Arsenal FC - A complete shambles. What needs to change? *Please read OP before posting*

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The board has spoken, time to get behind the manager & team and push on next season.

Sometimes this season being an Arsenal fan has been embarrassing, some of the footballing displays and fans attitudes have be disgraceful but lets put it behind us and hope we can strengthen and have a successful 17/18.
 
Tummy said:
Man, I'd love to be 'in a rut' in fifth place (the fifth best team in the country), having what ~20~ years of European football, competing for trophies.
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When your aim is to actually win things instead of just do well, which it's fair to say is Arsenal's objective - it's a rut.
 
Supporters want progress - it doesn't matter where you finish last season, they want to believe the team is moving forwards. Arsenal's problem isn't that they've done poorly in any given season because in reality they've not, they've just stood still for 10 years.
 
JOSH said:
The board has spoken, time to get behind the manager & team and push on next season.

Sometimes this season being an Arsenal fan has been embarrassing, some of the footballing displays and fans attitudes have be disgraceful but lets put it behind us and hope we can strengthen and have a successful 17/18.
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na forget the manager. im not backing him one bit. i want him gone!

not going to bother with arsenal anymore until wenger leaves
 
BaZ87 said:
Supporters want progress - it doesn't matter where you finish last season, they want to believe the team is moving forwards. Arsenal's problem isn't that they've done poorly in any given season because in reality they've not, they've just stood still for 10 years.
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If Klopp stays still with Liverpool for 5 years, will you want him out even though he's a good manager and plays good football? Its a tough decision. Say next season, you finish 5th, win a league cup and get knocked out in the last 8, will you stand by him?

jonneymendoza said:
not going to bother with arsenal anymore until wenger leaves
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"I agree"
 
B1gbeard said:
And yet still won the fa cup and finished 5th. I'm not sure how that equates to failure.

The issues came around the Bayern games which were pretty embarrassing but overall, when you take the first 25 games and last 8, we've actually played pretty well. You've just picked out the worst few games. You could do the same for almost any team.
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Sorry but I can't pick many teams that have been thrashed by Crystal Palace or knocked out of the Champions League by double figures. The FA Cup doesn't bear any significance on the club's finances or attracting/keeping players.

Arsenal have the means to compete with the best teams in Europe, highest season ticket prices and highest revenues yet consistently fail to challenge for the title or make any progress in the Champions League. Now they are going backwards.

jonneymendoza said:
na forget the manager. im not backing him one bit. i want him gone!

not going to bother with arsenal anymore until wenger leaves
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"I'll only bother with Arsenal when they're doing well"
 
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Yeah I know I remember the posts and in some points I agree with the WOB but the board have decided to keep him on so no amount of planes/AFTV interviews/ex players giving their opinion or losses on the pitch will change it (unless we loose our first 10 games anyway).

So there is no point not backing the team we have to live with the decision and support our club.
 
BaZ87 said:
Supporters want progress - it doesn't matter where you finish last season, they want to believe the team is moving forwards. Arsenal's problem isn't that they've done poorly in any given season because in reality they've not, they've just stood still for 10 years.
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How is that any different to Liverpool, who have managed to be completely mediocre while playing the manager merry go round for years and years? I'd rather Arsenal's last 20 years and where we are at the mo over Liverpool any day.
 
As much as im an outsider and do think wenger should go, the fact you won a cup is somthing that ourselves and teams above you didnt manage, the lack of respect the cups get from fans and some clubs quite frankly is shocking.

Players want to win trophies yet they claim some cups aren't worthy cause it's not a league title or Europe trophy, fans kick off if clubs don't take it seriously then some fans want a cup run.

As a club,player,manager you want trophies weather it's a cup or league etc you want to make history of trophies NOT just finishing 4th or being financially sound. Arsenal just won the fa cup so in reality your season wasn't that bad just most your fans would chuck away the cup for 4th or for Wenger to go which is pathetic
 
Trusty said:
If Klopp stays still with Liverpool for 5 years, will you want him out even though he's a good manager and plays good football? Its a tough decision. Say next season, you finish 5th, win a league cup and get knocked out in the last 8, will you stand by him?
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As I said, it's about progress. If after 4 seasons we're still hovering in the same position and there's no sign that we're getting nearer to the top then fans will want a change. That's not to mean he'd have done a bad job. Discounting another Leicester scenario, we're still in a position now where Liverpool (or Arsenal) have 5 other sides that in any season could finish above them. All 6 sides can't qualify for the CL let alone finish 1st - you have to look a bit deeper and ask yourself whether things are improving and if not, will they in the future.
B1gbeard said:
How is that any different to Liverpool, who have managed to be completely mediocre while playing the manager merry go round for years and years? I'd rather Arsenal's last 20 years and where we are at the mo over Liverpool any day.
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Why are you being so defensive? :confused:

If you read through my posts regarding Liverpool over the last 7 years or so you'll see I've been more critical of our club than anybody. Chopping and changing every 5 minutes most certainly isn't the answer but there's a huge jump from that to the situation at Arsenal. If Wenger had been at the club 2 seasons and there were signs that things were moving forwards then great. Can any Arsenal supporter say there's been progress at Arsenal in the past 10 years though? Looking from the outside I don't see it.

As I said, Arsenal haven't underperformed in any given season over those 10 years - they've always finished in the position they've supposed to be, give or take. The problem is that nothing is changing, there's no signs of progress and it's difficult to see if how things will improve under Wenger. If Arsenal fans are happy to finish between 5th-2nd every season, get to the last 16 of the CL and win a domestic cup every few years then fair enough but the growing unrest suggests they're not.

Two seasons ago you finished above Spurs but the general feeling was Spurs had the better season, why? It wasn't just because Spurs have fewer resources, it was because there was clear progress from Spurs. They were building a side and things were improving. Arsenal was the same old Arsenal, they'll threaten to challenge and then when it counts they'll fall away only to come back strong in the final weeks, when it's too little too late.
 
wildman said:
Conte, Pep, Mourhino, Klop and the Poch must be laughing knowing that the top 4 is sewn up again
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As someone pointed out, they can't all finish in the top four, and Arsenal finished above all those clubs last season. I don't think you can really judge a team or manager on a single season in any case.

I'm kind of ambivalent about the whole thing; on the one hand I can't really put my finger on a single primary issue within the team (Which points the finger towards the manager and his tactical/motivational abilities) but on the other hand in my view getting rid of a manager is only worthwhile if you bring in someone better and I'm not convinced they could do that without having to suffer a short term pain for rebuilding. As I said in the Wenger thread, at this stage the only manager I could see myself getting excited about would be Simeone and I don't think that was even on the cards.

My main hope is we do our transfer business early and that includes selling players like Alexis if he is going to go - I don't want another situation like 2011 where a saga drags on and then players leave at the start of the season in August without time to adequately rebuild.
 
B1gbeard said:
How do you define failure? Finishing 5th? That would suggest a team has a divine right to finish there. What would that make the last couple of decades for Spurs say? Or Liverpool? What's worse than failure I wonder.

Nor winning the league? Again that goes for pretty much everyone except the fantasy football billionaires.

So how do you define it? And 5 teams can't be laughing at a top 4 finish. :)

On the new deal it seems the sensible option at the moment. I'd like to have seen a new established team come in but not someone for the sake of it.
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Failure = having the most expensive tickets in the EPL and not being able to capitaliseon that revenue stream , getting smashed by a team that was relegation fodder and then having 10 goals put past you over 2 legs in the champions league. Your league position is worse than last year and the points gap between you and your nearest rivals was wide enough to drive a bus through. 11pts to spurs and 18 to chelsea. Please now explain how this equates to a successful season ? If you think this was a successful campaign/ season then Arsenal fans are easily pleased. Personally I feel sorry for your fans, they deserve more for the outrageous ticket prices they have to fork out. Did you know the only team in the whole of Europe with more expensive season tickets than Arsenal is PSG and at least they are fighting to win the league pretty much every season and make a good showing for themselves in Europe
 
BaZ87 said:
As I said, it's about progress. If after 4 seasons we're still hovering in the same position and there's no sign that we're getting nearer to the top then fans will want a change. That's not to mean he'd have done a bad job. Discounting another Leicester scenario, we're still in a position now where Liverpool (or Arsenal) have 5 other sides that in any season could finish above them. All 6 sides can't qualify for the CL let alone finish 1st - you have to look a bit deeper and ask yourself whether things are improving and if not, will they in the future.
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Yeah, this is what i mean. Say we had a bet that Liverpool wouldn't win the league in the next 10 years, i'll be honest, i'd fancy my chances with that bet in the current state. What would you prefer through those 10 years? Good exciting football with a good philosophy from top to bottom, paying relatively decent money for players rather through the nose, is that not something that should be commended by fans rather than seen as failure. The other side of the coin is you sack Klopp after 4 years, get someone new, sack them after 2 years because you've lost that exciting football and atmosphere you had when Klopp was in charge. It's a difficult one, that's what i see for Liverpool and i'm pretty sure there will be a bunch of Klopp loyalists that are saying the same thing with regards to the Arsene loyalists.

wildman said:
Failure = having the most expensive tickets in the EPL and not being able to capitaliseon that revenue stream
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The fans are buying the stadium for Kroenke, basically.
 
I'm pretty sure I answered that already. If supporters see and believe things are moving in the right direction then they'll give a manager time. The moment when you find yourself wondering how things will improve is the moment you start seeing unrest. Whether it's Arsenal or Liverpool, the objective has got to be challenging and winning the biggest titles - if you're happy with just playing nice football then you may as well support West Ham.
 
Geezus the amount of rubbish being spouted off in here by certain know it alls is staggering to say the least.

Meh not surprised Wenger is staying with us for another 2 yrs at least. Not overly enthused by the news but then we haven't got anyone lined up to take over from him. I know rumours were running wild about Tuchel from Dortmund as being a likely successor but I don't think there was any traction in that.

As for winning the FA cup?? Yes it was nice to win it again and another trophy in our cabinet. But I'd give it up for a PL trophy or even a CL trophy. But honestly it didn't make me overly happy winning it but I'm neither sad by winning it.

Anyhow just have to look forward to next season and hope we do better. But I just can't see how we will win a title with Wenger in charge. He buys players at the last minute and buys virtually unknown players then sends them out on loans. My biggest fear now is the likes of Sanchez who as of yet hasn't signed a contract extension. If he wants to go then best we get rid asap and get a decent price for him. Ozil I'm just not that bothered anymore if he stays or goes.

Without CL it's now going to be doubly difficult to get decent world class players to come join us, as most of them want CL football b
 
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