BMW and M Power Owners

[TW]Fox said:
Yes because it's that simple, right?

There are a number of unique and unusual circumstances that have come together to seriously disrupt the market resulting in significant price inflation in used cars across almost across the board. This is effectively unheard of - outside of rare exotic models and sought after new cars with a waiting list used cars do not appreciate, they depreciate. Basic economics, right? Until the last 12 months, where everything has changed.

The long term trajectory for the value of normal cars is not up. The market will eventually correct itself leaving a bunch of people who seemed to think paying massive amounts of money for ordinary cars was a good idea because hey, basic economics, right? So if you don't need a used car right now really the best thing to do is not buy a used car right now. When the market goes crazy, don't join the market.
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I don't want to get into the equivalent of a dowie hole here, but both BMW and Mercedes have already said that a race to the bottom is in neither companies interests and sustaining the prices that people are clearly willing to pay is a key part of their strategy going forwards.

https://www.ft.com/content/f55a1d96-1146-4e17-88a9-1a0fbaf57de6

Like I said, it is basic economics. If the market is willing to bear the prices currently seen - which is clearly is, the end will not be as simple as when "things return to normal". We are seeing shrinkflation on all new cars at the moment and it is setting the scene for what the future will look like.
 
dLockers said:
I don't want to get into the equivalent of a dowie hole here, but both BMW and Mercedes have already said that a race to the bottom is in neither companies interests and sustaining the prices that people are clearly willing to pay is a key part of their strategy going forwards.

https://www.ft.com/content/f55a1d96-1146-4e17-88a9-1a0fbaf57de6

Like I said, it is basic economics. If the market is willing to bear the prices currently seen - which is clearly is, the end will not be as simple as when "things return to normal". We are seeing shrinkflation on all new cars at the moment and it is setting the scene for what the future will look like.
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I don't think this translates to the madness in the used market. New car pricing hasn't gone that crazy really - the issue is supply and resultant hysteria talking up the market for used cars. Look at this thread alone for proof of that.

BMW themselves have limited control (or even much interest) over the value of a 5 year old 3 Series for sale on Autotrader.

You can still factory order a 330i right this second for a fairly reasonable £35k after discount. Only it'll take ages to arrive and you physically can't order half the options you'd want. But it isn't THAT expensive. Even the list price is only £40k - which accounting for inflation is cheaper in real terms than a 330i from 15 years ago.

Brand new 330i costing £35k isn't why people seem to be falling over themselves to pay £29k for an old shape 330i.

Infact there we go, that's how to win - trade your inflated value used car in for a nice brand new one :D
 
[TW]Fox said:
You can still factory order a 330i right this second for a fairly reasonable £35k after discount. Only it'll take ages to arrive and you physically can't order half the options you'd want. But it isn't THAT expensive. Even the list price is only £40k - which accounting for inflation is cheaper in real terms than a 330i from 15 years ago.
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That's the arrow to the knee though isn't it. Most folk in this segment don't want to spank £35k on a car that is missing features their current car has. They also do not want to wait a year or two (or worse, an undefined amount of time) for the privilege.

A colleague at work bought a new Puma and I was surprised to hear she had picked it up so quickly - she explained it was missing a few mod cons and went on to explain how the salesmen told her "if you haven't had them before, best not to get used to them" :rolleyes: (the list included auto air-con, rear camera, rear sensors, etc..)
 
dLockers said:
That's the arrow to the knee though isn't it. Most folk in this segment don't want to spank £35k on a car that is missing features their current car has. They also do not want to wait a year or two (or worse, an undefined amount of time) for the privilege.
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I agree with you - but the supply issue is temporary. The manufacturers might want to sustain higher pricing for new cars - which is fair enough - but I doubt BMW want to sustain not letting people order a head up display or adaptive cruise on a 3 Series, do they?

New car pricing is not the cause of the current ridiculous used car pricing, because as we can see if you CAN order a new car, its not exactly over inflated in cost is it. Even at list price £40k for a 330i M Sport seems like quite a deal when you consider how exceptional the standard spec is on them now! Yet still there are discounts on that. The issue is getting a build slot.
 
My situation is I sold my old Ford Mondeo for around £1k more than it was usually worth - fine. Needed some money spending on it - cambelt, EGR valve etc. Didn't really think about the future though

Either I buy what I want now, or wait to see what early next year holds (I guess absolutely no different market to this year). I do a 32 mile motorway round trip possibly 3-4 times a week to uni. I also have my grandads 2005 fiesta, it's not ideal on the motorway though and will probably **** itself at some point but I can have 'exclusive' use of it...
 
ShivP said:
I do a 32 mile motorway round trip possibly 3-4 times a week to uni.
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Wait.

You don’t need a 30k car yet :-)


If you really want a new car, get a decent in between.


This is what I’ve ended up doing. Rather than spending 26k on a new car, I’ve spent 11 on a 320d, so it’s still a massive upgrade from what I’m used to without making me feel as though I’m waiting for prices to crash.


Maybe a Leon Cupra if you want a nice petrol? Or a golf?

They’ll be a big step up from your Mondeo :-)
 
MrRockliffe said:
Wait.

You don’t need a 30k car yet :)


If you really want a new car, get a decent in between.


This is what I’ve ended up doing. Rather than spending 26k on a new car, I’ve spent 11 on a 320d, so it’s still a massive upgrade from what I’m used to without making me feel as though I’m waiting for prices to crash.


Maybe a Leon Cupra if you want a nice petrol? Or a golf?

They’ll be a big step up from your Mondeo :)
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Ultimately, like Fox I'd probably want a G30 M340i. I'm probably happy up to 35k, the cheapest AUC is £40k and autotrader around 38k. Again though, it seems bonkers value when a 2017-2018 Audi S5 is like £36k and it's by most accounts a worse car(?)
Eg http://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202107155055844?atmobcid=soc3

I think I'll 'slog it' with the Fiesta for a couple of weeks and see how it goes
 
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[TW]Fox said:
For 30k I'd rather sacrifice 2 cylinders and get a couple of extra doors and go for a 330i, a completely new and thoroughly more modern and better car. The previous gen 3 series on which the 4 was based was never a brilliant car but the current 4 series really is.
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This is a tough one (and something you and I have discussed at length). It really depends on what you value in the car. I've driven the new-gen cars, and I do agree they're a nice step up interior wise (though there's a stark difference when sitting in a tired, poorly specified f30 vs a low mileage well spec'd one), but I would absolutely take the b58 engine in an f3x over a 4 cylinder c. 250bhp in the g2x. Even if someone offered me a free swap from my 440i for a new shape 330i, I wouldn't take it if it came tied to a "you can't then sell the car to fund a 340i" condition.

I literally swapped one F36 (430i) for another F36 (440i) because of the engine, and for me the b58 engine is the absolute highlight of the car. Yes, I got a good deal on the swap that made it a no-brainer, but I think I still would've been happy if I'd had to pay the 4-6k difference I probably should have had to pay. The 4 cylinder in the 430i was fine, and for "sedate" driving absolutely adequate and far from slow, but the 440i's engine is truly awesome.

  • If you always drive in comfort and don't ever get close to using the performance, then the g20 is obviously the right choice. The 330i isn't slow, but it isn't quick.
  • If you will use the performance of the b58, the g20 won't satisfy you.

Doesn't change that the pricing is bonkers on all used stuff at the moment, and there is no correct answer.
 
rG-tom said:
m240i would be a great shout for you....
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MrRockliffe said:
Yep fair enough - it’s a big car, but might be a good compromise and your way into a modern 6 cylinder petrol :)

M240i?
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Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm yes, but I just want more "interior" as well. I have test driven an M140 and the interior was somewhat lacklustre considering they were asking 26k for it!
 
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