Autumn Statement 2012
- Thread starter Cosimo
- Start date
I genuinely believe it does need to go up, and I know it is harsh on some people, but being faced with a choice of what to tax and what to cut, I'd rather see fuel for cars taxed (and perhaps a deduction for the logistics industry to compensate).
It's about time people start being strong-armed into ridesharing, using more economical cars, using other forms of transport.
I don't buy the argument (enough) that 'yes, but what about people who live in the sticks and are broke despite working and commuting' - there's always going to be a more sorely affected fringe case with any decision like this, and the fact is that when the economics require, people innovate and change behaviour.
Meanwhile those who can afford it are paying more tax, and we're creating a greater disincentive to burn carbon.
*puts on flame suit over naive self*
I live in a city centre and would gladly travel to my workplace if they had a train / bus or anything that went to the remote town in which I work (even if they do, I imagine it would take 3 + hours with various changes from what normally takes me 1 hour). I would also love to buy a nice new fancy eco car, but guess what, they aren't cheap.
On the flip side, most people I know would love to live closer to the city where they work, but you need the money to afford it, so they drive from the countryside.
Hi, and welcome to the list of the seasons in the United Kingdom!
December, January, February: Winter.
March, April, May: Spring.
June, July, August: Summer.
September, October, November: Autumn.
Yes, it's only been two years and we are already wildly off track from his predictions...which points to the predictions being a load of tosh in the first place (which I did say at the time...)
This isn't behaviour solely attributable to George though to be fair, generally all Chancellors are far too optimistic with their Budget predictions on growth etc.
But it is the over arcing principle of cuts solving the deficit problem that was always going to be a risky plan to take. Growth was always going to be the main way to balance the books but removing demand from the economy, as has happened with the coalitions policies, has done the opposite.
21st December.
The astronomical winter (Northern Hemisphere) 2012 begins on
Friday, December 21
SPRING EQUINOX March 20, 1:14 A.M. EDT
SUMMER SOLSTICE June 20, 7:09 P.M. EDT
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WINTER SOLSTICE December 21, 6:12 A.M. EST
Soldato
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Because predicting relatively finite changes in the economy is far more difficult than predicting the weather.
The office producing the predictions has nothing to do with the Treasury. It's independent...
Manage your expectations: both of the government and the Office for Budget Responsibility.
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Soldato
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This!, which in all reality is far more interesting than the oral farting that is the lies the idiot stood in front of the commons is spewing at the moment
I'm not sure we had any balancing of books before when there was more growth. It just got worse. This is the rut. How much and where do you take money out to pay the debts? As soon as you take that money you are cutting, so it is unavoidable. So the question is how much is too much? Do you accept roughly 0-2% growth rate as a reasonable value? Or do you allow more growth but less debt paid off? Throw risk of getting downgraded by credit agencies in there (because debt is not being covered) and what happens then? It is not straight forward unfortunately, not to me anyway.
There is no debt being paid off though, all the plan was was to reduce the rate the debt is growing to zero, within the term of 1 parliament, which was laughably ridiculous - as has now been shown as the prediction is now to 2017/18 (and will be far longer than that imo)
And the talk 2 years ago of being downgraded and defaulting and 'the market' not lending us money and us becoming the next Greece was all complete rubbish. There was no threat to us from any 'market' that we were going to be a credit risk. It was just all scare talk to frighten people into accepting their austerity measures.
I remember during the last election a pundit saying that whichever party got into power would need to make so many cuts, that they would get voted out at the next election and probably not get in again for ages.
Guess it depends on which of Tories or Lib Dems are seen to be the "baddies"
Guess it depends on which of Tories or Lib Dems are seen to be the "baddies"
Happens every time - one party makes the mess, one clears it up.
and this scares me as it means we get ed balls back in the treasury again, and he had a hand in what happened last time
The threat is very real. The market is brutal and as a country with one of the highest debt to gdp ratios then the UK is at high risk of being downgraded without notice.
There would be no debt being paid off either if it was all spent making growth figures higher. As soon as that money comes out to pay the debt (that doesn't have to be now, it may lead to a payment in future i.e. deficit reduction which it is down by 25%) then it is cutting.
Not wasting money is important. Paying so much on interest is silly and it has got to be paid off.
At least we are out growing other countries and are forecast to out grow them further next year.
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Soldato
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What would you rather cut?
