Does something need to be done about dogs?
- Thread starter Dis86
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Because it looks like he's had the ears cropped. Illegal.
And the fact these dogs often won't let go under extreme pain (as they were bred to do).
Completely agree that anyone with a half functioning brain and has done the smallest amount of research wouldn't want one.
There is a surprising amount of propaganda for the 'nanny dog' in the US (pitbulls) and its stretching here as with everything in recent years. Could easily see someone being wrongly convinced they are a good choice and just need proper training which someone may try with best of intentions but these things are wild.
This is the crux of the matter for me. I'd rather train another breed properly, with the understanding that any dog can attack under the right circumstances, but the consequences of, say, a cockapoo biting another dog or person are unlikely to be life changing. If an XL bully attacks, at the very least it's going to be a nasty injury.
You can train a dog as well as you like, but the more important thing to think about is what will happen if it does attack, and what the likely outcome will be.
Soldato
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Noticed that the thread seems to have disappeared. Assuming he's realised he misjudged the audience?
Maybe he should set his dog on all the haters?
Yeah definitely aware that dachshunds have earned a title for being aggressive. If their weight was 10-15x typical sizes, and they were the size of a Great Dane then there might be fatalities from them. But interestingly despite "earning" that title - I've not been able to find a single fatality from a purebred miniature Dachshund. There was an incident in the US from a load of crossbreed dachshunds. There was also an incident earlier in the year in the UK where a dog walker was killed and had about 8 dogs of different breeds - there were 2 mini dachshunds in that group but no evidence they were involved in the attack.
The Nanny dog thing is a real stretch yeah, that's what Staffordshire Bull Terriers were considered to be in days long gone when it was a small to medium sized dog, when the breed was on average, smaller than it is now. But as I've said before, Staffs have a huge variance in size and build, they get mixed up in all sorts of ways.
Pitbulls can absolutely have the same temperament and be as docile and stupid as a log, but they're an awful lot more powerful and way more of a risk if something sets them off, so I don't know why anyone would actively pick a Pit to pair up with a young family, especially if you don't have much knowledge of dogs!
I'd take a Pit if there was one at a rescue that I and the rescue centre staff thought I was suitable for (and if I was looking for a dog). But I don't have kids, I'd never put it in a position that even has the slightest bit of potential for it to start something, and I'm strong enough to pick it up and drag it away if I need to.
I wouldn't take a Bully XL though.
Small dog, big personality. Imagine being sent down into a badger den to fight an angry badger in such a tight space. No wonder they are as they are
. Small enough that it doesn't cause any major problems though for sure.
Soldato
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As I said before, 'breed' is not what you seem to think it is and nor is it anything more than an ideal standard against which dogs are measured.
the 'breed-typical' dogs in your study are mostly the kind you'd put forward for Crufts, with gene profiles highly focussed toward meeting that ideal standard as closely as possible, and not really representative of their wider breed.
You'd know this if you'd read the studies posted.
And what are politicians going to do?
'Strongly condemn' the situation, then go back to worrying about their private investment portfolios and off-shore accounts?
Plenty of drivers cannot get insurance, or at least afford the ridiculously high quotes, due to nothing more than statistical profiling. Living in the wrong area, being young with a nice hatchback, driving a Prius...
A decent owner would ensure that, if they took any such dog, it was only bred from reliable bloodlines, ie the kind that initially led to that flowery breed description, rather than anything with a 'hip-hop' lineage like 'Drive-By Killah Monstah', which was intentionally directed toward aggression.
It makes no sense how the Pit Bull Terrier is banned here in the UK, yet the XL Bully is just a beefed up version but has no restrictions as yet just because it's technically a different breed.
I'm sure they are pleasant enough dogs, but if it's so powerful you can't control it - it can't be legal, certainly the type of owner it attracts does fit a certain stereotype, too...
I'm sure they are pleasant enough dogs, but if it's so powerful you can't control it - it can't be legal, certainly the type of owner it attracts does fit a certain stereotype, too...
Caporegime
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So it was a bully XL crossed with a staffie.
Shame the staffie might get undue attention now, but it’s obvious which of the breeds have driven this attack
Shame the staffie might get undue attention now, but it’s obvious which of the breeds have driven this attack
Well, interestingly I had a dog take a shot at me yesterday.
Out for a run and saw a bloke with 3 dogs coming towards me. 2 medium sized things that looked like a German shepherd/husky cross and a jack Russell. Jack Russell was yapping its little head off from about 100m away. He moved to one side of the path and I went to the other. Neither could step off as there are hedges either side.
As I passed the JR lunged and he failed to hold its lead. It managed to get hold of the back of one of my shoes before my stride kind of kicked it off. I stopped, turned round and he muttered an apology, the thing then came for another go so I went to line up a kick before he manged to pull it back. The other 2 dogs just sat there doing nothing.
He apologised again, said 'he's a bit aggressive since we got the other dogs' and walked away.
Out for a run and saw a bloke with 3 dogs coming towards me. 2 medium sized things that looked like a German shepherd/husky cross and a jack Russell. Jack Russell was yapping its little head off from about 100m away. He moved to one side of the path and I went to the other. Neither could step off as there are hedges either side.
As I passed the JR lunged and he failed to hold its lead. It managed to get hold of the back of one of my shoes before my stride kind of kicked it off. I stopped, turned round and he muttered an apology, the thing then came for another go so I went to line up a kick before he manged to pull it back. The other 2 dogs just sat there doing nothing.
He apologised again, said 'he's a bit aggressive since we got the other dogs' and walked away.
Typical small dog syndrome... just like small man syndrome where short guys are generally the mouthy aggressive ones
Jack Russells are a bit of a pain tbh. My parents have got one and he hasn't been particularly well trained and so if you take him for a walk he will bark at cyclists, joggers etc. I refuse to take him for walks when I'm at theirs as I can't be dealing with the hassle.
Bully type dogs are a whole different ball game. I don't understand why you'd want one of those things in your house unless you are a drug dealer or similar.
Good old Bordesley Green, lovely part of the world
Was out looking for my missing cat the other evening and encountered a guy walking what I think was one of these. Horrible aggressive looking thing - had our 3 year old with us, and I'm wary of strange dogs with him at the best of times, but he was very quickly scooped up in my arms and held away from the dog. The owner certainly fit the stereotype.
I was thinking along the same lines to be honest. The breed is maybe not as bad as the stats show, but because of the size/appearance (read "intimidation factor"), they almost certainly appeal to a certain type of person...
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Exactly. Statistical profiling. The insurers have decided that no amount of money is worth them insuring these groups.
If you can't get any insurance there's a good reason for it.
What's it going to be for a dog?
-Illegal
-health issues that can't be profiled
-dangerous
I'm pretty sure I know which of those bully XLs fall into.
If theres any one who holds enough data to make a decision is insurers. And they (sounds like universally) have decided to NOPE this dog.
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Yeah I tend to cross the street if I see one of these types of dogs around. Want to stay as far away from them as possible. I guess maybe that's the idea though...
So to be clear, I'm referring to breed in reality and you constructed some flawed comparison based on the "ideal standard" which let's face it, as far as XL Bully dogs in the UK are concerned, is totally irrelevant.
The relevant facts are just how dangerous they are relative to pretty much every other dog out there and the fact they've caused half of all dog-related deaths this year!
There's some hilarious cognitive dissonance by the advocates of these things, talking about how soft and loyal they are... but if that's what they valued then there are loads of other dogs they could own instead, there's no reason for these to exist. They don't seem to mention the other qualities like being muscly, intimidating, having a large jaw, being descended from fighting breeds etc. the other aspects that separate it from the other dogs are the very things that make it so dangerous.
Can you really trust people who are specifically buying a dog for those reasons? Because really they like the fact it's a bit intimidating, might be a bit dangerous etc.
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That is the idea, they get to feel tough and that people won't cross them vicariously via their dog. It's pathetic.
That the Jack lunged and he didn't already have it restrained is moronic. "He has been a bit aggressive since we got the other dogs", then keep it on a short lead if you know it's doing that, should have told him off. At least he didn't respond with "Yu ****** wot m8".
Jacks do a lot of barking, but it's usually just as an alert, they're quite protective, very energetic and make excellent companions to big lazy guard dog types that spend a lot of their time asleep. But if they feel intimidated or scared (not saying you were intimidating, god knows what the dog was thinking) their instinct is to fight something rather than back off, tail between legs. It's like with a Dachshund, people don't really know that dogs like that often need just as much, if not more exercise and training / stimulation than the majority of dogs. Just because they're not very big they get treated like lapdogs.
I think Collies end up being destructive because they're bored, they're not spending the day herding sheep so they chew your sofa. Similar thing.
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Caporegime
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