Then why did you say born equal when you meant something else? I can only argue with what you say, not what you later claim to have meant.
Capitalism
- Thread starter TheCenturion
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Then why did you say born equal when you meant something else? I can only argue with what you say, not what you later claim to have meant.
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I meant born equal. I assume that's what Superewza meant as well.
I also assume that's what the UN meant when it said that people were born equal.
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No equal in the sense of equal rights.
That isn't what you said. I'm becoming frustrated with you now... either say "Oh sorry I should have been clearer, that is not what I meant" or back up your arguements. Telling me that "born equal" means "born with equal rights" doesn't cut it.
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Well, you now know that I meant that people are born with equal rights etc. This is what I assume that Superewza meant when he said that equality was a need.
EDIT: Why are you not addressing Superewza too? He said that people were born equal and that no one was born superior to anyone else, which is spot on imo.
EDIT: Why are you not addressing Superewza too? He said that people were born equal and that no one was born superior to anyone else, which is spot on imo.
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Ok he's wrong too. I didn't intentionally pick one fallasy over the other. People are born superior to other people. It's utter tripe to even suggest that people are born equal.
If you mean people are born with equal rights then you're largely wrong too. Certainly in the majority of the world there is not any acceptable amount of equality. Even in the UK people are not born with equality. Some have good parents, some are born into money. Some have genetic defects.
If you mean people are born with equal rights then you're largely wrong too. Certainly in the majority of the world there is not any acceptable amount of equality. Even in the UK people are not born with equality. Some have good parents, some are born into money. Some have genetic defects.
Soldato
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I completely agree, in our current society most people are not getting the rights and opportunities that they deserve. If you look you'll see that we were discussing what we can actually do about it.
Oh, and i can't believe that for a second. Every single person that is born has exactly the same potential to become someone great. It's (or at least, should be, were it not for the ruling classes) the choices they make in their life that decide if they achieve it or not.
Please don't teach that sort of stuff to your kids, if you ever have any. That sort of thinking is so bitterly regressive. Hitler would be proud.
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Sorry, you're a fantasist, children are not born with the same potential.
Also, Godwin's law.
Soldato
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So you dispute Article 1 of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights?
Survival of the fittest.
Really though, not everyone is born with equal potential or chances in life and there is not a society in history where that has been the case.
All we can do is encourage people to be the best they can be, whether that is as a banker or a cleaner.
Really though, not everyone is born with equal potential or chances in life and there is not a society in history where that has been the case.
All we can do is encourage people to be the best they can be, whether that is as a banker or a cleaner.
Indeed. We should be trying to create an environment where all children are encouraged. Not one where the less able are left behind, nor one where the gifted are held behind.
Starship troopers has some good views on it.
In order to vote or hold office you must give 2 years of your life in service to the nation, and in turn the nation is obligated to find a position for everyone regardless of their abilities, intelligence or disabilities.
In order to vote or hold office you must give 2 years of your life in service to the nation, and in turn the nation is obligated to find a position for everyone regardless of their abilities, intelligence or disabilities.
Soldato
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I think you're getting confused between people being equal and people being clones
The only reason people aren't born with the same potential is because of capitalism, putting those not born into the ruling classes at a severe disadvantage and basing much of a persons life not around their abilities as a human being, but their willingness to perform countless repetitive tasks just to afford the rights they need to survive.
Yet again, what we were discussing is how to change this.
Yeah, until you think it through what that really means.
Essentially it's taking the franchise from anyone who doesn't conform with the elite.
Great book, great film though!
That and genetics, a person with down's syndrome does not have the same potential as a "normal" person.
Sad as it is to say, they just aren't capable of operating on the same level.
I think you're getting confused between people being equal and people being clones
The only reason people aren't born with the same potential is because of capitalism, putting those not born into the ruling classes at a severe disadvantage and basing much of a persons life not around their abilities as a human being, but their willingness to perform countless repetitive tasks just to afford the rights they need to survive.
Yet again, what we were discussing is how to change this.
You're fundamentally incapable of grasping what I'm saying.
Children are not born equal. They cannot be born equal as it goes against biology and evolution.
The only way to make children born equal (which would be a tragedy) is to manufacture or clone them to make sure they were utterly identical. My brother is great musically, and I'm great with figures. We found those talents by ourselves, it's not unreasonable to suppose that we had a natural predisposition to it.
If you believe the UN charter article 1 says that children are all born with the same potential then I cannot reason you out of a position you did not reason yourself into.
I think you're getting confused between people being equal and people being clones
The only reason people aren't born with the same potential is because of capitalism, putting those not born into the ruling classes at a severe disadvantage and basing much of a persons life not around their abilities as a human being, but their willingness to perform countless repetitive tasks just to afford the rights they need to survive.
Yet again, what we were discussing is how to change this.
Well, intellectual potential, not everyone can be a physicist, Physical potential, not everyone can be a Soldier or an Athlete and so on.
Capitalism isn't responsible for the genetic potential of the individual. Not every person is born with the same potential in life, this is a simple fact of life not a consequence of capitalism.
The only way to equal the potential is to limit the reach of that potential artificially.