That's a very good response from Codemasters.
Codemasters F1 2010 X360/PS3 (contains important question about 2011 game!!!)
- Thread starter Mr Latte
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That's a very good response from Codemasters.
Well least they are looking into this and maybe they'll fix all the faults...
basically, the general public has just done the biggest beta test ever on this title for codemasters for what is now one of their newest ventures...*
I certainly do acknowledge that designing an F1 game isn't easy however some of these noticeable flaws are a bit stupid and how it got out the door - who knows..
Not the first time, and its certainly not directed at just codemasters, many others are just as guilty.. As said it's how they progress and fix this that will determine future success of successive F1 titles from Codemasters..
I am however not impressed that a huge flaw in the pit system wasn't picked up in any testing, and it makes me wonder if they just ignore what testers say in regards to reaching a deadline and fixing a broken product after launch..
Still, if they fix the pit stops then I'll be happy with the game..
I'm sorry but they are lieing if they say it hasn't got rubber banding of some sort. My race AI always has one driver hang onto me no matter how fast I go.
Anyone actually have a good race start yet? Even with TC I can't make a better start than the AI?
Anyone actually have a good race start yet? Even with TC I can't make a better start than the AI?
And who's to say this AI car isn't just fast? It is an F1 game after all with F1 drivers...who drive quite quick.
Don't all jump on me by the way, there are certain instances where I question whats going on, but sometimes I think we just look a bit too much...
Lets say you were fernando alonso going round the singapore circuit, with vettel stuck to the back of you, I'm sure you would cry rubber banding, yet it happened for real.
And who's to say this AI car isn't just fast? It is an F1 game after all with F1 drivers...who drive quite quick.
How can it be faster than it's grid time?
Thats what I'm saying, for instance I set a pole time of 1.40, they set a 2nd place time of 1.41.5
I set consistent laps faster than their grid times and they hang onto me, one of them does, Always one and even if they were father down the grid than 2nd they will hang onto me.
I don't care how good F1 drivers are something weird is going on there. It's always one on the speed up. If Alonso is following me and Webber is 8 seconds adrift, after Alonso pits webber becomes magically fast. As I've said I've watched my lap times go in lap after lap and for them to be catching me they have to be going faster than the time they set for their grid slot.
Hopefully when they say they're going to fix the issue of cars teleporting around the track after a crash they'll actually make sure they retire after a big smash (i.e. losing both front wheels + front wing). I've had some incidents where the AI will lose a wheel/wing/something and still put in an impossibly good race time/position.
Looks positive though, hopefully the patch won't take too long - there's no way they can leave the issues alone & assuming they fix them properly the game will be very good
Looks positive though, hopefully the patch won't take too long - there's no way they can leave the issues alone & assuming they fix them properly the game will be very good
ive not experienced this rubber banding, ive been able to pull a gap of 5 seconds or so in the first laps to a pit stop, i quali about a second faster than ai and after 4-5 laps the gap represents that.
i have never had a good start were ive beaten the ai, they always pull ahead.
i have never had a good start were ive beaten the ai, they always pull ahead.
Caporegime
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Having a play around with the traction control levels to see how much faster I can go with a pad vs a wheel.
Using Bahrain as the test because it's the only track I've spent more than 30 minutes on.
Pad
No TC - 2:01.968
Medium TC - 2:00.629
Full TC - 2:00.393
Thought full TC would've made me quite a lot quicker?
Wheel
No TC - 2:06.798
Medium TC - 2:01.349
Full TC - 2:00.037
TC makes a hell of a lot more difference for the wheel than the pad but I'm still spinning a lot more than with a pad.
Using Bahrain as the test because it's the only track I've spent more than 30 minutes on.
Pad
No TC - 2:01.968
Medium TC - 2:00.629
Full TC - 2:00.393
Thought full TC would've made me quite a lot quicker?
Wheel
No TC - 2:06.798
Medium TC - 2:01.349
Full TC - 2:00.037
TC makes a hell of a lot more difference for the wheel than the pad but I'm still spinning a lot more than with a pad.
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Ugh...out qualified the entire field with second place 2 seconds slower than me, then put the same pace into every race lap and finished 40 seconds behind the winner in 4th place, with a Sauber right on my gearbox for 6 laps!
No rubberbanding? Balls...
On another note, I was amazed at the difference switching tyre wear off has on handling. I thought it was a gradual thing, but it's like a totally different physics set with it off!
No rubberbanding? Balls...
On another note, I was amazed at the difference switching tyre wear off has on handling. I thought it was a gradual thing, but it's like a totally different physics set with it off!
Having a play around with the traction control levels to see how much faster I can go with a pad vs a wheel.
Using Bahrain as the test because it's the only track I've spent more than 30 minutes on.
Pad
No TC - 2:01.968
Medium TC - 2:00.629
Full TC - 2:00.393
Thought full TC would've made me quite a lot quicker?
1.6 seconds in F1 is MASSIVE.
well i guess at least CM have said something...didnt find what they said particularly helpful.
A lotus or virgin car shouldnt be beating a Mclaren or Red Bull end of.
So the 360 and ps3 cant handle 24 cars on the track with individual AI for each sooooo they just activate or simulate it within X distance of the player car....right ok....so if the cars/textures are not on the track where are they? Im assuming hes including cars because he said they cant do the camera on each car.....
Sorry but thats BS. And that is his reason for not doing individual ai on each car round the entire track.
F1 cars cannot move that fast WTF! you think? lol i cannot believe he said that using it as an excuse as a programmer/developer... just wow..
F19 stealth fighter for the commodore 64 managed to have smt like x120 time advances but wait omg...that would speed up the stealth fighter to LUDICROUS speed and break the laws of the multiverse...the f19 cant fly that fast so the devs cant do it.
I seem to remember Geoff Crammonds F1 game having time advance (or was it F1 CE ? ) and you could see each car going round the track... and how old are they?
I should just say now from what some people have reported and HIS response (and my limited experience of F1 2010) i get the feeling that F1 2010 is a rally TT game with F1 environment...the F1 nuts and bolts isnt there only the simulation of the nuts and bolts and they are shown up to be cheap magician's tricks.
see above..told you. The AI isnt racing at all..such a fubared system
but then he says this
THIS contradicts what people have reported regarding rubber banding, teleporting cars who spin off and then teleport to a preset position on the track (ie simulated model not actual racing)
http://uk.gamespot.com/xbox360/driving/f12010/show_msgs.php?topic_id=m-1-56563167&pid=959808
He then goes onto talk about the issues of the game... he mentions split times but he pretty much just parrots the back of the box blah blah that split times are based off the leader...yeah m8 we know that wtf...we want the split/gap times between drivers - why cant you see that? Perhaps its too difficult to do....or wait maybe the cars arent on the track...maybe thats why he cant do it
But wait a minute all the drivers are racing in the actual race (so he assures us) and they only dont appear in qualifying because of LUDICROUS speed and how it might destroy the universe if they try to put the timings of individual cars in.......
No problem m8 happy to beta test your wreck of a F1 game...that we paid for
So sorry i dont think the cars are actually in the race...too many dodgy things reported...for it to be just a bug rather than deliberate design of the game.
Sad because the racing experience is quite thrilling but whats the point if it aint really racing just some crappy sim management model....
Caldera Codemasters honcho said:
A lotus or virgin car shouldnt be beating a Mclaren or Red Bull end of.
So the 360 and ps3 cant handle 24 cars on the track with individual AI for each sooooo they just activate or simulate it within X distance of the player car....right ok....so if the cars/textures are not on the track where are they? Im assuming hes including cars because he said they cant do the camera on each car.....
Sorry but thats BS. And that is his reason for not doing individual ai on each car round the entire track.
F1 cars cannot move that fast WTF! you think? lol i cannot believe he said that using it as an excuse as a programmer/developer... just wow..
F19 stealth fighter for the commodore 64 managed to have smt like x120 time advances but wait omg...that would speed up the stealth fighter to LUDICROUS speed and break the laws of the multiverse...the f19 cant fly that fast so the devs cant do it.
I seem to remember Geoff Crammonds F1 game having time advance (or was it F1 CE ? ) and you could see each car going round the track... and how old are they?
I should just say now from what some people have reported and HIS response (and my limited experience of F1 2010) i get the feeling that F1 2010 is a rally TT game with F1 environment...the F1 nuts and bolts isnt there only the simulation of the nuts and bolts and they are shown up to be cheap magician's tricks.
see above..told you. The AI isnt racing at all..such a fubared system
but then he says this
THIS contradicts what people have reported regarding rubber banding, teleporting cars who spin off and then teleport to a preset position on the track (ie simulated model not actual racing)
http://uk.gamespot.com/xbox360/driving/f12010/show_msgs.php?topic_id=m-1-56563167&pid=959808
He then goes onto talk about the issues of the game... he mentions split times but he pretty much just parrots the back of the box blah blah that split times are based off the leader...yeah m8 we know that wtf...we want the split/gap times between drivers - why cant you see that? Perhaps its too difficult to do....or wait maybe the cars arent on the track...maybe thats why he cant do it
But wait a minute all the drivers are racing in the actual race (so he assures us) and they only dont appear in qualifying because of LUDICROUS speed and how it might destroy the universe if they try to put the timings of individual cars in.......No problem m8 happy to beta test your wreck of a F1 game...that we paid for
So sorry i dont think the cars are actually in the race...too many dodgy things reported...for it to be just a bug rather than deliberate design of the game.
Sad because the racing experience is quite thrilling but whats the point if it aint really racing just some crappy sim management model....
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Well I've done a faster lap during a race than I did to get pole position.
Not sure whether I'm a freak or just special but I'm halfway through my first season and have experienced hardly any of the issues people are reporting.
Pit stops have been fine for me, but I always start on option tyres and then pit as early as possible. So if my prime tyres have a 25 lap duration, I'll pit at the end of lap 5 on a 30 lap race. In fairness no-one else is has been in the pits at the same time which is probably why I haven't had a problem.
Same with the rubberbanding. I can quite easily open up a gap on cars behind me and they don't seem to get any nearer, although usually I can't open up more than a 5 second gap.
My only complaint is that seven out of eight races so far have been in the rain, made the hairpins at Monaco an absolute nightmare.
Pit stops have been fine for me, but I always start on option tyres and then pit as early as possible. So if my prime tyres have a 25 lap duration, I'll pit at the end of lap 5 on a 30 lap race. In fairness no-one else is has been in the pits at the same time which is probably why I haven't had a problem.
Same with the rubberbanding. I can quite easily open up a gap on cars behind me and they don't seem to get any nearer, although usually I can't open up more than a 5 second gap.
My only complaint is that seven out of eight races so far have been in the rain, made the hairpins at Monaco an absolute nightmare.
I've never managed to pull ahead of anyone to give me a decent gap to pull a pitstop in...
worse case is if I leave the pitstop too late then all the others have effectively caught up before I've done mine or they don't pit at all... End results are I lose too many places.
Rubberbanding in an F1 game with pitstopping is a huge mistake, fundamental design flaw that wrecks the whole racing experience..
If codemasters release a patch, and its going to have to be a bloody good patch then least this'll be more then Microprose, or infrogrammes did for Grand Prix 4...
Sadly, that games was also amazingly bugged at released.. Seems I've been bitten twice with F1 games, however with Grand Prix 4 the game was released and nothing was fixed for months... In fact, the mod community then spent years fixing it.... Game finally become decent in around 2006 when some decent full season mods were released...
F1 2010 had better not go down this route..
worse case is if I leave the pitstop too late then all the others have effectively caught up before I've done mine or they don't pit at all... End results are I lose too many places.
Rubberbanding in an F1 game with pitstopping is a huge mistake, fundamental design flaw that wrecks the whole racing experience..
If codemasters release a patch, and its going to have to be a bloody good patch then least this'll be more then Microprose, or infrogrammes did for Grand Prix 4...
Sadly, that games was also amazingly bugged at released.. Seems I've been bitten twice with F1 games, however with Grand Prix 4 the game was released and nothing was fixed for months... In fact, the mod community then spent years fixing it.... Game finally become decent in around 2006 when some decent full season mods were released...
F1 2010 had better not go down this route..
Soldato
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I was doing really well (21st in a Virgin with a few laps left and some cars still needed to pit) and I got a puncture.
I go into the pits and the pit crew are facing the wrong way. I mean seriously, wtf?!
I go into the pits and the pit crew are facing the wrong way. I mean seriously, wtf?!
I mentioned this yesterday, it makes a huge difference. With tyre wear on I'm 2-3 seconds a lap slower than what I can do with it set off, and that's with a fresh set of tyres on.
Clarkson said:
You shouldn't be able to, not if you have tyre wear and fuel simulation on at least. It's completely unrealistic, that's why it's so annoying when the AI do it.
Surfer, maybe if you read what he said properly then it would make more sense.
No it's no including cars. The car physics and ai will still be simulated - he is saying that you can't change the camera because textures/mehes won't have been loaded.
If you sped up the time then the ai and physics simulations would also have to speed up (unless you sacrificed accuracy which isn't really an option). I don't know the example you are referring to but I would guess that the physics were massively approximated in the sped up version which might be ok in a plane but not in a car.
He also clearly explained the teleporting car issue - it isn't to do with ai at all.
Clearly there are bugs, some serious, but at least they've communicated the situation and are working on a patch.
No it's no including cars. The car physics and ai will still be simulated - he is saying that you can't change the camera because textures/mehes won't have been loaded.
If you sped up the time then the ai and physics simulations would also have to speed up (unless you sacrificed accuracy which isn't really an option). I don't know the example you are referring to but I would guess that the physics were massively approximated in the sped up version which might be ok in a plane but not in a car.
He also clearly explained the teleporting car issue - it isn't to do with ai at all.
Clearly there are bugs, some serious, but at least they've communicated the situation and are working on a patch.