Assange to go!

One thing that has happened since these charges against Assange were made, is that we've all but stopped talking about the massacre of innocent civilians by USAF helicopter pilots.

Actually there's a longer, less cut version out and they WERE insurgents. The "apache massacre" thing is a short clip of a MUCH longer fight with the apache's in support. They stayed the in area and insurgents were moving around after which is when they opened up.

Yes kids were in the car but the chaps running around outside it certainly weren't innocent.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/July_12,_2007_Baghdad_airstrike now yup, could be more FUD to cover it but still...
 
[TW]Fox;22573109 said:
Russia Today is good at providing balanced news? Lol what?

By "balanced" I assume you mean "agrees with my personal bias"? Because the government funded Russia Today is far from balanced...

RT is good for another take on the news. If you're only getting a twist of the information from one source then you're only fooling yourself. Every media outlet has its own bias. Daily Mail, RT, BBC, Guardian, and Telegraph is often a good combination. Although more often than not after reading them you realise there isn't actually any facts and it's all baloney.

I'm still at odds as to what Ecuador get in return for safe-guarding Assange. With Police guarding the embassy door Assange will be handcuffed as soon as he steps out of the door.

If you play with fire, you're going to get burned.
 
I'm still at odds as to what Ecuador get in return for safe-guarding Assange. With Police guarding the embassy door Assange will be handcuffed as soon as he steps out of the door.

If you play with fire, you're going to get burned.


same for me..whats in it for ecuador? he is no great scientist or engineer who will benefit them..all you do is **** off your trading partners who buy bananas off you
 
Why do conspiracy theorists use religious thinking instead of scientific thinking when coming up their claims? You don’t take a conclusion and then try and find bits and bobs that support it, that is asinine. You look at the evidence, arrive at a theory based on it and then you try and DISPROVE your theory. If you can then it’s time to come up with another but if you can’t then (and only then) should you believe in it.

This conspiracy theory in my opinion has more holes than a kilo of Swiss cheese. Let’s just examine the claim being made here…..

“The British, Swedish and US government are fabricating a rape allegation against Julian Assange in order to extradite him to Sweden from where he will finally be extradited to the States (to be tortured, given life imprisonment or even the death penalty for his part in Wikileaks)"

Right now let’s try and cast doubt over that theory which IMO isn’t really that hard when you think about it. I put forth these three points which put significant dents in the theory above….

Why the detour?
If the ultimate aim is to get Assange to America, why don’t the UK just extradite him there themselves and cut out the middleman? The British-American extradition treaty is notoriously favourably to US officials who want to get their hands on a UK resident, just ask the parent of Gary McKinon or student Richard O'Dwyer. Sweden on the other hand don’t have anywhere near the same record of people being packed off to the United States to answer allegations from over the pond.

It would far easier for the US to get Assange extradited from the UK than it will be from one of the most liberal nations on the planet, Sweden.

The ends don’t justify the means
What’s being alleged by the conspiracy theory above is that three major world’s governments are colluding in a huge cover-up, involving the bribing or threatening of false rape victims into making claims against Assange for the sole purpose of extraditing a man who no longer poses any real threat to any of them. Assange is the founder of Wikileaks but clearly he’s not the one running the site now, so why risk losing all credibility, reputation and future retribution from international law just to ‘get’ a man who played one small part in something that annoyed you? Why not go after who’s ever running the site now and is at least causing an ‘active threat’ if you are going to risk your country engaging in such skullduggery?

Why fabricate such a poor crime?
As far as I understand it the rape allegations against Julian Assange are far from water-tight, there’s no physical evidence and ultimately the case will rely on the testimonies of two women versus what he says. Seems like a pretty rubbish thing to come up with if the idea is to smear Assange and get him convicted in Sweden; it would have been much easier for the police to have simply planted some kiddie porn on his hard drive; that way they would have physical evidence against him and not be relying on two people who at any point in the future could ‘spill the beans’ and reveal they were coerced into making the claims by the CIA (or whoever the conspiracy theorists believe instigated this). Only an idiot would come up with the idea of the current allegations if the true nature of this was to get Assange to ‘pay for what he did one way or another’.

It would be much easier to secure a conviction for child porn on his computer, would require no outside or non-officials witnesses who may screw up 'the plan' and carries an even dimmer view than rape does (hence being a better tool to smear him with).
 
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We should just let him sneak out of the country and let Ecuador deal with him, I'm sure they'll enjoy being 'liberated' by the USA.
 
I'm still at odds as to what Ecuador get in return for safe-guarding Assange. With Police guarding the embassy door Assange will be handcuffed as soon as he steps out of the door.

The Ecuadorian president probably appreciates the work Assange is doing in exposing the USA's antics. We can see from this story that nobody is immune as we wouldn't be making threats like these toward a foreign embassy if the USA wasn't pressuring us.

 
The Ecuadorian president probably appreciates the work Assange is doing in exposing the USA's antics. We can see from this story that nobody is immune as we wouldn't be making threats like these toward a foreign embassy if the USA wasn't pressuring us.


why pee off the usa when you export your bananas and coffee there..whether they like it or not the USA is the major trading market on that continent (even chavez in venezuela recognises this though he might not say it in public..PDVSA's still hauls oils straight up to Lake Charles/Baton Rouge as they are the largest source of cash on the continent..if you stop doing business with them you stop your main source of income)
 
Really do not understand why we are risking so much for that bloke. This could have very serious complications for our country, its citizens and people who will be in genuine need in the future. The bloke has done enough damage already no matter how good his intentions were. I bet Cristina is loving this and pushing a few buttons behind the scenes.
 
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because in a time of lies and deceit with every politician, banker and high power monkey waddling their hands in the cookie jar , him and his organisation were the only ones to bother to try and expose them for the cowards they really are.

We all know it, but we do nothing about it. Problem is the world governments are now in a bit of a pickle given that everyone in their right mind knows this allegation is complete bs and they cant just make him 'vanish' since so many damning questions will be asked that could turn into civil disorder pretty easily.

Im sorry you want to live under the sheets but really we don't half live in a completely screwed system and one day its gonna blow and i expect that time to be in our lifetime.
 
The Ecuadorian president probably appreciates the work Assange is doing in exposing the USA's antics. We can see from this story that nobody is immune as we wouldn't be making threats like these toward a foreign embassy if the USA wasn't pressuring us.


So the Ecuadorian government removed funding for the US Embassy then subsequently expelled the US ambassador and yet they are now criticizing us for threatening the principle of diplomacy for simply saying we might enter their building and take a Swedish fugitive.

How does that logic work?
 
Problem is the world governments are now in a bit of a pickle given that everyone in their right mind knows this allegation is complete bs and they cant just make him 'vanish' since so many damning questions will be asked that could turn into civil disorder pretty easily.

If so, please refute the points I raised in my last post...

Why do conspiracy theorists use religious thinking instead of scientific thinking when coming up their claims? You don’t take a conclusion and then try and find bits and bobs that support it, that is asinine. You look at the evidence, arrive at a theory based on it and then you try and DISPROVE your theory. If you can then it’s time to come up with another but if you can’t then (and only then) should you believe in it.

This conspiracy theory in my opinion has more holes than a kilo of Swiss cheese. Let’s just examine the claim being made here…..

“The British, Swedish and US government are fabricating a rape allegation against Julian Assange in order to extradite him to Sweden from where he will finally be extradited to the States (to be tortured, given life imprisonment or even the death penalty for his part in Wikileaks)"

Right now let’s try and cast doubt over that theory which IMO isn’t really that hard when you think about it. I put forth these three points which put significant dents in the theory above….

Why the detour?
If the ultimate aim is to get Assange to America, why don’t the UK just extradite him there themselves and cut out the middleman? The British-American extradition treaty is notoriously favourably to US officials who want to get their hands on a UK resident, just ask the parent of Gary McKinon or student Richard O'Dwyer. Sweden on the other hand don’t have anywhere near the same record of people being packed off to the United States to answer allegations from over the pond.

It would far easier for the US to get Assange extradited from the UK than it will be from one of the most liberal nations on the planet, Sweden.

The ends don’t justify the means
What’s being alleged by the conspiracy theory above is that three major world’s governments are colluding in a huge cover-up, involving the bribing or threatening of false rape victims into making claims against Assange for the sole purpose of extraditing a man who no longer poses any real threat to any of them. Assange is the founder of Wikileaks but clearly he’s not the one running the site now, so why risk losing all credibility, reputation and future retribution from international law just to ‘get’ a man who played one small part in something that annoyed you? Why not go after who’s ever running the site now and is at least causing an ‘active threat’ if you are going to risk your country engaging in such skullduggery?

Why fabricate such a poor crime?
As far as I understand it the rape allegations against Julian Assange are far from water-tight, there’s no physical evidence and ultimately the case will rely on the testimonies of two women versus what he says. Seems like a pretty rubbish thing to come up with if the idea is to smear Assange and get him convicted in Sweden; it would have been much easier for the police to have simply planted some kiddie porn on his hard drive; that way they would have physical evidence against him and not be relying on two people who at any point in the future could ‘spill the beans’ and reveal they were coerced into making the claims by the CIA (or whoever the conspiracy theorists believe instigated this). Only an idiot would come up with the idea of the current allegations if the true nature of this was to get Assange to ‘pay for what he did one way or another’.

It would be much easier to secure a conviction for child porn on his computer, would require no outside or non-officials witnesses who may screw up 'the plan' and carries an even dimmer view than rape does (hence being a better tool to smear him with).
 
because in a time of lies and deceit with every politician, banker and high power monkey waddling their hands in the cookie jar , him and his organisation were the only ones to bother to try and expose them for the cowards they really are.

We all know it, but we do nothing about it. Problem is the world governments are now in a bit of a pickle given that everyone in their right mind knows this allegation is complete bs and they cant just make him 'vanish' since so many damning questions will be asked that could turn into civil disorder pretty easily.

oh come on..he is a hypocrite in it to make money for himself..he was the first one to moan when some stuff was leaked about his own actions..surely he should understand that leaked information is for the greater good

friends trusted him and bailed him then he did a runner
he is no more principled than you or I
 
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oh come on..he is a hyporcrite in it to make money for himself..he was the first one to moan when some stuff was leaked about his own actions..surely he should understand that leaked information is for the greater good

friends trusted him and bailed him then he did a runner
he is no more principled than you or I

I'm not denying hes not a showman and I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of his motivations were around money.
But in the grand scheme of law and order in the world I feel quite strongly that we need people like him that has the balls to expose documents/stories in the manner he did.
 
because in a time of lies and deceit with every politician, banker and high power monkey waddling their hands in the cookie jar , him and his organisation were the only ones to bother to try and expose them for the cowards they really are.

We all know it, but we do nothing about it. Problem is the world governments are now in a bit of a pickle given that everyone in their right mind knows this allegation is complete bs and they cant just make him 'vanish' since so many damning questions will be asked that could turn into civil disorder pretty easily.

Im sorry you want to live under the sheets but really we don't half live in a completely screwed system and one day its gonna blow and i expect that time to be in our lifetime.

Yes, like most I know the world's corrupt and I know we, in the Western world, are that comfortably complacent that we will never challenge the status quo but that does not mean someone has to leak the necessary details for a few days titillation removing onto a rapid sense of apathy and in the process put people's lives at risk or execution or torture. There is always a balancing of right and wrong and what he did could have caused and most likely did in some cases cause great harm and to what benefit exactly. What good came from these leaks ... what exactly ... information we already knew deep down but anything tangible?

He has a charge to answer for. I personally think he did do something wrong I also think he was most likely set up to do something wrong. The two events are not mutually exclusive.
 
He has a charge to answer for. I personally think he did do something wrong I also think he was most likely set up to do something wrong. The two events are not mutually exclusive.

he has no charges laid against him though. all they want him for is questioning, but refuse to question him in the uk for some reason.
 
he has no charges laid against him though. all they want him for is questioning, but refuse to question him in the uk for some reason.

but isnt that the wierdest thing..wouldnt you take your chances in sweden rather then the uk.
 
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