Asus P5Q-E (P45) Motherboard Review

Well I ordered an E8400 last night, and a P5Q-E about 10 mins ago, so theres lots here for me to read up on haha!

A quick skim read through (in fact the post above me!) shows that with a bit of work can get a decent overclock indeed! I look forward to the challenge :)
 
Thanks all for the kind words, I'm glad to see a few people managed to extract any useful info from me burblings heh! :)

Apparently attaining a 500MHz-FSB on a Dual-Core is pretty easy according to most global forums but I did personally find it tough. Again on the same global forums I read that 600MHz-FSB is really where an E8400 should be at so I will have to check that out when my brain has come back from RMA! :p

For the past month or so I just been kicking back and have not been tweaking at all, happy just to go into user-mode and enjoy the machine. Windows 7 (RC1) works a treat on an overclocked Wolfdale/P5Q-E, pretty much just install and your done, highly recommended and available to download here

The overclocked machine has been running 24/7 without issue, fully loaded on both cores running Folding@Home and plenty of gaming sessions at night!

I imagine there is lots of life left in the LGA775 platform as it moves into the mainstream arena (i.e cheaper!) so I expect to see a few more P5Q-E beginners turning up for a while yet! ;)

window7p5qe.gif


window7p5qefolding.gif
 
Hey Pagkalis,

Welcome to OcUK :)

Heh you have a keen eye, actually I didn't do anything, that's Loadline Calibration doing it's thing, I guess running 2 instances of Folding@home doesn't require the full 1.280vCore and is happy to run with 1.272vCore. If I was to load up Prime or IBT then it would be 1.280vCore

I've bought another E8400 from MM that runs with slightly less juice than my present one so I'm hoping to get the volts down some more, not that Heat is a problem but it may shave off a few more watts and allow me to convert electricity bill funds into beer money and save the planet at the same time! :D
 
Oh, I see.

EDIT: ignore that, I just read your post in more detail.

Were you aware of this, regarding tRD (Performance Level)?
I've been trying the combinations but they don't seem to work so far.
 
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Are you happy that where you are now is a 24/7 setup?
Indeed I am considering I thought I was gonna be stuck at 3.6GHz/400MHz-FSB! :p

. . . having said that I know the processor has more to give, 4.25GHz for sure and maybe 4.5GHz at a real push so yeah I'm happy where I'm at but my overclocking spirit is goading me to push for more heh! ;)

Nice overclock you have there, that is indeed what I call a low latency system, those Crucial 10th Anniversary and Cellshocks use the same IC's I think, great memory that has served me well over the years and just keeps getting faster, preliminary testing has shown they are stable at 666MHz (DDR2-1332) @ 2.16vDimm but I'm scared to frag the sticks!

I'd also like to get time to test for max FSB, it seems like a logical step as I have memory that can run 600MHz and would be nice to see if the P5Q-E's Northbridge (P45) can actually run proper 24/7 stable so high, same goes for the Wolfdale! :)
 
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Actually mine can go up to 2.3v within warranty and 2.4 with a fan, according to some crazy people. It's this set.

That's right, I'd like to test 600FSB/600RAM 1:1, see what kind of bandwidth I can get.
Although, according to Anand, one may be able to get the same bandwidth with a lower tRD.
 
Found the NB GTL fairly easily and quickly and it's 8h45m stable on Prime Blend @ 470 with my Q9450 using 0.650 NB GTL. I can get 475 but it's not worth the extra volts as I have to move to PL11, which is slower overall (I'm using 2x2GB RAM).

I haven't found any benefit yet from tweaking the CPU GTLs. Maybe my Quad is happy on default, though it does need a fair amount of juice. I guess that's an early C1 stepping Quad for you.

I'd love to try one of the new Q9650s but can't justify the expense just for the sight of a 4Ghz quad core processor. I'm sure I'd see no difference in real life usage.

Bottom line thanks to the NB GTL tweaking my system is more stable than before thanks to Big Wayne's efforts explaining the unexplainable ;)

P
 
I managed to get my PC to boot after loosing all bios settings (bios update)

I'm at 4Ghz, I have both GTL refs at 0.630 and NB GTL at 0.620
CPU PLL at 1.54
FSB Term at 1.26
445*9
1069MHz memory

Thing is, if I go into bios, press F10, the screen just does not come back on, I had a read through at these GTL Ref's but I'm still confused, it's a hard subject for me, just like subnetting, takes me ages to get to grips with.
 
Having a go at reading through the last few pages... some pretty technical stuff that goes right over my head haha, but like others have said, Big Wayne you done a good job of simplifying it a bit! Especially those GTL refs, never heard of them before reading here haha. Should be getting this mobo and E8400 middle of this week, a few more days reading I think to get a great OC, Im used to upping the bus speed and messing with basic voltages... thats it! haha
 
Hi Guys,

Could anyone tell me what the following BIOS settings do? Ive tried to google but only seem to find setup details and not the info behind what they do...

DRAM Static Read Control (cant find anything too useful)
DRAM Read Training (Manual says disabled helps overclocking)
MEM OC Charger (Manual says enabled helps overclocking)
AI Clock Twister (over my head)
AI Transaction Booster (over my head)

TIA

ps3ud0 :cool:
 
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I had a read through at these GTL Ref's but I'm still confused, it's a hard subject for me, just like subnetting, takes me ages to get to grips with.
That's quite funny Will, that's the exact same comparison I made. I did a networking course years ago and struggled with Subnet Masking, I think GTL-Refs are about the same level of complexity! :o

Personally when I meet a subject that baffles me I just throw myself in the deep end. Most of the articles on GTL refs went straight over my head but I kept reading them again and again and slowly but surely some of it starts to stick! :cool:

I've just swapped out a retail E8400 for an OEM E8400 and interestingly enough the previous chips GTL settings are not quite right so it does seem these settings are on a per-chip-basis and one persons settings won't work for someone else!

My Board cannot run 500MHz-FSB stably with the three GTL settings on [Auto], I don't know if that is my specific board or combination of hardware or just the fact the P5Q-Family isn't finely tuned much above 400MHz-FSB?

Anyways I am doing some new GTL tweaking with my set-up and my previous (limited) experience and observations seem to be helping me on!

With GTL Data-ref0 set at x63 windows won't boot, at x64 it boots windows but fails IBT/5 loops,at x65 it passes 10 loops of IBT. All other GTL-Refs were on [Auto] at this point. I then started to do longer IBT runs (20 loops) and the PC rebooted so I turned my attention to the NB-GTL which was on [auto], I changed that to x62 and it passed IBT 20 loops again and again.

Still in the middle of testing but from what I have experienced so far these are my quick tips . . .

You don't need to pump vNB and vTT as much as people have made out, the maximum vNB I have needed so far is 1.22v, the maximum vTT I have needed is 1.18v, that's for 500MHz-FSB, 4.0GHz CPU, 562.5MHz-NBCC and DDR2-1200!

Another thing I have to mention (but not GTL related) is that CPU-PLL needs to be raised from 1.52v for certain chips once you really start pushing it. My first chip would reboot the system under stress with PLL set at 1.52 but stability was regained by upping the PLL. I only mention this because you see a lot of people saying PLL doesn't need to be raised. If your in doubt then just turn PLL to [auto] until you have time to test it further.

Regading GTL tweaks it seems the first CPU one needs to be raised (up from x63) and the NB GTL needs to be lowered (down from x63).

Since the current settings have passed Prime, IBT etc I have just left the machine to fold for a few days so I can build confidence it is robust before I push on the clock . . . below screenshot is now as the sun burns down on London town! :cool:

junebigwaynewolfdale.gif
 
DRAM Static Read Control [Disabled]
DRAM Read Training [Disabled]
MEM OC Charger [Enabled]
AI Clock Twister [Auto]
AI Transaction Booster [Auto] or manually set, this is known as tRD or Performance Level, lower the better.
Hey ps3ud0 , as you may be finding the BIOS on these boards is mind-blowing! :D

I have my own experiences of most of the options above except AI Clock Twister (light/lighter etc) which I have always left on [Auto]

The first two Memory options (static read and read training) did me no favours, in fact in some conditions my machine wouldn't boot with Static Read Control enabled? I'm not sure if this is because I was using DDR2-666 memory with tight [SPD] timings?. That DRAM Read Training does change something as I noticed the bandwidth in Memtest increased a little when it was enabled but I don't know why? couldn't see any numbers different in Memset etc?. Be aware of them as they do something? . . . for the simple life I set them to [Disabled] with no obvious ill effect.

AI Transaction Booster is a nice setting, it can be left on [auto] and it will set itself conservatively. This setting universal name is tRD and is something to do with the latency of the Northbridge. When you have screaming fast memory installed and running on an upwards divider (i.e faster than the FSB) the tRD if left on [Auto] will decrease. I think the slowest I have seen it go is tRD 13 when running memory 1:1 sync, with a bit of fiddling you can manually lower it one or two notches. The lowest I have had it is tRD 7. As mentioned above you can't get the tRD much below 10 unless you are running a fast FSB, memory with good timings and a nice healthy dose of vNB.

A personal tRD observation I have made having clocked Core™ 2 across all the Intel® platforms is that in the past when trying to overclock my memory or running it with really low timings (i.e DDR2-800 3-3-3-8) the system was never stable unless I boosted the Northbridge volts, it never made sense as I thought that only the memory should need its volts increased. However with hindsight what I think was happening is that as I decreased the memory latency (by running it faster or with lower timings) the motherboard was automatically decreasing the tRD (Northbridge Latency) to match and as mentioned already . . . the lower the tRD goes the higher the Northbridge volts need to be raised.

It seems most of these BIOS options were built in from the start but only INTEL really knew what they did. Over time and chipset revisions the engineers at manufacturers like ASUS figured out how things worked and built in options to allow the end user to *Tweak* them.

tRD tweaking and GTL ref adjustments in the BIOS are two things that make the Intel® P45 Express platform very versatile when it comes to clocking Intel® Core™ 2

Hopefully this helps a little and for anyone that has no idea what tRD is (aka Performance level or AI Transaction Booster) then this is a good read! :)

anandtech said:
current understanding of just how some of these previously elusive settings really work. There is no reason why any enthusiast should not be able to arm themselves with this information in their quest for the perfect overclock based on overall system performance.

clockdomains.png


ASUS ROG Rampage Formula: Why we were wrong about the Intel X48
January 25th, 2008
 
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My RAM finally came today so Ive been able to try some overclocks properly :) Been messing around with the GTL's a lot using your advice Wayne and seem to have managed to get a pretty stable clock now... since starting messing at about midday haha. Think thats the most restarts Ive ever done in a day!

Anyway, for me I found GTL values of 0.700, 0.680 and 0.610 worked best. Mines an old C0 stepping chip though, so got to have a few more volts going through it anyway. Got it booting easily and stable at 1.43V pretty quickly, just wanted to get the Vcore below 1.4V :p After all the fiddling with the GTL values its now stable at 1.384V, a reasonable improvement :)

Temp wise, after about half an hour of prime its 52C max, not bad! At 1.43 it was getting to 57/58C so knocked around 5C off the temps so I think my day messing has been worth it :p
Plus it gave me a chance to check out the BIOS on this board a bit more... really is a lot better than my old Gigabyte one!

Like I said, its only been running prime for about half an hour so stability may not be 100%, but Im just gonna leave it running a while now :)
 
I've just swapped out a retail E8400 for an OEM E8400 and interestingly enough the previous chips GTL settings are not quite right so it does seem these settings are on a per-chip-basis and one persons settings won't work for someone else!

My Board cannot run 500MHz-FSB stably with the three GTL settings on [Auto], I don't know if that is my specific board or combination of hardware or just the fact the P5Q-Family isn't finely tuned much above 400MHz-FSB?

Anyways I am doing some new GTL tweaking with my set-up and my previous (limited) experience and observations seem to be helping me on!

With GTL Data-ref0 set at x63 windows won't boot, at x64 it boots windows but fails IBT/5 loops,at x65 it passes 10 loops of IBT. All other GTL-Refs were on [Auto] at this point. I then started to do longer IBT runs (20 loops) and the PC rebooted so I turned my attention to the NB-GTL which was on [auto], I changed that to x62 and it passed IBT 20 loops again and again.

Still in the middle of testing but from what I have experienced so far these are my quick tips . . .

You don't need to pump vNB and vTT as much as people have made out, the maximum vNB I have needed so far is 1.22v, the maximum vTT I have needed is 1.18v, that's for 500MHz-FSB, 4.0GHz CPU, 562.5MHz-NBCC and DDR2-1200!

Another thing I have to mention (but not GTL related) is that CPU-PLL needs to be raised from 1.52v for certain chips once you really start pushing it. My first chip would reboot the system under stress with PLL set at 1.52 but stability was regained by upping the PLL. I only mention this because you see a lot of people saying PLL doesn't need to be raised. If your in doubt then just turn PLL to [auto] until you have time to test it further.

Regading GTL tweaks it seems the first CPU one needs to be raised (up from x63) and the NB GTL needs to be lowered (down from x63).

Hi BW

Hows the testing going. :)

Ok Can I ask if you could do a list of what you changed at what point in bios.

eg vcore set to X. GTL ref0 .63 (adjust GTL till passes 10/20 runs of IBT/Prime)

When did you adjust NBv and PLL vTT etc.

I have a new E0 stepping with a VID of 1.25 (not good but so far testing ok @ 1.18/9 underload)
 
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Hi B.W, thanks for the post above regards those settings - I worked out that the first 3 should be set as youve set them as it just helps to relax the RAM to assist in overclocking.

I will leave Ai Clock Twister and Ai Transcation Booster at Auto - gonna keep reading up though I do think Im wasting my time understanding all these concepts but Id rather know than not.

Expect me to post a few more questions and hopefully Ill get a good o/c out of this board - first of all I just want to make sure everything is ok and Im not doing somethingstupid from the outset (like leaving volts to default :eek: )

BTW whats the best BIOS on this board - I left it with the shipping one but suspect I need to update it...

ps3ud0 :cool:
 
My RAM finally came today so Ive been able to try some overclocks properly :) Been messing around with the GTL's a lot
Hey Ducky Spud, what RAM did you get then?

I found GTL values of 0.700, 0.680 and 0.610 worked best. Mines an old C0 stepping chip though
Ah I see you changed the second CPU-GTL from x67 to x68, I've not tried changing that one yet so that one is interesting to me.

WHat is the effect on your machine from adjusting that second CPU-GTL from x67 to x68 btw? does it resolve a no-boot situation or does it bring stability?

Can I ask if you could do a list of what you changed at what point in bios.
Hey Clairvoyant,

wish I had a list for that but I'm ashamed to admit I am using a combination of Plodding meets The Force meets Chaos Theory heh! :p

If I was to try and make some sense from it I pretty much start at full bios [Auto] and then slowly but surely start adjusting things one-by-one and testing lots (reboots, primes, IBT etc), the plodding requires patience but makes it really obvious when a setting doesn't i.e the PC is rock-stable then I change one setting and it blows up! :eek: . . . . doesn't take great detective work to figure out what went wrong! ;)

After too much plodding Patience begins to wear thin and you start changing several BIOS paremeters at a time and with some luck you begin making quantum jumps which feels nice . . . however if your not lucky or your theory is unsound everything blows up and your left scratching your head heh! :)

I'd say the bulk of the voltage controls are where my attention is most of the time, starting from full BIOS [Auto] I change the processor voltage to manual and begin lowering it, notch by notch with Prime Small FFTs and IBT runs inetween to gauge stability, I keep going until the PC fails to POST or load Windows Etc and then slowly increase the vCore until everything is rock stable. The resulting figure gives me a baseline for processor scaling and is essentially a bespoke tested REAL-VID.

Then one by one I go through the voltage adjustments lowing their values until they are rock bottom. I think the P5Q series can pretty much run a 400MHz-FSB with all the main voltages on minimum (or minimum +1 is using an older BIOS that overvolts say).

I'm not sure when is the best time to manually set GTL-Refs though, they seem fine on [Auto] until you begin climbing high with the FSB (somewhere above 400MHz-FSB).

I will try and make a more useful post to you in a week or two as I am starting a new clock so my second time around may yeild some useful info.

I have a new E0 stepping with a VID of 1.25 (not good but so far testing ok @ 1.18/9 underload)
Nice one! :)

That sounds the same as the chip I just sold, that was a 1.2500 VID and it clocked well. The low VID chips may require a bit less voltage to run stably but as gurusan has mentioned before the low VID chips seem to run a lot hotter than a high VID chip.

For someone with a high grade water-cooling system this poses no problem but for people who use Air-Cooling (like me!) a Higher VID chip could be preferable as you can get big clocks and still keep the little CPU's well within specs, this 1.1875v VID chip I am testing deffo runs hotter than my old 1.2500v VID chip so count your blessing! :cool:

Look forward to everyones results and findings, stabililty screens and pictures of your systems also greatly appreciated! :)
 
whats the best BIOS on this board - I left it with the shipping one but suspect I need to update it...
Hey ps3ud0,

I'm not sure which board you are using? but yeah I suspect downloading the latest BIOS would be a good idea . . . . ASUS have made a lot of improvement to their BIOS over the course of the past year! :)

There is a new BIOS for P5Q-E which seems fine here so far . . . .

 
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