Agreed, I can't say Ive ever seen a directx performance release from Ms
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DirectX and OpenGL will start offering low-level access in order to reduce draw overhead
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Agreed, I can't say Ive ever seen a directx performance release from Ms
After way Khronos handled 3.3 yea.....I have complete faith in them; not.
MS how many times have they promised this ********. PC gaming hasn't even been an afterthought for MS for years - and promises of they will make sure PC gamers are taken care of ********* again*
I'm in the camp of; if they actually deliver awesome; but also will use Mantle to keep those two honest.
If mantle developes into something far greater also as it keeps the pressure on MS and Khronos to actually get off their asses and do sometime. Until then its lip service.
AMD's actually delivering....now lets see if MS and Khronos will or if its more bs
MS how many times have they promised this ********. PC gaming hasn't even been an afterthought for MS for years - and promises of they will make sure PC gamers are taken care of ********* again*
I'm in the camp of; if they actually deliver awesome; but also will use Mantle to keep those two honest.
If mantle developes into something far greater also as it keeps the pressure on MS and Khronos to actually get off their asses and do sometime. Until then its lip service.
AMD's actually delivering....now lets see if MS and Khronos will or if its more bs
Hell yeah! it's a total flop, I can't believe the first release is so bad considering how much they charge for it! Direct3D only took until version 6.1 before it was actually any good and 9.0 before it was better than OpenGL!
I don't think you're getting my point.
And anyway the APIs are independent of each other. Why would anybody use DX when Mantle is available? What benefit does DX offer over Mantle? I can't think of any other than being more stable but say in a few months time when the bugs are ironed out?
If AMD didn't want it to become the industry standard why make it 'open'? It's in their interest for it to replace DX because it drives sales of graphics cards even if nVidia did adopt it. This is probably never going to be a realistic goal but not to say Mantle can't be a nice added feature for AMD users.
Soldato
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I don't think you're getting my point.
And anyway the APIs are independent of each other. Why would anybody use DX when Mantle is available? What benefit does DX offer over Mantle? I can't think of any other than being more stable but say in a few months time when the bugs are ironed out?
If AMD didn't want it to become the industry standard why make it 'open'? It's in their interest for it to replace DX because it drives sales of graphics cards even if nVidia did adopt it. This is probably never going to be a realistic goal but not to say Mantle can't be a nice added feature for AMD users.
You correct the API's are different, but the architecture is the same GCN and if you read about at AMD press events etc they same a couple times about Devs being able to easy use most of the same code they have on the console.
"Port authority
One of the final benefits that AMD laid out in its Mantle presentation at AMD Hawaii was that the API can leverage optimization work from next-gen game consoles to PCs.
Because Graphics Core Next has been around for a few years, game developed already know what to expect from the Mante's GCN-based architecture.
"That means it will allow those same developers to utilize that knowledge gained and leverage that to shorten the learning curve and development cycle," said Corpus.
"The experience of developing on Mantle of GCN arch could help improve and speed up the ports that are happening between consoles and the PC."
Faster porting times, lower development costs, and the ability to work on other pressing issues is all going to benefit the end user when a game comes out"
http://www.techradar.com/news/compu...w-level-api-with-high-level-potential-1190692
Not sure what relevance that has to the point I was making?
Indeedy. At the worst, it'll be something nice for owners of AMD cards to use
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No doubt it will be used to plug a new windows or something. Good news though.
Mantle works better for peeps with low end CPU's even APU's and higher end GPU to remove the CPU bottleneck but peeps I know would own both a decent CPU paired with a decent GPU so little to no gain.
Also MS was never going to let it take over from its baby DX.
Sony could adopt Mantle so 1/2 the consoles but MS own other 1/2 of console market then Nvidia can say no.
I never got involved in any of the Mantel threads but it was a lot of belated promises and was not as good as it was initially claimed to be.
Its good if this is what made MS get their finger out but they would eventually have done so but possibly not as soon, they have let Windows slip also and need to do something.
This is 1st and last I will mention Mantle in any detail and will not be in the Mantel threads (too many of them anyhow).
Someone with a 4770k+high end GPU does not need mantle.
Also MS was never going to let it take over from its baby DX.
Sony could adopt Mantle so 1/2 the consoles but MS own other 1/2 of console market then Nvidia can say no.
I never got involved in any of the Mantel threads but it was a lot of belated promises and was not as good as it was initially claimed to be.
Its good if this is what made MS get their finger out but they would eventually have done so but possibly not as soon, they have let Windows slip also and need to do something.
This is 1st and last I will mention Mantle in any detail and will not be in the Mantel threads (too many of them anyhow).
Someone with a 4770k+high end GPU does not need mantle.
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Don't be so sure about that ^^^ 20 - 30% gain here with a 4.8Ghz i7 http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showpost.php?p=25915105&postcount=264
This, its a shame some ppl turned it into Nvidia vs AMD.
This, its a shame some ppl turned it into Nvidia vs AMD.
At work, so not had chance to look but is it all working for everyone now, as when I looked about yesterday, it wasn't?
And besides, this is about some needed poking, of which MS have got.
lol knew it wouldn't take long for the first RIP mantle post.
See my post - we've seen just how well Khronos runs **** with 3.3 debacle. MS has been promising years; not just a couple its 6+ years now that PC gaming will once again take for front with MS.
******** on both fronts - as I said; I'll believe it when I see it. Until Both MS and Khronos actually put their money where their mouth is and actually deliver what they promise in a timely fashion. *aka not 5+ years from now for MS and 10+ years for Khronos; but actually now* I will continue to support mantle. Its not DOA - its actually delivering for beta software in partly alpha form.
It took MS how long with DX to make it useful? 6.1 - wasn't until DX 9 that it passed opengl in features - its taken Opengl how long to just actually catch up to DX? Nearly 10 years......
People are now cheering for MS and Khronos to do something they should have done 10 years ago? No I'm not cheering as I've heard this **** all before and until they actually delivery *you know like AMD actually has* then its all lip service.
Great if they do....and I'm saying a big IF - until then enjoying Mantle....
******** on both fronts - as I said; I'll believe it when I see it. Until Both MS and Khronos actually put their money where their mouth is and actually deliver what they promise in a timely fashion. *aka not 5+ years from now for MS and 10+ years for Khronos; but actually now* I will continue to support mantle. Its not DOA - its actually delivering for beta software in partly alpha form.
It took MS how long with DX to make it useful? 6.1 - wasn't until DX 9 that it passed opengl in features - its taken Opengl how long to just actually catch up to DX? Nearly 10 years......
People are now cheering for MS and Khronos to do something they should have done 10 years ago? No I'm not cheering as I've heard this **** all before and until they actually delivery *you know like AMD actually has* then its all lip service.
Great if they do....and I'm saying a big IF - until then enjoying Mantle....
My post wasn't intended to big up OpenGL, it was supposed to provide contrast to Gregs dismay that the very first release of Mantle hasn't cured cancer and ended world hunger.
But for reference it's taken OpenGL so long to catch back up to Direct3D because once D3D 9.0 surpassed it people lost interest in OpenGL as all gamers used Windows, it's only in recent times with the OSX/Linux consumer base growing and the mobile market that OpenGL has found renewed interest/development.
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Agree with this, MS has been serving DX lip service for many years and never actually delivering, same goes for OpenGL.
AMD just sprang Mantle upon us without any prior lip service.
I believe it when i see it, i see Mantle and i like what i see.
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^^ This.
AMD deserve credit for what they have done. For those saying Mantle is a failure, if that was true would MS even be taking action.. Obviously it's been great for competition.
When I'm getting even more performance from my glistening GTX 780 Ti's, in a nice new close to the metal DirectX I will give a nod of respect to the AMD side
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You know AMD are part of the Khronos group, right? People seem to forget that it would be very easy, considering AMD are paid up within it to have released Mantle within it. But they didn't.
The extra GPU sales were obviously more important than all the industry advancement marketing hyperbole. But the under dog and indestructible ivory tower can never do any wrong, it's NV that are the lock-down anti consumerists.
Better things will come out of AMDs venture, much like sea incrustation did many millions of years ago lol. Bleak but true.
The only way a new thriving API will root itself is if it is released as an open standard from it's very beginning and available within something as established as Khronos, not necessarily having to be Khronos.
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Caporegime
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All talk as far as I'm concerned.