Associate
Thats what the Employment and Support Allowance - Work Related Activities Group is for. Jesus christ.
Disabled couple snooped on and accused of fraud by the DWP
- Thread starter BowdonUK
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Soldato
Yeah what I heard is that the move from DLA to PIP was meant to be a cost cutting exercise. It backfired on the DWP because some of the new claims were mental health related and the DWP wasn't expecting that. Plus, the point made here about taxpayers' money being spent on claims reaching the tribunal stage. What I heard is that 70% of tribunals are successful for the plaintiff, but whether it is 70% or 80%, means it is a huge error margin on the DWP's / Capita's part.
Yes, or at least it should be. But for whatever reason we seem to have a status quo whereby a load of people are permanently signed off as sick for all sorts of reasons.
That's fine, you can do casual work/contract work or claim unemployment benefits.
This seems like a common enough situation for many though:
The potential financial madness aside, that’s a shocking outcome if true. Possibly bordering on punitive.
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Soldato
Yeah, it seems their process is.
DENY DENY DENY, for as long as possible to reduce the amount of claims that push through the appeals process, whether this be due to people getting better, getting worse and dying (happens) or they just give up. Many do give up because due to their illness they just can't cope.
Its a chokehold and seems setup this way at the detriment of the vulnerable. When you see over at least 70% being accepted at tribunal this proves that. They don't want to put the funds into the initial assessment process where it matters. That would mean a lot more people would be accepted initially rather than years down the line in their application appeals process and those people who normally give up.
But the fact we have so many people sick in this country is also far more indicative to the mess our NHS is in, lack of proper care and treatment etc. Again as others have said, a lot of these people would be treated and functionally able to go back to work if they were being treated/diagnosed in a reasonable time frame, but we know this isn't happening.
BUT REMEMBER GUYS ITS SUPER EASY TO GET PIP/LCWRA WITH A BAD BACK.
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Does this sound like another big story recently?
So just keep appealing (get the guidance about how to milk it as much as possible; don't go to the meeting if it requires climbing stairs even if you can actually climb stairs as you want to milk it to the max) then get all the way to a tribunal where they'll err on the side of caution and believe you can't possibly do any work along with 2.5 million or so other people in the UK.
And if anyone questions how it is that 2.5million+ people aren't capable of doing any work at all just cite the tribunals and the experts saying so, it all seems really plausible that so many are so sick.
And if anyone questions how it is that 2.5million+ people aren't capable of doing any work at all just cite the tribunals and the experts saying so, it all seems really plausible that so many are so sick.
Soldato
What?
Yeah, read the post twice and still don’t get it.
I think they're trying to be sarcastic
As someone who developed a chronic illness some years ago that has robbed me of my ability to work (and believe me I had a very sound career) leave my house and essentially live any kind of sensible life it always amazes me when perfectly healthy people assume they will never get sick and never imagine that life maybe doesn’t always work out how you planned. Can some of those on benefits work? No doubt about it.
Are plenty of them genuinely sick? Absolutely.
You know, what I would give to feel well just for one day a week. The things I could do.
Are plenty of them genuinely sick? Absolutely.
You know, what I would give to feel well just for one day a week. The things I could do.
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My wife's dad can hardly walk, his knees are so bad, the doctors and hospital say he is too young for knees replacement (62) hasn't worked since he was made redundant 4 years ago, reason is a mix of doesn't drive, age seems to be against him in many jobs he applies for, his knees stop him from being on his feet, and he's not tech savvy so struggles with a computer and wouldn't be any good at a desk job, he's been a manual labour type guy all his life.
His partner earns minimum wage, and just about makes ends meet after paying rent etc.
Tried applying for pip and any other form of benefits to help and gets knocked back, apparently partner earns too much money to be eligible. They go to the food bank regularly.
Me and the wife get shopping and give them money to help regularly, but they dislike our help as they feel ashamed, so it's hard for us to help, they'd rather freeze than accept our help out of pride.
I don't think it's easy to get benefits, but that doesn't mean there aren't people out their who know how to work the system, and I think those types are getting less and less as time goes on.
Ooh another story from a guy I used to work with ( well he worked at another branch but we got on well), got polio when he was very young but managed for the majority of his life, it then started to get exponentially worse when he hit his 40's and spent years on crutches, but still worked. When he hit his mid 50's he ended up wheel chair bound, and eventually had to give up his job due to being unable to get to work (no way of working from home way back then in the job role at the time). DWP summoned him to see them for an appointment, gets to the address and there is a flight of steps outside the building, he calls them and says I'm outside but can't get up the steps is there a disabled access, told the disabled access is round the back but it's out of bounds having work done. He says how can I make the appointment you'd better come outside, apparently the lady got shorty with him and said if you don't make the appointment you lose your benefits, to which he replied if I'm disabled in a wheel chair how do you expect me to climb a flight of steps... Silence while the penny dropped, lady ended up going outside didn't bother with the assesment and just signed documents and handed over what needed handing over.
Certainly won't be all honey and roses but it can't be worse than this **** show. Been overseas a lot so was out of the loop and have voted tory many times but never again. We have to remove these chancers and at least try to get our country to approach first world status again, it is pitiful that people from around the world come here for a better life and then have to watch us queue at food banks. But yeah lets stick with the status quo.
Commissario
Yup
One of my mum's best friends (40 years when my mum died), used to go out with her to all sorts of places for meals, shopping, and to theatre etc and despite knowing my mum for all that time, having helped my mum get in and out of the car, pushed her wheelchair etc goes me us one day after she'd broken her ankle "I never realised how limiting crutches are day to day until now"
The other thing is that a lot of people see someone who might be ill and decide "they're fine, they're moving around and in the shop, they're obviously faking it" without a clue that it might be the first time that week the person has been able to get out, or that they might have had to weigh up the need to get something essential vs the pain/how it's going to make them worse potentially for days.
Or that you can say easily work around needing something like dialyses several times a week.
It doesn't even get into the side effects a lot of common medications have, people don't seem to grasp that when a medication says "do not operate heavy machinery" it's usually because at least for some people it really does impair judgement etc, and that it basically includes anything from power tools to driving a HGV, so you might find that your medication on it's own means you now cannot reliably drive or do a lot of jobs safely regardless of the actual illness or disability you've got, and can mean it also impairs your ability to think clearly/deal with simple tasks (it states the "no driving" or "no operating heavy machinery" because of the safety risk from impairment).
This thread reminds me of the arguments where people didn't understand how motability worked (having to get mobility allowance, then give it all up, often with a hefty upfront fee for a loan car), or that disabled people had varying needs, so you'd get the insane suggestion that the only car that should be offered should be a special model. A suggestion that showed so much ignorance on how varied disability is as things as simple as entry/seat height requirements vary massively (to the point where any "one model fits all" would need complex variable adjustable suspension just to allow the user base to access it), let alone the cost involved in developing even simple car and producing it would have meant it cost more per vehicle than simply having users able to choose from a whole range (where you could choose one that fitted your needs from a manufacturers standard range).
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Soldato
Sorry about your wifes father, part of me thinks maybe they need to speak to CAB so they can properly navigate through the pip process with them. AFAIK he should still be able to claim pip so his partner earning to much does not make sense to me.
I must say it does frustrates me that many don't get the help they need, partly due to how difficult/confusing the process is and how lengthy it can be, with rejections, appeals etc.
The whole situation with no disabled access at an assessment centre can be used as an example of how bad the application process is for people with benefits. Terrible... inaccessible....
I must say it does frustrates me that many don't get the help they need, partly due to how difficult/confusing the process is and how lengthy it can be, with rejections, appeals etc.
The whole situation with no disabled access at an assessment centre can be used as an example of how bad the application process is for people with benefits. Terrible... inaccessible....
Commissario
Oh god that reminds me of the old joke (I think i've mentioned it before) for various disability assessments.
"How can you tell someone doesn't need the benefit"
"they made it into the office" or "they made it to the assessment".
My local assessment centre right up until something like 2010 was on the forth or fifth floor of a building that didn't have disabled access, no lift and no parking anywhere near it.
Apparently one of the questions they routinely ask is "how did you get here today", and if you give the wrong answer it counts against you, same with if when you answer the polite sounding "how are you today" by doing what most people tend to do, and give the default normally expected polite answer of "not bad".
Re your father in law, PIP shouldn't be related to income or saving at all from memory, definitely worth him appealing and pushing if he's been turned down with that being any part of the reason.
Soldato
PIP isn't means-tested (I work), so I would say - give it another go, or appeal the existing claim if it's recent. It's advisable to get help as well from a relevant charity. For me, it was the RNIB and they helped with both my vision loss and hearing loss. My caseworker told me what medical tests / documents to get, which can be acquired using a "subject access request" from the relevant hospitals. Then I would explain in detail using the medical tests how they affect me in real life, indoors and outdoors, reading, socialising, communications, moving around and so on.
Soldato
YES do this, Please call the cab they will help you greatly with this and provide someone to help you navigate the process if the person themselves can't manage.
They are truly magical sometimes with getting things resolved finding out things you are entitled to that you never knew about.
They move. I did. Thanks to the Travel to Interview scheme I was able to attend an interview in Aberdeen when I was living in Luton. I got the job.