Average Salary/Good Salary

The biggest factor will be your rent as I'm sure you can work out. If you're living centrally in a 1 bed place then rent will be almost the same as a 2 bed i.e. at least 300 and more likely 350-400 for a reasonably nice place. But I'm sure that would drop off a fair amount if you moved out to zone 3. How central do you want to be though, as once you get out of zone 1 it all depends where you're working and what method of transport you're using as to how "close" to the centre it really feels...
 
bigredshark said:
Thats absolute rubbish, first place I lived in london we had a three bedroom house with a garden, 5 minutes walk to clapham south tube, nice road and it cost £550 a month including all the bills. That was 4 years ago and prices haven't gone up that much since then.
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O RLY?

Our 2 bed place in central London is £1700 a month and it's not that nice. But then if you're near Clapham South, which is a dump, maybe prices are more acceptable :p
 
Johnny Girth said:
The biggest factor will be your rent as I'm sure you can work out. If you're living centrally in a 1 bed place then rent will be almost the same as a 2 bed i.e. at least 300 and more likely 350-400 for a reasonably nice place. But I'm sure that would drop off a fair amount if you moved out to zone 3. How central do you want to be though, as once you get out of zone 1 it all depends where you're working and what method of transport you're using as to how "close" to the centre it really feels...
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Zone 1 is pretty big, I lived near sloane square for a year or so, which was great but a huge pain for commuting to the city, I live in clapham (zone 2) now and it's faster to get to work from there...
 
Johnny Girth said:
O RLY?

Our 2 bed place in central London is £1700 a month and it's not that nice. But then if you're near Clapham South, which is a dump, maybe prices are more acceptable :p
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Wow, you're shallow. Ever been there? Or is nice a palatial mansion in hampstead the only thing that's 'nice'

And at the age of 20, on 40k a year, it was lovely...
 
Then that's £1650 a month for a house, which is around right, and the other poster was also correct with his crap flat for £600 estimate, as I did a lot of property research a couple of months ago and 99.9% of flats I looked at were £600 or greater per month when all was taken into account, and I searched a LOT of properties.

The rental market has gone through the roof due to the housing market.
 
it's al very subjective to what you need and where you live. The average for the uk is ~£21k I would say a reasonable wage you can live of is around £25k with no dependants and 35k+ if you want a kid. Obviously London prices for house our just silly. But When I go there beer and food does not seem any more expensive..
 
Richdog said:
50k minimum to begin with? What planet are you on? :D
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One where it isn't impossible!

Johnny Girth said:
The biggest factor will be your rent as I'm sure you can work out. If you're living centrally in a 1 bed place then rent will be almost the same as a 2 bed i.e. at least 300 and more likely 350-400 for a reasonably nice place. But I'm sure that would drop off a fair amount if you moved out to zone 3. How central do you want to be though, as once you get out of zone 1 it all depends where you're working and what method of transport you're using as to how "close" to the centre it really feels...
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Yup. I'm doing a lot of analysis of bus and train routes from various areas of London. Indeed, there are some tube lines I'd like to be close to, thus avoiding having to change on the way to work, in which case I can live further out but get to work in the same amount of time.

I wouldn't mind at all if I started work at 9am, because then I'd just live in Zone 6, but when you start at 7am, things become very different!
 
Richdog said:
Then that's £1650 a month for a house, which is around right, and the other poster was also correct with his crap flat for £600 estimate, as I did a lot of property research a couple of months ago and 99.9% of flats I looked at were £600 or greater per month when all was taken into account, and I searched a LOT of properties.

The rental market has gone through the roof due to the housing market.
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Yeah, £600 a month if you want to live on your own in a crap flat, I can't fathom why anyone would though. Living on your own in london would be pointless, you're rarely at home enough to appreciate the fact it's all yours and you're getting completely stung for bills/council tax
 
Richdog said:
Then that's £1650 a month for a house, which is around right, and the other poster was also correct with his crap flat for £600 estimate, as I did a lot of property research a couple of months ago and 99.9% of flats I looked at were £600 or greater per month when all was taken into account, and I searched a LOT of properties.

The rental market has gone through the roof due to the housing market.
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Yep, I'd agree with this - done a lot of research myself and the London rental market isn't great. I really don't want to live in a dump of a flat, nor do I want to live in a dump of an area (which, I'm sorry, but many parts of London are).
 
N9ne said:
However, getting on the property ladder is important to build your wealth up.
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Repayment mortgages are really only a kind of forced savings scheme. If you are disciplined, there is no reason why renting and saving the difference (taking into account maintenance costs you don't have on a rented property) can't be an equally valid way of building your wealth while retaining flexibility.

There are some advantages to owning, especially with rental contracts weighted heavily in favour of the landlord, but there is no reason why renting shouldn't be part of a well structured financial progression. The blinkered 'renting is dead money, I have to buy!' attitude is what's pushed this country into near bankruptcy. Beware of perpetuating this myth instead of analysing the fundamentals... especially in what's likely to be a fairly long term falling market.

Andrew McP
 
Andrew_McP said:
Repayment mortgages are really only a kind of forced savings scheme. If you are disciplined, there is no reason why renting and saving the difference (taking into account maintenance costs you don't have on a rented property) can't be an equally valid way of building your wealth while retaining flexibility.

There are some advantages to owning, especially with rental contracts weighted heavily in favour of the landlord, but there is no reason why renting shouldn't be part of a well structured financial progression. The blinkered 'renting is dead money, I have to buy!' attitude is what's pushed this country into near bankruptcy. Beware of perpetuating this myth instead of analysing the fundamentals... especially in what's likely to be a fairly long term falling market.

Andrew McP
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However, if by the age of 50 I have several high-worth properties, they generally will have appreciated in value, plus will be generating me substantial incomes. If the income is good enough, I can retire early.
 
N9ne said:
Yep, I'd agree with this - done a lot of research myself and the London rental market isn't great. I really don't want to live in a dump of a flat, nor do I want to live in a dump of an area (which, I'm sorry, but many parts of London are).
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But there are huge areas which are just fine, they just aren't particularly fashionable but huge chunks of north london are just fine residential areas. Most of the so called posh places have pretty nasty bits, notting hill is a dump in many places, Islington too but people live there so they can say they do...
 
bigredshark said:
But there are huge areas which are just fine, they just aren't particularly fashionable but huge chunks of north london are just fine residential areas. Most of the so called posh places have pretty nasty bits, notting hill is a dump in many places, Islington too but people live there so they can say they do...
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It's still quite expensive in Zone 2 North London. Zone 3/4 are fine, yes, (as long as you don't go too far East!) but then it's going to take too long to get into work.
 
N9ne said:
Right, so starting next year, I need to live near to Central London. I will be covering water, gas, electricity, TV license, internet, phone, mobile phone and some others I've undoubtedly missed out here.

Also, road tax, MOT, petrol on my car.

Also, paying the relatively higher prices to buy food and drink in Zone1-3 London.

I'd also like to not have to live in a dodgy area. I need a one-bedroom flat and of course, a bathroom and kitchen which are not shared (otherwise they may well be filthy!).

How much will my total outgoings be per week? I'm thinking £350-400 a week. I think it is important for people to be able to at least maintain their living standards - if I want all the luxuries (e.g. car, TV, etc.) that I have now at home, then when I move out, I want the same. No point suffering!

So £400 a week (upper estimate?) would be roughly £21,000 per year (incl. rent). This is excluding holidays - say two a year at £1,500 each. I also need to buy a TV and some other things. In total I'm looking to spend roughly £25,000 to £30,000 in one year. This is using income net of tax.

However, getting on the property ladder is important to build your wealth up. A decent property in Zone 2/3 is going to cost £500,000. At the moment I'd be asked for a 25% deposit of £125,000. Oh, and a large income ;).

So anyone saying it's possible to live happily on anything less than £35,000 in Zone 1/2 London should really move out, earn the same amount and see how much better life would be!

For me, I'd want to make £50,000 minimum to begin with, rising to well over £100,000. I'd hate to have to rent my whole life.
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why the hell do you need a car when you live in london????
 
N9ne said:
However, if by the age of 50 I have several high-worth properties, they generally will have appreciated in value, plus will be generating me substantial incomes. If the income is good enough, I can retire early.
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House prices won't appreciate endlessly, that's economic fact. IF you have several high worth properties by the time you're 50 you'll either have massive mortgage commitments and hence won't earn much or you'll have sunk huge amounts of money into them. Unless you really fancy yourself as a property developer I'd spend the money enjoying myself...
 
leaskovski said:
why the hell do you need a car when you live in london????
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Quite, not worth it really. I drove into work yesterday as I was popping out to a client in Reading. In addition to petrol, tax, insurance etc, I spent £27 on parking and £8 on congestion charge. That was for a couple of hours too, not the entire day. Unless you're getting that entirely covered by your employer you're mad using a car everyday in London (when I got back around 8 last night it took me best part of an hour to get through the west end as well). A car is a luxury.
 
leaskovski said:
why the hell do you need a car when you live in london????
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Funnily enough, sometimes I'd like to leave London :P. I don't fancy having to do the whole sitting on a train for hours then taking buses and taxis thing and much prefer driving. I really quite enjoy driving and a nice trip up north every now and then wouldn't be too bad.

bigredshark said:
House prices won't appreciate endlessly, that's economic fact. IF you have several high worth properties by the time you're 50 you'll either have massive mortgage commitments and hence won't earn much or you'll have sunk huge amounts of money into them. Unless you really fancy yourself as a property developer I'd spend the money enjoying myself...
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Economic facts - interesting subject. In a country with low and stable inflation (over a long time period - with the occassional blip), you don't have to worry too much about house prices falling often.

The aim is to pay off mortgages early too. I'd hate to have huge mortgage commitments. Retirement --> no mortgage to pay. Live off rental income. Also, once I own the property, that rent will keep on coming. If I just spend my money every year and rent, when I retire, there'll be the sense of only having my savings to spend.

Also, I'm quite keen on inter-generational transfer of wealth, but I don't wish to spark a debate about that here.
 
N9ne said:
It's still quite expensive in Zone 2 North London. Zone 3/4 are fine, yes, (as long as you don't go too far East!) but then it's going to take too long to get into work.
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Depends where work is really, zone 3 or 4 in north london isn't a million miles from the city and the trains are pretty good there too. Richmond and down that way isn't intolerable for the west end, though you are getting the train then the tube..
 
Pfff, glad I don't live in London, I might have to actually do some hard work to afford a new 2 bedroom house.

/relaxes northern style
 
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