordable-places-to-live/#2rG5QkqRJaLUDHCv.97
The average home in Oxford is x10.7 average salary, in Copeland it is x3.
No more houses can be built in within Oxford itself without destroying its heritage and open spaces; surely this price is the market trying to redistribute people to less attractive areas? Not saying this is right as children may not be able to buy homes near their families when the time comes, but once a city has hit a saturation point, what is next? Demolishing low-density housing and replacing with high-density high-rise rabbit hutches?
http://www.zoopla.co.uk/discover/fe...ffordable-places-to-live/#2rG5QkqRJaLUDHCv.97
The average home in Oxford is x10.7 average salary, in Copeland it is x3.
No more houses can be built in within Oxford itself without destroying its heritage and open spaces; surely this price is the market trying to redistribute people to less attractive areas? Not saying this is right as children may not be able to buy homes near their families when the time comes, but once a city has hit a saturation point, what is next? Demolishing low-density housing and replacing with high-density high-rise rabbit hutches?
Associate
It's not Brexit that has caused this, other countries have mandated that property cannot be sold to speculative foreign investors when demand is so high locally. Additionally, the UK has very low taxation on capital, making it much more attractive to foreign investors or those looking to hide their money overseas.
So you don't think the large devaluation in the pound (ie making everything ~20% cheaper) has made UK property even more attractive to foreign property investors?
Caporegime
Yep, we bought the flat off-plan as soon as it was avaialble, we were waiting outside the sales office with all the relevant paperwork ready. The flat didn't even have all it's walls up at that point. 0_o
Soldato
A lot are being sold for BTL
there was a new development near me and like 80-90% of them popped up as available to rent shortly after selling - it amused me as most were sold furnished and being rented out as unfurnished - looks like the new landlords basically tore out anything not nailed down and probably ebayed for extra cash lol.
Soldato
the first landlord I had, he has... over 40 houses(talking 500k+ houses) doted all over north london.. (woodgreen, aly pally etc)
Soldato
wtfthe first landlord I had, he has... over 40 houses(talking 500k+ houses) doted all over north london.. (woodgreen, aly pally etc)
Associate
I don't just think that; the evidence backs it up.
Average house price June 2016 = £215,182. Average house price January 2017 = £218,255. http://landregistry.data.gov.uk/app/ukhpi/explore
So 1.4% increase since Brexit, if demand went up massively as you say, this would be higher.
Man of Honour
I think it comes down to a few things.
As people earn more, they buy more expensive homes, so the ratio of earning / house is always going to be tight.
Different parts of the country have different housing values and people have different purchasing power. Some people don't want to live in some parts of the world, some do. As money moves to those parts the price goes up.
A lot of people earn London/City wages but live in the countryside, or way away from the City, their purchasing power is going to be higher. Unfortunately that's just the way it is.
The problem is it is a bit of a bubble - will it burst? I don't know. IT is incredibly tough to buy where you want to be - we couldn't afford to live in London, so we moved out. That said, we're still in the home counties and pure commuter belt so prices are still high, but you get a lot more for your money, plus we didn't really want to live in London anymore.
It took us many years to save up (including a very small inheritance from my late grandmother) - but we had the advantage of being 2 people. We live(d) a very modest life, despite this, I sit back and wish I could get all the work on the house done that I want (all the nice things, like new roof, new double glazing, redecorating, garden...) but I realise how hugely fortunate we are to be where we are - but we have sacrificed a lot and worked hard, I'm not suggesting others don't, though there are some that do want their cake and eat it.
We are high on the earning (despite not earning a lot, honestly) scale if you believe that scale, but then the skew is so high as the people in the top percentage are earning exorbitant amounts of money. I don't resent them, I don't want to be them, or work the silly hours they work (I work long hours as it is!) - but it does skew the stats.
I just don't know what to suggest to people - I guess staying at home, or renting with friends is the best way of being frugal with your money - but you cannot deny yourself a life/existence... but you have to ask yourself if owning a home right now is more important or not.
Or, the country could adopt a more European approach to home ownership, with long term leases such as they do in France/Germany and so on. When we were still living in France and other places, we rented (well my parents did) and yet it was "their" home - and rents were a very reasonable percentage. Then again I rented a flat in France, and it was a studio around 4/5m by 4/5m. Not big. And that was my existence for a little while. You get used to it, and forgo a lot of material things - but it's amazing how you amass stuff when you have the space to.
As people earn more, they buy more expensive homes, so the ratio of earning / house is always going to be tight.
Different parts of the country have different housing values and people have different purchasing power. Some people don't want to live in some parts of the world, some do. As money moves to those parts the price goes up.
A lot of people earn London/City wages but live in the countryside, or way away from the City, their purchasing power is going to be higher. Unfortunately that's just the way it is.
The problem is it is a bit of a bubble - will it burst? I don't know. IT is incredibly tough to buy where you want to be - we couldn't afford to live in London, so we moved out. That said, we're still in the home counties and pure commuter belt so prices are still high, but you get a lot more for your money, plus we didn't really want to live in London anymore.
It took us many years to save up (including a very small inheritance from my late grandmother) - but we had the advantage of being 2 people. We live(d) a very modest life, despite this, I sit back and wish I could get all the work on the house done that I want (all the nice things, like new roof, new double glazing, redecorating, garden...) but I realise how hugely fortunate we are to be where we are - but we have sacrificed a lot and worked hard, I'm not suggesting others don't, though there are some that do want their cake and eat it.
We are high on the earning (despite not earning a lot, honestly) scale if you believe that scale, but then the skew is so high as the people in the top percentage are earning exorbitant amounts of money. I don't resent them, I don't want to be them, or work the silly hours they work (I work long hours as it is!) - but it does skew the stats.
I just don't know what to suggest to people - I guess staying at home, or renting with friends is the best way of being frugal with your money - but you cannot deny yourself a life/existence... but you have to ask yourself if owning a home right now is more important or not.
Or, the country could adopt a more European approach to home ownership, with long term leases such as they do in France/Germany and so on. When we were still living in France and other places, we rented (well my parents did) and yet it was "their" home - and rents were a very reasonable percentage. Then again I rented a flat in France, and it was a studio around 4/5m by 4/5m. Not big. And that was my existence for a little while. You get used to it, and forgo a lot of material things - but it's amazing how you amass stuff when you have the space to.
Even if you decide that owning a home is not important... you will likely pay *more* in rent than a mortgage would cost!
Now certain people here applaud BTL landlord's as "risk takers", "entrepreneurs", "smart investors", etc. But there is nothing entrepreneurial about using buying up all the housing stock, knowing full well that everybody *must* have a house to live in. Where exactly is the "risk"? They can pick and choose their tenants, evict them with as little as two weeks notice if they object to yearly rent increases... And we know now that the government will not allow the housing bubble to burst, no matter what. BTL landlords can put up rent to astronomical levels, knowing that demand is insatiable and that the government will help their tenants pay these exorbitant rents! Housing benefit now costs the UK govt almost £30 billion a year.
The entrepreneurial spirit is seeing a gap in the market, innovating to produce a new product, or doing something differently. Being a BTL landlords is not clever. Not innovative. They are exploiting their good fortune in having sufficient capital to invest in housing, often having started many years ago when housing was affordable. Now as the increase in renters and decrease in owners shows, those who don't already own property are frozen out of getting on the ladder. Meanwhile BTL can still use their existing properties to get mortgage terms the banks won't give to anyone else. The measures the govt has taken to reduce gaming the tax system don't address this. People with a few properties under their belt are now many times more likely to buy new housing than somebody who wants to live in that house.
But this is a "service" right? We should be grateful for BTL - and as mentioned, foreign property investors - who snap up all the new builds, because what we locals most want in all the world is to pay more in rent to them than they pay in mortgage repayments. It's a fantastic service and I'm super glad BTL landlords are here to provide it.
Anecdotal, sure, but around here and in neighbouring towns we've seen a lot of new-build estates go up. Walking around them it's funny (not) to see how many are now rented out, just another property in somebody's growing portfolio.
We really should stop applauding people who do this. It is not the kind of innovation that will drive this country forwards. It's simple opportunism. That's all. Opportunistic profiteering. To applaud these people for "investing well", "being smart", etc, and to call the neigh-sayers "jealous" really is insulting to our intelligence. I have no doubt things will get much worse. In a few years time we'll look back on today as a time when more people owned their own home than rented. Because in future, if current trends continue, not only will many of us be wage slaves to the landlords, we have have engineered through apathy a new Victorian era, with record homelessness, and perhaps even complete societal collapse.
Frankly that's not an exaggeration. When discontent grows and grows and inequality ever increasing, it's only a matter of time. By that time the BTL landlords need to have earned enough money to pay for their own private security forces.
Which would be great, but in reality as soon as house prices start to decline, developers stop building. Since they sub-contract all the work basically there is no penalty for them to stop building. The sub-contractors suffer and have to lay off staff, but the developers are fine. They just wait it out until prices start to rise again, then they will build.
That's another problem with letting the market decide everything. The market is self-serving.
The only way to build sufficient houses and to keep building when house prices start falling is if the govermment does the build itself. And owns the housing stock.
The second you rely on for-profit developers to build your houses, your suggestion falls down.
Totally agree. That's Thatcher Britain for you.
I'm not sure that they're entrepreneurs but I don't see the issue(in general) in someone investing in housing and providing it for rent. Certainly I do see some merit in curbing excesses and perhaps making allowances for first time buyers, reserving some properties on new developments for them along with affordable housing etc.. But the fact is that a rental market is still needed and so we need landlords willing to invest capital in providing that service. As for the risk there are plenty, they're exposed to risk from interest rates, rental market rates, the property market re: the value of their investment, changes in legislation and of course are liable to carry out repairs. Some of these risks can be offset somewhat others they have to accept. You seem to get a bit emotional about this subject which perhaps skews your perspective a lot.