A lot of people do clearly buy these cheaper cards though as they're still in the market.
I fail to see how comparing the most expensive models for each GPU is fair.
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Drop your prices Nvidia. Please?
- Thread starter RogerMesenseless
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A lot of people do clearly buy these cheaper cards though as they're still in the market.
I fail to see how comparing the most expensive models for each GPU is fair.
A lot of us have quiet PCs which is why the better coolers are worth paying a bit more for (not too much more
)Also don't VTX have a horrendous failure rate? Lots of people returning them with various problems.
Sure if you get a card which works you end up paying a bit less, but there's extra hassle (and expense) if it fails and you have to return it.
No its not fair at all when VTX purposefully cut corners and minimize the cost to produce their cards by as much as possible while EVGA dont.
Ok, only compare reference design vs reference design from both AMD and Nvidia then. Any + / - costs on custom designs are entirely influenced by the AIBs, not by AMD / Nvidia.
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What a charge to lay at them, can you actually prove that?
The original information when the company first launched is extremely difficult to find after all this time, even more so when its a Taiwan based company. From the start, VTX was the budget brand of TUL corporation who also make Powercolor cards.
Powercolor is the companies premium line, VTX is their budget line. Its not any kind of a negative charge to lay at them, they stated themselves that VTX is a budget line made to cost less than other cards.
They're just assumptions.
The cost of PCBs is extremely low compared to say the GPU and RAM and other chips.
AMD cards have virtually always offered better price for performance. I used to always work out how much I get per fps, when I bought a GTX295 on release day, I nearly had a heart attack at the cost ratio, nothing ever changes.Not sure what's going on with Nvidia at the moment. Are they completely oblivious to the fact that people are buying AMD cards because they offer a better Priceerformance?
Any ideas when we will see the return of the great value cards from Nvidia? When will they drop prices?
I've bought more ATI(Amd) cards over the last 15 years, compared to Nvidia, but now I end up paying a premum with Nvidia cards, it was only 4 months ago I blew £365 on a GTX 670 Windforce, now I've blown £430 on a GTX 680 Lightning.
At the end of the day just buy what you prefer, no point arguing about whats better than what, if you work out price ratio per fps, that will give you the overall picture.
AMD is best value for money, if you don't really care then just buy what suits you best.
That does not make them any more prone to failure than a more expensive card.
I get what your saying, i would rather spend a bit more for a premium quality card, and that's exactly what i did.
But there is a difference between premium quality, just plain quality and bad quality.
The VTX cards are all unlocked, voltage and all...
Still they only have something like a 5+1+1 or 8+1+1 GPU Phase, it's not quality like that Asus @ 12+2+2, but it's just fine.
My card has 5xR30 and 2 metal chokes, the ones on the VTX might only be 28 or 29 and alloy.
They all have good quality components, just of a lesser performance level.
They also run warmer because they have lesser design coolers.
You get the performance you pay for, nothing wrong with the actual quality.
But even the performance is a lottery, a cheap VTX card here and there will absolutely out clock my Gigabyte. it's just more often not true.
Non of them are 'Bad'
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Where exactly did I say that it does? Everything I said is explaining one thing only - why VTX are cheaper than every other brand.
Do you honestly expect a company like EVGA / MSI / Gigabyte / ASUS to price match or undercut VTX???
Nvidia simply doesnt have any such AIBs as VTX, non of the Nvidia AIB custom designs are made to be cheaper than reference (at least not currently, a couple of past Zotac / Palit GTX 560 Tis were).
VTX design their cards to be cheaper to produce than reference designs. This doesnt make them bad or prone to failure, its a simple explanation of why they are so cheap, and hence why comparing AMDs cheapest to Nvidias cheapest is ridiculous when you are essentially trying to compare the legendary EVGA to a budget brand like VTX.
If I was buying a new high end card right now, I would most definitely pay the extra price to have one of these:
http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=GX-193-EA&groupid=701&catid=1914&subcat=2255
There is absolutely no comparison between both the build and aftersale support quality of that card to anything from VTX / Powercolor / HIS or Sapphire.
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They are not designed to be 'cheaper than reference' they simply are referenced with their own brand name stickers on them.
They are the same card you get directly from AMD, sometimes with different coolers on them.
Often those cards are all made by there very same people using the same manufacturing process using the same components, the only difference being the stickers they get at the end of the production line.
The premium line GPU's get redesigned custom PCB's and higher performance rated components (special treatment) and more beefy coolers. It's those cards where they make real money
That's all there is to it.
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Then I wonder why at one point VTX 7970s were something like £100 cheaper than the normal price of a 7970.
Like i said with premium models you get custom PCB's and better coolers.
The VTX cards are just basic no frills cards.
I meant that the VTX 7970s were £100 cheaper than a normal reference design when this current custom cooler card that they have was released.
So like I said, compare a basic no frills AMD card to a basic no frills Nvidia card.
A £450 GTX 680 is not a basic no frills card!
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Anyway, when the GTX 680 and 670 cards were first released, they were actually priced to undercut AMDs prices. Dont people remember anymore that the 7970 launched at £450??? The original RRP of the GTX 680 was £429. Same case scenario with the £350 7950 vs £319 GTX 670 reference designs on launch.
Following this, everyone started buying the Nvidia cards, and AMD's sales slumped to the point that they had to cut their prices to carry on selling their cards. Currently Nvidia GTX 670s / 680s are still selling well, so they have no need to cut their prices. Pretty simple to understand. I dont even get why AMD users need to complain when they wouldnt have bought the Nvidia card in the first place even if the prices were the same.
Post #16 when some silly graph was posted tbh. I honestly dont think that £450 7970s were better price for performance, nor £350 9700 pros. The only time AMD lower their prices is when they cant compete at a higher price point with Nvidia, just like now. Whenever AMD get the upper hand, they charge far more for their cards, and also CPUs than Intel / Nvidia normally would (£400 Athlon 64 X2s anyone?).
So like I said, compare a basic no frills AMD card to a basic no frills Nvidia card.
A £450 GTX 680 is not a basic no frills card!
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Anyway, when the GTX 680 and 670 cards were first released, they were actually priced to undercut AMDs prices. Dont people remember anymore that the 7970 launched at £450??? The original RRP of the GTX 680 was £429. Same case scenario with the £350 7950 vs £319 GTX 670 reference designs on launch.
Following this, everyone started buying the Nvidia cards, and AMD's sales slumped to the point that they had to cut their prices to carry on selling their cards. Currently Nvidia GTX 670s / 680s are still selling well, so they have no need to cut their prices. Pretty simple to understand. I dont even get why AMD users need to complain when they wouldnt have bought the Nvidia card in the first place even if the prices were the same.
I think the thread was totally derailed on page 1 lol.AMD cards have virtually always offered better price for performance.
Post #16 when some silly graph was posted tbh. I honestly dont think that £450 7970s were better price for performance, nor £350 9700 pros. The only time AMD lower their prices is when they cant compete at a higher price point with Nvidia, just like now. Whenever AMD get the upper hand, they charge far more for their cards, and also CPUs than Intel / Nvidia normally would (£400 Athlon 64 X2s anyone?).
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A £350 Gigabyte 7970 is a frils card
A £300 VTX 7970 is a no frils card and £50 cheaper, not £100
Well done, thats current prices, not the prices of when that VTX card was launched at which point a reference 7970 was £429-£450, and the VTX 7970 was £339 - £349.
They are not that price today, isn't that all that matters? whats the point of retrofitting. it makes no sense.
True.Nelly said:I think the thread was totally derailed on page 1 lol.bhavv said:
Have to agree, just had a look back at the cards I've bought, MSI ATI X800 XT P.E 256MB - £400ish on day release 8 years ago, I think the HIS Radeon X1900XTX IceQ 3 Turbo 512MB cost about £360ish when I bought that.Nelly said:
Managed to get a Nvidia OCZ 8800GTX for £300, but I had to get that from the USA.
Can remember blowing £500 on a single core AMD FX-53 2.4GHz CPU, what the hell was I thinking, lasted me 3 years though.