Australian Grand Prix 2011, Albert Park Circuit - Race 1/19

Silverstone was a choice and in my opinion not a good one but, nonetheless it was a choice. Despite what the drivers might think,they are employees like the rest of us. If the team make a call,then thats it.

This is totally different, do people honestly think we would spend 6 weeks, 100's of man hours and £1000's of pounds on a chassis we knew was slow? Seriously,think about it!
 
CS||nuTs said:
Silverstone was a choice and in my opinion not a good one but, nonetheless it was a choice. Despite what the drivers might think,they are employees like the rest of us. If the team make a call,then thats it.

This is totally different, do people honestly think we would spend 6 weeks, 100's of man hours and £1000's of pounds on a chassis we knew was slow? Seriously,think about it!
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That isn't even the point. It is clearly designed to suit Vettel's driving style - it can be fast AND tailored to a particular driver.
 
utajoker said:
just look how inconsistent/stupid hamilton is over button :)


*runs away*
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Fixed for the funs :p
CaptainRAVE said:
That isn't even the point. It is clearly designed to suit Vettel's driving style - it can be fast AND tailored to a particular driver.
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But you say it, like it their sole intention is to disadvantage Webber, which I dont think is the same as it is to suit Vettels style...

ps3ud0 :cool:
 
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ps3ud0 said:
I dont think theres a difference in the cars at all, more likely its been developed to suit Vettels style more as a default is more likely and Webbers having more issues getting a handle on it so early in the season. To be honest its a non story for me...

As much as I like Mark, he really should learn to realise who pays his wages without the sneaky slurs so early in the season...

ps3ud0 :cool:
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webber took an intrest in vettels car after the race aparently, cant say i was paying much attention at the end
 
CS||nuTs said:
Silverstone was a choice and in my opinion not a good one but, nonetheless it was a choice. Despite what the drivers might think,they are employees like the rest of us. If the team make a call,then thats it.

This is totally different, do people honestly think we would spend 6 weeks, 100's of man hours and £1000's of pounds on a chassis we knew was slow? Seriously,think about it!
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how can it possibly have been a good choice, the only effect it had was to cause more animosity in the team.

Drivers probably have a different contract to you, plus have you ever heard the terms good management or bad management.

Whatever they are certainly not employees like the rest of you.

For what it's worth, in Melbourne I think Webber had the same equipment, I just think he's not as good when the pressure is on.
 
ps3ud0 said:
But you say it, like it their sole intention is to disadvantage Webber, which I dont think is the same as it is to suit Vettels style...

ps3ud0 :cool:
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I guess it depends how you read into it. The two are exactly the same in my opinion.

CS||nuTs said:
Yeh no other teams do this. What do we do then,design to suit neither of them? Come on,got to hear this one.
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You obviously missed the discussion. I have already said it is clear other teams are doing it and why. Red Bull are just more obvious about who their first and second driver is. Ferrari too. At the very least teams could design the car to suit both drivers equally and let them race.
 
CaptainRAVE said:
You obviously missed the discussion. I have already said it is clear other teams are doing it and why. Red Bull are just more obvious about who their first and second driver is. Ferrari too. At the very least teams could design the car to suit both drivers equally and let them race.
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You missed Hamilton -Alonso/ Schumacher - Rosberg of course they were not deliberate or obvious at all.

You have led a very sheltered life if you think teams care about their drivers racing each other.
 
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CS||nuTs said:
You missed Hamilton -Alonso/ Schumacher - Rosberg of course they were not deliberate or obvious at all.

You have led a very sheltered life if you think teams care about their drivers racing each other.
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Yep Hamilton and Button have completely different styles. I know who I would bias developement towards. Same with MS and Irvine, even Irvine knows something suspect happened to his car at Japan in 99. He hinted at it in one of the F1 forums last year.

Loads of drivers have the car tailored to them, the one exception seems to be Alonso. He seems to be able to adapt his style to suit the car he's driving.
 
ZG002 said:
You play to your strengths, Mark Webber is not one of RBR strengths imo.
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Thing is, he could be.

Given the almost incredible lack of knowledge displayed for the history of this sport by more than a few people on here I guess that remembering the 2002 Australian GP, less than a decade ago, might be a bit too much to ask. But I shall carry on and attempt to remind y'all of it ;)

It's the start of the 2002 Formula One season. Ferrari were at the start of a truly dominant season. McLaren were struggling a bit by their illustrious standards. Williams were looking to challenge for the title. Renault were looking to rebound after an awful year. Toyota had just entered the fray. And an Australian driver was climbing into a tail-ender car for a team owned by an Australian.

Turn 1, lap 1 - carnage. All hell broke loose. Cars off everywhere. Somehow, the aforementioned Australian driver made it through. Eventually, the green flag flew. As early season atrition took care of people, he made it up into 5th. The car was breaking down - diff' trouble, no TC, he had all on to keep it on the island. There was a Toyota driven by someone with far more F1 experience bearing down on him. But no panic, no trouble at all. He just drove within his limits, within the limitations of the car, and brought it home 5th on his debut.

The man was Mark Webber.

I do wonder sometimes just how many people remember, and appreciate, what he did that day. In a car that wasn't much cop if it had been working correctly, and was distinctly broken from early on in the GP, he stayed out of trouble and nursed it home for two points. He did a phenomenal job.

The guy is good. Really good. And he'll battle, fight, claw, scratch, drag his way home if need be. But he needs a fair crack at it, and if Silverstone '10 is anything to go by (rightly or wrongly, that's how it looks to a lot of people from the outside) then he ain't going to get it. And it's a damned shame.
 
I understand what you are saying JRS, But 2002 was 9 long seasons ago, I didn't follow the F1 back then much. How did he do the rest of the season? How has he done in seasons leading up to now?

Phenomenal job yes, After all he is an F1 driver. Is he consistent with the Phenomenal jobs?

With the team in such a strong place with everything, I do see him as their weak link.

I look forward to being proven wrong, as I'd like Webber to put in some stunning drives and show Vettle he isn't going to have it all his way, I can't see it happening though.

No doubt you will pull that to bits :p. Just how my lack of knowledge sees it lol.
 
ZG002 said:
I understand what you are saying JRS, But 2002 was 9 long seasons ago,
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Exactly!

You cannot base the stature of a driver of sportsman, based on a single performance.

In F1, you have to judge a driver across a period of many seasons and compare him to his team-mate (who is the only other driver with the same car).

Webber just isn't in the same category as Vettel. RBR (and the rest of the pitlane) know this. This is the reason why RBR are doing everything possible to ensure that Vettel get preferential treatment...and rightly so.

It is in any team's best interests to give preferential treatment to their No.1 driver. This allows the team to score maximum points and reduces the possibility of the 2 drivers taking points off of each other or worse still, taking eachother off.

In 2007, we had 2 of the best drivers in F1, in the same car. There is was no No.1/No.2 system. The result: both drivers finishing on the same points total, 1 point away from the title win.

Webber is RBR's No.2 driver. Webber knows this. RBR know this. And Vettel knows this.
 
ZG002 - nah, not going to pull it to bits :)

ZG002 said:
I understand what you are saying JRS, But 2002 was 9 long seasons ago, I didn't follow the F1 back then much. How did he do the rest of the season? How has he done in seasons leading up to now?
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Well, predictably he didn't score again in '02. That's no surprise - he was driving for Minardi after all. But there were other notable performances - he finished 8th in France, he finished well up the order on more than a few occasions, he drove the entire Hungarian GP with a non-working water bottle, and did enough to get himself into a drive with Jaguar for the next season. He also outqualified his team-mates for his first two seasons (and much of the third).

ZG002 said:
Phenomenal job yes, After all he is an F1 driver. Is he consistent with the Phenomenal jobs?
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He certainly was consistent in delivering performances that the car shouldn't have been capable of back then. And that extended into his time at Jaguar as well.

Kerming said:
His chance to shine has gone......he's too old now
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Why is he too old? He's only 34.
 
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