Do you have a plan?

[Roar87]

you'll probably win as no doubt my zombies will stop at every service station for a cup of tea

French Zombies would be on strike over pay conditions by lunch time

 

[Junglist]

I don't see the point in making a plan. I'm sure I'd either be Patient 0 or I'd get caught out in the initial outbreak

 

[adolf hamster]

Not quite.
The 7.62 L7A2 is the FN MAG, MAG standing for something-something-something in Belgian, which translates to General Purpose Machine Gun (GPMG), hence the name. The Minimi is its 5.56 replacement, but is more of a squad/platoon level support weapon (while also filling GPMG roles when 7.62 isn't a priority). It's just a bit after my time... and the L7 is still in use, AFAIK.
By contrast, the L85 and L86 are more like family weapons.

fair enough, i'd have placed both the minimi and mag in the same classification of "GPMG" as in a belt-fed one-man portable machine gun (albeit normally needing others to carry ammo/spare barrels if needed) that can also be vehicle/emplacement mounted if needs be

wheras the l86 is lets face it, an l85 with a long barrel and a bipod and not exactly an ideal support weapon due to lack of capacity.

Do not rely on headshots...

gonna be tricky to do given we're assuming traditional zombie etiquette ie: only headshots work

the idea really is stealth/avoiding zombie confrontation hence the use of the silencer (which works pretty well on a .22 compared to more powerful rounds), it's very much aimed at taking out the odd random zombie that's unavoidable rather than the traditional "gunning down the hoardes" approach. hence any confrontation is going to be a really short range surprise attack by the zombie (read mag-dump in the general face direction) or a longer range surprise attack by me (read plenty of time to aim properly)

That requires you being in a position to drop your main weapon and switch to the backup. Not good in hairy moments, without a lot of training.

true, especially for anything of any bulk (ie full size smg or rifle) that'll be a pita to carry and switch (say what you like about airsoft but it clears up that COD myth about 2 rifles instantly), but my general view is better than nothing.
i'd say the traditional "glock 18" except of course i know as well as you do trying to fire a 9mm pistol full auto without a stock/ton of training is going to be more likely to hurt me than the zombies

i'd likely run an sa80 sling (just about the best thing about them imo) on the rifle then preferably some kind of holster arrangement for the sidearm, if i were going for a straight up pistol as opposed to an smg it'd be easier as there are many drop-leg options available which are convenient enough but dont get in the way.

 

[J.T]

Yes, but I'm not telling you lot!!!

 

[ttaskmaster]

fair enough, i'd have placed both the minimi and mag in the same classification of "GPMG" as in a belt-fed one-man portable machine gun

In the broadest definition, then yes. But in this instance GPMG also refers to one specific weapon. Minimis are also mag-fed, if needs be.
You used to have the LMG, which was a 7.62 version of the Bren and was a Section weapon, while the GPMG was more of a Platoon level support weapon, as well as featuring in the weapons platoon. Later the GPMG replaced the Bren at Section level too and, I believe, still fills more roles than a Minimi... plus it's 7.62, which is just awesome.

wheras the l86 is lets face it, an l85 with a long barrel and a bipod and not exactly an ideal support weapon due to lack of capacity.

I quite liked it, actually.
Not as good at general purpose machine-gunning as... well, a General Purpose Machine Gun... But it was very accurate. Probably why they were used as a designated marksman weapon.

gonna be tricky to do given we're assuming traditional zombie etiquette ie: only headshots work

But you're not always in a position to get a headshot and it's far harder in real life. This is why you're taught to shoot centre of mass and why even large, head-bursting calibres make use of double taps and burst fires.

read mag-dump in the general face direction

Then save ammo and get a larger calibre that's more likely to do it in one shot.

or a longer range surprise attack by me (read plenty of time to aim properly)

As above... or use Mortars like me!!

but my general view is better than nothing.

And if you're that close, something that does loads of damage and doesn't need ammo is even better. I'm quite partial to large pickaxe handles.

i'd likely run an sa80 sling (just about the best thing about them imo) on the rifle then preferably some kind of holster arrangement for the sidearm, if i were going for a straight up pistol as opposed to an smg it'd be easier as there are many drop-leg options available which are convenient enough but dont get in the way.

Just use an HK53 and be done with it. Covers all basic points.

 

[adolf hamster]

In the broadest definition, then yes. But in this instance GPMG also refers to one specific weapon. Minimis are also mag-fed, if needs be.
You used to have the LMG, which was a 7.62 version of the Bren and was a Section weapon, while the GPMG was more of a Platoon level support weapon, as well as featuring in the weapons platoon. Later the GPMG replaced the Bren at Section level too and, I believe, still fills more roles than a Minimi... plus it's 7.62, which is just awesome.

good point, 7.62 is definately the preferred caliber for a gpmg especially when you're needing it for ranged work.

I quite liked it, actually.
Not as good at general purpose machine-gunning as... well, a General Purpose Machine Gun... But it was very accurate. Probably why they were used as a designated marksman weapon.

i suppose it's not much worse than the bren, but i can see the advantages, iirc didn't the early versions have accuracy problems due to the bipod construction? something about the first shot being dead on followed by everything else going left? probably something hk fixed but i can see why calling it a dmr is more appropriate

But you're not always in a position to get a headshot and it's far harder in real life. This is why you're taught to shoot centre of mass and why even large, head-bursting calibres make use of double taps and burst fires.

true, but a lack of headshots with any weapon against a zombie (well, until we get to the blowing off limbs calibers) isn't going to do much.

.22 is easy found, low recoil (perfect for double taps), and just enough terminal effect to get the job done if you do go for the head, which again is the only place to aim on a conventional zombie, plus the ability to carry a ton of it means you don't have to worry as much about ammo conservation.

Then save ammo and get a larger calibre that's more likely to do it in one shot.

i'm meaning more about actually getting the hit rather than the need for multiple hits for the sake of putting them down.

As above... or use Mortars like me!!

and attract the hoarde? hope you've got a LOT of 7.62 loaded up for when they inevitably charge

And if you're that close, something that does loads of damage and doesn't need ammo is even better. I'm quite partial to large pickaxe handles.

true, melee is another option, it's not unreasonable to include something like a machete or an axe (proper woodcutting axe not some tactihawk thing) as both anti-zombie and just general purpose survival related work.

traditional answer: chainsaw bayonet

Just use an HK53 and be done with it. Covers all basic points.

the important points with .22 are the ability to carry ammo (lots of it) and the ability to suppress it well whilst retaining enough lethality with a headshot.

an hk53 is gonna be loud enough to wake the dead let alone attract a hoarde of them, and realistically (for me at least) carrying more than 2-300 rounds ain't gonna be fun.

 

[ttaskmaster]

i suppose it's not much worse than the bren, but i can see the advantages, iirc didn't the early versions have accuracy problems due to the bipod construction? something about the first shot being dead on followed by everything else going left? probably something hk fixed but i can see why calling it a dmr is more appropriate

Much better than the Bren!
It was a bit of a lottery, really, but the good ones were tagged and loved. Some did fire split groupings, but some were bang on.

true, but a lack of headshots with any weapon against a zombie (well, until we get to the blowing off limbs calibers) isn't going to do much.

Massive stopping power will at least put them down, though. You don't want to empty a mag and still have them coming.

.22 is easy found, low recoil (perfect for double taps),

Found where? It'll all be locked up in peoples' cabinets. Good luck breaking into those quietly. Calibre and recoil aren't really a deciding factor in DTing, either... unless you're talking anti-tank rifles.
I'll stick with the larger rounds, thanks.

plus the ability to carry a ton of it means you don't have to worry as much about ammo conservation.

If you're not worried, you're not exercising proper fire discipline.

i'm meaning more about actually getting the hit rather than the need for multiple hits for the sake of putting them down.

Then train better, rather than relying on unloading a whole magazine to land one shot.

and attract the hoarde? hope you've got a LOT of 7.62 loaded up for when they inevitably charge

Yes, that would be fine - The Horde can be funnelled in and then dowsed with mortar fire. It'd be like Agincourt, but with big explosions!!
Makes my job a lot easier and there won't be many left when it finally gets to the 7.62.

traditional answer: chainsaw bayonet

Requires 'ammo' still, in the form of fuel and is loud enough to bring that horde you so fear... and will mess you up if you make a mistake with it.
Not good.

the important points with .22 are the ability to carry ammo (lots of it) and the ability to suppress it well whilst retaining enough lethality with a headshot.

Even a silenced .22 is as loud as a dry-firing airgun. It's not as quiet as you think.

an hk53 is gonna be loud enough to wake the dead let alone attract a hoarde of them, and realistically (for me at least) carrying more than 2-300 rounds ain't gonna be fun.

It's not that heavy. It's 5.56 - You can have almost 500 rounds magged up easy enough in just typical PLCE. Plenty more kit to carry more.
Besides, if you need that much ammo on your person for whatever it is you're doing, you're probably going about it wrong.

 

[adolf hamster]

Much better than the Bren!
It was a bit of a lottery, really, but the good ones were tagged and loved. Some did fire split groupings, but some were bang on.

makes sense, there's always the tags to either avoid or go for

Massive stopping power will at least put them down, though. You don't want to empty a mag and still have them coming.

true, although like i say the tactic is primarily avoidance rather than fighting, if there's a group of zombies charging me i don't rate my chances much regardless of the weapon.

Found where? It'll all be locked up in peoples' cabinets. Good luck breaking into those quietly. Calibre and recoil aren't really a deciding factor in DTing, either... unless you're talking anti-tank rifles.
I'll stick with the larger rounds, thanks.

true, but when it comes to raiding people's cabinets i don't rate my chances of finding 5.56 or 7.62 anywhere near as abundantly as .22

If you're not worried, you're not exercising proper fire discipline.

that's true in all situations, but i'm thinking in the long-run with no guaranteed re-supply, if you have thousands on you then burning through half a dozen mags in an encounter is a dent rather than half your ammo gone regardless of your shot-kill ratio

Then train better, rather than relying on unloading a whole magazine to land one shot.

this is the "oh **** i just got jumped by a zombie hiding behind a door" scenario where it's very much a case of shoot until dead, although granted it'd be smarter to open doors with melee weapon in hand for that kind of thing.

if there's any free time then aimed shots are the go-to

Yes, that would be fine - The Horde can be funnelled in and then dowsed with mortar fire. It'd be like Agincourt, but with big explosions!!
Makes my job a lot easier and there won't be many left when it finally gets to the 7.62.

well, hope that works for you, the more dead zombies the better!

Requires 'ammo' still, in the form of fuel and is loud enough to bring that horde you so fear... and will mess you up if you make a mistake with it.
Not good.

[disclaimer] comments marked "traditional answer" may not be serious [/disclaimer]

Even a silenced .22 is as loud as a dry-firing airgun. It's not as quiet as you think.

true, but short of getting my hands on a de-lisle carbine (which lets face it ain't happening) it's as quiet as can be reasonably obtained. certainly quieter than 5.56 or 7.62

It's not that heavy. It's 5.56 - You can have almost 500 rounds magged up easy enough in just typical PLCE. Plenty more kit to carry more.
Besides, if you need that much ammo on your person for whatever it is you're doing, you're probably going about it wrong.

this is where i differ in opinion, i'm considering that ammunition is going to be extremely scarce and therefore being able to carry as much as possible is a bonus, the simple fact is you can carry ~250 rounds of .22 for every 2 mags of 5.56 (based on rough box size) makes for roughly 4x the ammo in a rucksack and even conservatively you'll be able to fit minimum 2 25 round sticks of .22 for every 5.56 mag, so nearly twice as much magged up ammo with 4x as much in a rucksack.

this is very much a long-term plan of avoiding zombies, being able to hunt/survive for years with no guaranteed resupply, of course i'd be perfectly happier for heavier weaponry to be available if we're talking a stay-put situation when lugging a lifetime's supply of ammo around isn't a requirement.

 

[TacticalFish]

i have actually got a pretty detailed zombie plan that will work against a traditional "walking dead"

Actually sounds like it could be made into quite a fun game. Kinda like Stronghold but with zombies and first person.

 

[ttaskmaster]

true, although like i say the tactic is primarily avoidance rather than fighting, if there's a group of zombies charging me i don't rate my chances much regardless of the weapon.

So carry only one magazine, or a hand weapon and force yourself to avoid them.
I find most people able to carry lots of ammo do tend to try and use it....

true, but when it comes to raiding people's cabinets i don't rate my chances of finding 5.56 or 7.62 anywhere near as abundantly as .22

Which is why I've gone the military route, where you'll find weapons and ammo in plentiful supply.
Chances are you'll also find anyone with firearms probably alive and guarding their own stuff anyway, so the whole idea is useless.
So few civvies with them, nowadays, as well, so I don't know where you expect to find all this .22 ammo...

that's true in all situations, but i'm thinking in the long-run with no guaranteed re-supply, if you have thousands on you then burning through half a dozen mags in an encounter is a dent rather than half your ammo gone regardless of your shot-kill ratio

Half a dozen mags???!!!
Blimey, kid - See argument above about having lots and using lots. Have you actually hit anything with all these rounds yet, or are you just blatting away in the hope of landing that single headshot, still?

this is the "oh **** i just got jumped by a zombie hiding behind a door" scenario where it's very much a case of shoot until dead, although granted it'd be smarter to open doors with melee weapon in hand for that kind of thing.

You can still miss a whole mag's worth even at point blank, if you panic enough.
I said train better - This could mean reflexively bashing the zombie in the head with the butt of your rifle or smashing it's face in with the muzzle and getting a guaranteed hit in that way.

if there's any free time then aimed shots are the go-to

If you're jumped to the point where you blatt off a whole mag in a blind panic, aiming probably won't help you. Get a shotgun and find a deity to pray to.

well, hope that works for you, the more dead zombies the better!

Have you seen what a mortar round can do?
Of course it'll work for me!!!!!

true, but short of getting my hands on a de-lisle carbine (which lets face it ain't happening) it's as quiet as can be reasonably obtained. certainly quieter than 5.56 or 7.62

Too small for comfortable reliability. Even 5.56 is a bit paltry, really.
But who's to say zombies hunt through sound, or that they can't hear your heartbeat, or smell your brains?

this is where i differ in opinion, i'm considering that ammunition is going to be extremely scarce and therefore being able to carry as much as possible is a bonus

It is a bonus.
I'm sure you'll feel happier knowing you have the potential to carry two or perhaps three thousand rounds of .22... even though you can only find nine of them and the one, dented old magazine you have available cab only fit four...

I'm still sticking with heavier ammo and better application than risk anything turning out to be too small.

of course i'd be perfectly happier for heavier weaponry to be available if we're talking a stay-put situation when lugging a lifetime's supply of ammo around isn't a requirement.

Which is what I went for in the first place.

 

[Rroff]

Ammo probably "wouldn't" be in shortage - getting access to it and firearms might be another matter - between police, armed forces and private ranges there are at least 12 sites within 30-40 miles of me with plentiful amounts at a rough guess probably around 10-20 million rounds in total.

Regarding calibres though ultimately a lot more is going to come down to your discipline, experience and skill in placing rounds on target than the size and speed of the rounds you are using in most of these scenarios - the only downside really to using .22 is that if you are having to say penetrate stuff to hit targets you are going to have your work cut out - I've seen 22LR bounce off a windscreen before (EDIT: It will go through in many circumstances before someone thinks I'm saying it will stop them dead).

 

[Mak3R]

I admit to scoping out a few places nearby and thinking "this place has high walls all around and a good gate, I'll go here during the zombie outbreak". Beyond that I have no plan. Years of TWD and L4D2 will surely help...

 

[Telecaster]

We're all already zombies, most just don't realise it.

 

[adolf hamster]

So carry only one magazine, or a hand weapon and force yourself to avoid them.
I find most people able to carry lots of ammo do tend to try and use it....

true, although really that's a philosophy thing, rather have it and not need it etc...

Which is why I've gone the military route, where you'll find weapons and ammo in plentiful supply.
Chances are you'll also find anyone with firearms probably alive and guarding their own stuff anyway, so the whole idea is useless.
So few civvies with them, nowadays, as well, so I don't know where you expect to find all this .22 ammo...

true, although tbf this is kinda getting academic at this point, we all know if the army died to zombies there's really little chance of anyone else surviving long anyway, and if the army doesn't die to the zombies then the rest of us dont need to do anything.

plus ofc getting the ammo is secondary to getting the gun in the first place.

Half a dozen mags???!!!
Blimey, kid - See argument above about having lots and using lots. Have you actually hit anything with all these rounds yet, or are you just blatting away in the hope of landing that single headshot, still?

getting a bit heated there mate, remember tis' all in good fun this

there's no point really debating accuracy, as it's just going to end up in an argument about stress inoculation and how accurate someone can be when faced with the hoarde, i'd imagine it's not as bad as facing a human enemy though, at least zombies don't shoot back!

the point was more aimed at if you need to use 500 rounds (be that 499 misses or 499 kills) over whatever time period (minutes, years, 500 rounds is 500 rounds) then having spare (or at least the ability to carry spare) isn't going to be a bad move.

You can still miss a whole mag's worth even at point blank, if you panic enough.
I said train better - This could mean reflexively bashing the zombie in the head with the butt of your rifle or smashing it's face in with the muzzle and getting a guaranteed hit in that way.

true, again this is getting academic as to precisely how much reaction time is available, could well be a case of waking up to a zombie attacking you in which case its curtains anyway.

If you're jumped to the point where you blatt off a whole mag in a blind panic, aiming probably won't help you. Get a shotgun and find a deity to pray to.

to reference your previous point it'll still be possible to miss with a shotgun (i'm going to assume double barreled) only you've got 2 chances rather than 25.

Have you seen what a mortar round can do?
Of course it'll work for me!!!!!

oh i have no doubt of it's effectiveness when you hit the group, you'll have to be careful you don't get infected by flying tooth schrapnel

Too small for comfortable reliability. Even 5.56 is a bit paltry, really.
But who's to say zombies hunt through sound, or that they can't hear your heartbeat, or smell your brains?

i'm going with the traditional lore version of a zombie as my assumed enemy, hence assuming they respond to sound, only die to headshots etc etc.

if we're fighting something else it's not a zombie invasion in which case i will be thoroughly unprepared

It is a bonus.
I'm sure you'll feel happier knowing you have the potential to carry two or perhaps three thousand rounds of .22... even though you can only find nine of them and the one, dented old magazine you have available cab only fit four...

I'm still sticking with heavier ammo and better application than risk anything turning out to be too small.

i guess our problem here is we're approaching different problems, sounds like your plan is more taking the fight to the zombies and wiping them out with a few mates (read the army) which ofc a noble goal, whereas i'm looking at more of a one-man band survival situation.

nb i know i didn't specify earlier but my original pick of a 10/22 has 25 round stick mags available, and admittedly in this exercise i am skipping over precisely how i intend to acquire such a thing in the first place as that's as far down the realism rabbit hole i'm prepared to go

Regarding calibres though ultimately a lot more is going to come down to your discipline, experience and skill in places rounds on target than the size and speed of the rounds you are using in most of these scenarios - the only downside really to using .22 is that if you are having to say penetrate stuff to hit targets you are going to have your work cut out - I've seen 22LR bounce off a windscreen before (EDIT: It will go through in many circumstances before someone thinks I'm saying it will stop them dead).

true, .22 is nowhere near effective a round for most things like that, especially so from a more conventional standpoint of fighting a human target where torso shots are the preferred method and using something with more heft is going to have more stopping power.

my point is principally that if you're fighting an enemy that can't shoot back and can only die to a headshot then realistically long-range penetration or conventional "stopping power" isn't as relevant (to me at least) as the ability to hoard supplies and having a light, quiet and simple weapon.

 

[ttaskmaster]

true, although really that's a philosophy thing, rather have it and not need it etc...

You'll use it, though, which is the problem.

and if the army doesn't die to the zombies then the rest of us dont need to do anything.

You can expect some of us to survive, either way.
But you can be darned sure I'll not be putting my life on the line for someone who thinks they get to sit around doing nothing and leaving it all to me!!!
I've not seen any Walking Dead, but I bet you ^that's the theme of at least one episode!!

plus ofc getting the ammo is secondary to getting the gun in the first place.

Actually, it's not.
A gun without ammo is nigh-on useless. Ammo on it's own still has uses...

getting a bit heated there mate, remember tis' all in good fun this

No no, that's fine.... just remember, this big pile of ammo over here is all mine.....

there's no point really debating accuracy, as it's just going to end up in an argument about stress inoculation and how accurate someone can be when faced with the hoarde

Moot point - Mortars win, regardless.

true, again this is getting academic as to precisely how much reaction time is available

And why smacking it one is always a good option, especially if silence is your thing.
If you have time to blatt off a whole mag, you have time to realise it's easier to move out the way and save your ammo, or take one calm, well-aimed shot.

to reference your previous point it'll still be possible to miss with a shotgun (i'm going to assume double barreled) only you've got 2 chances rather than 25.

But at, what, 10 yards, a basic cylinder choke gives you a spread of well over", compared to your 0.22", with just one round. You barely need to aim at that point. Just point the dangerous end in the general direction of the zombie!!

oh i have no doubt of it's effectiveness when you hit the group, you'll have to be careful you don't get infected by flying tooth schrapnel

I'll be firing from behind cover anyway and dropping rounds with an easy 21yd blast radius.

i guess our problem here is we're approaching different problems, sounds like your plan is more taking the fight to the zombies and wiping them out with a few mates (read the army) which ofc a noble goal, whereas i'm looking at more of a one-man band survival situation.

I'm assuming I am the lone survivor on a military base, with access to most/all my favourite toys.
I'm working on a fortified position, reworked to bring them to me how/where I require and remove as many as possible.

true, .22 is nowhere near effective a round for most things like that, especially so from a more conventional standpoint of fighting a human target where torso shots are the preferred method and using something with more heft is going to have more stopping power.

7.62 machine gun - Tears through hordes of zombies, with multiple target penetrations from even single rounds.
THAT is why you want bigger rounds than a .22.

 

[adolf hamster]

You'll use it, though, which is the problem.

true, but that applies to any amount of any caliber, the question is how long can one use it without running out.

You can expect some of us to survive, either way.
But you can be darned sure I'll not be putting my life on the line for someone who thinks they get to sit around doing nothing and leaving it all to me!!!
I've not seen any Walking Dead, but I bet you ^that's the theme of at least one episode!!

hate to say it, but isn't that the army's job? otherwise why am i paying good tax money for people to play with cool kit!

Actually, it's not.
A gun without ammo is nigh-on useless. Ammo on it's own still has uses...

damn, you got me there

No no, that's fine.... just remember, this big pile of ammo over here is all mine.....

what caliber is it? if it isn't 9x19 or .22lr you can have it

Moot point - Mortars win, regardless.

mortars+carefully prepared funelling defences around a pre-cleared base win? yeah i'll give you that

And why smacking it one is always a good option, especially if silence is your thing.
If you have time to blatt off a whole mag, you have time to realise it's easier to move out the way and save your ammo, or take one calm, well-aimed shot.

true, guess the moral here will need to be "be careful of zombies when opening doors"

But at, what, 10 yards, a basic cylinder choke gives you a spread of well over", compared to your 0.22", with just one round. You barely need to aim at that point. Just point the dangerous end in the general direction of the zombie!!

depends on what loading it's using, plus if we're following through on the whole scavenging ammo thing then i don't rate the chances of finding 00' buck or slugs. that said finer pellets isn't much of an issue at such ranges.

it'd definately stop the zombie, although you'll probably have half of it left to deal with

I'll be firing from behind cover anyway and dropping rounds with an easy 21yd blast radius.

ahh good to know, safety is important when dismembering the walking dead

I'm assuming I am the lone survivor on a military base, with access to most/all my favourite toys.
I'm working on a fortified position, reworked to bring them to me how/where I require and remove as many as possible.

hate to put this to you, but if you're the lone survivor, then we have to assume everyone else is now a zombie, therefore all the toys didn't save them.

7.62 machine gun - Tears through hordes of zombies, with multiple target penetrations from even single rounds.
THAT is why you want bigger rounds than a .22.

problem is, if we're going for traditional zombies, then all that'll acheive is reducing the average number of limbs.

 

[Deleted member 66701]

I have a survival cache of 180 days of food, water, fuel and electricity if that counts. If I had to bug out obviously that would be reduced drastically.

I'm sure there is an axe and a crow bar in there somewhere.

 

[Telecaster]

These endless multi quote posts are giving me eye cancer.

 

[adolf hamster]

These

I'm

endless

happy

multi

to

quote

be

posts

of

are

service

giving

to

me

you

eye

today

cancer.

 

[ttaskmaster]

true, but that applies to any amount of any caliber, the question is how long can one use it without running out.

No, the question is what tactics you adopt in order to avoid the need for firing.

hate to say it, but isn't that the army's job? otherwise why am i paying good tax money for people to play with cool kit!

If you want paid bodyguards, hire some. The military, Police and other such services defend what they're ordered to, so unless you have some very good friends high up, you're on your own until the war rolls around to your neighbourhood.

Besides, this is the Zombie Apolcalyspe. Your money has no meaning, here and if you aren't prepared to anything more in your defence than "nothing" then neither are we!

what caliber is it? if it isn't 9x19 or .22lr you can have it

I can have it anyway. It's mine.

mortars+carefully prepared funelling defences around a pre-cleared base win? yeah i'll give you that

Mortars and open ground also a win... and pretty much any indirect fire route, really.

depends on what loading it's using, plus if we're following through on the whole scavenging ammo thing then i don't rate the chances of finding 00' buck or slugs. that said finer pellets isn't much of an issue at such ranges.

Dunno what happened with the editing, that was supposed to say 12"-19".
But regardless, it's still a wide spread of shredding devastation and at 10yds, that will probably take the head off most things.

ahh good to know, safety is important when dismembering the walking dead

Shredding.

hate to put this to you, but if you're the lone survivor, then we have to assume everyone else is now a zombie, therefore all the toys didn't save them.

They would appear to have saved me...

problem is, if we're going for traditional zombies, then all that'll acheive is reducing the average number of limbs.

Lemme rephrase - One round that goes through multiple targets, not multiple rounds through one. Hence massed target manipulation for maximum kills with minimal ammo. MG levelled at average head height, blatt away and sweep through the Horde.