Energy Prices (Strictly NO referrals!)

[Mercenary Keyboard Warrior]

That's not correct though.

Bill is £100 - £67 gov means payment should be £33 because person is on variable direct debit. That is exactly what the variable direct debit is. If its like octopus they don't actually show you a dd amount. It just states variable on your account.

No its not at all.

Variable DD should take the account balance at the point the bill is raised. If account balance is £100 on that date then that's what they should take.
They have to give minimum 14 days notice.

Now you could ask why the balance is £100 and not £33 at that point, I suspect as in many cases its being batch processed and it just happens that when the balance is taken for collection its not there, then a couple of days later its listed as being there a few days earlier.

If the bill is being raised and not showing the £67 but its showing on the account the bill is incorrect, not the DD.
He says the bill is dated 1st of the month, then it should be and sounds like it is the account balance. Therefore its working as intended and the DD matches the bill.

 

[Curlyriff]

No its not at all.

Variable DD should take the account balance at the point the bill is raised. If account balance is £100 on that date then that's what they should take.
They have to give minimum 14 days notice.

Now you could ask why the balance is £100 and not £33 at that point, I suspect as in many cases its being batch processed and it just happens that when the balance is taken for collection its not there, then a couple of days later its listed as being there a few days earlier.

If the bill is being raised and not showing the £67 but its showing on the account the bill is incorrect, not the DD.
He says the bill is dated 1st of the month, then it should be and sounds like it is the account balance. Therefore its working as intended and the DD matches the bill.

That is not at al lwhat Octopus have done for me. They have adjusted their bill and DD showing the £67 though even though it hasn't been processed into my account yet. That arrives a few days later. Yes if the bill is not showing the £67 then fair but then it is plain wrong.

 

[ljt]

£450 for 27th Nov - 28th Dec for my gas/elec.

Octopus predicted £492 on their forecast so not that far out. Their predicted for January is £509.

My credit balance has dropped from £1000 to £550, although that should shoot up another £307 come January 1st.

Hopefully January is milder than usual!

 

[~Mike~]

Not at all, electric smart meters take a bill reading on the 1st of every month and I manually submit gas readings on the last day of the month BG systems are having issues with the Government rebate. They are applying the £67/month credit on my account but still taking the full bill amount on the DD too.

1st Dec - electric bill for £100 generated
5th Dec - £67 Govt. credit applied to account
20th Dec - full £100 DD charged to my bank, and my online BG balance shows as £67 in credit

I'm with BG and my variable DD is adjusted to take account for GOV discount.

 

[rumple9]

wholesale gas prices are now below what they were at before last February but the government/ofgem are still increasing prices by 20% next March

 

[Mercenary Keyboard Warrior]

That is not at al lwhat Octopus have done for me. They have adjusted their bill and DD showing the £67 though even though it hasn't been processed into my account yet. That arrives a few days later. Yes if the bill is not showing the £67 then fair but then it is plain wrong.

Which is fine as they are predicting something that will happen in advance.
Which is their choice, but unusual.

BG are not, which is also fine.
The way BG are operating is the normal way, take account balance on X date and collect it by advance warning of a DD collection.

The DD rules supersede any adjustment an energy supplier may make and are very clear.
Failure to follow the rules allows you to simply request the bank reverse the transaction, and they will

 

[HungryHippos]

wholesale gas prices are now below what they were at before last February but the government/ofgem are still increasing prices by 20% next March

They buy energy like a year ahead not at spot pricing, so current prices won't help until later.

 

[Zenduri]

wholesale gas prices are now below what they were at before last February but the government/ofgem are still increasing prices by 20% next March

VVVVV This

They buy energy like a year ahead not at spot pricing, so current prices won't help until later.

Over a certain customer base the industry regulations require the companies to buy a year in advance to guarantee supply so even if todays pricing is lower the next 12 months worth has all been bought at a higher price and needs paying for. Smaller suppliers buy on day or month spot prices and during the days of cheap energy a few years ago they were reaping the rewards of this however when prices rocket like they did, they soon run out of money as they are buying on spot prices at high rates.. hence 31 companies going to the wall over the last 18 months

 

[Mercenary Keyboard Warrior]

The good news is that its going to be practically impossible for anyone to offer a lower price as well
Due to the hike in the rate* that the new supplier has to pay the old supplier when you change

*This mechanism takes a % of the difference in predicted old bill vs new bill and has to be paid from new to old supplier. The rate was increased dramatically to avoid all the suppliers who have bought large quantities at inflated prices going pop as well.

 

[SDK^]

wholesale gas prices are now below what they were at before last February but the government/ofgem are still increasing prices by 20% next March

^ How to tell people you don't understand how the energy market works

This Martin Lewis chart shows why - the price cap is based on a rolling average wholesale energy price, the cap lags behind the wholesale increase/decreases and it isn't calculated using a spot day low price.

Prices will come down, but we need to pay for the area in blue on the chart below first.
Also - Re: your comment on current prices being below last Feb prices - They are about the same : 200p Therm.

 

[Captain]

Highest bill ever today, £256 for gas and electric.

£202 for gas and £54 for electric.

 

[lookitsjonno]

Highest bill ever today, £256 for gas and electric.

£202 for gas and £54 for electric.

Mine was £335 last month, even before the freezing weather. I have £400 credit and I'm expecting that and more to be wiped out when I get this months

 

[robj20]

£170 so far this month, with heating on 24/7

 

[kinetic747]

^ How to tell people you don't understand how the energy market works

This Martin Lewis chart shows why - the price cap is based on a rolling average wholesale energy price, the cap lags behind the wholesale increase/decreases and it isn't calculated using a spot day low price.

Prices will come down, but we need to pay for the area in blue on the chart below first.
Also - Re: your comment on current prices being below last Feb prices - They are about the same : 200p Therm.

Don't worry the government promised to reform the market, I won't be holding my breath though.

 

[Manbatius]

Just had an email from octopus showing changes etc from January and my electric per kWh use has dropped slightly to 31.871p.
Not much change but better than none. Still dreading what April will bring.

 

[jpaul]

^ How to tell people you don't understand how the energy market works

Don't worry the government promised to reform the market, I won't be holding my breath though.

martin lewis (he is not the messiah ...) is no better, has been sitting/presiding there for years telling people to switch suppliers to the cheapest deal,
ignorant that this promoted energy companies to have higher rates through the frequent churn (Cornwall insights reports)
rather he should have been suggesting Ofgen reform ... Does Lewis have shares in dehumidifier companies too.

currently ofgen is also openly permitting energy companies to offer contracts exclusively to existing customers , on supposedly open market,
plus not promoting removal of all consumption based components of standing charge, or VAT on that - impacting poorer lower consumption users.

 

[bigmike20vt]

They buy energy like a year ahead not at spot pricing, so current prices won't help until later.

indeed..... this spike has already happened and there is naff all we can do about that now. my interest is whether or not by autumn next year France will have sorted out it's nuclear stock , and whether there will be any new power generation on stream in the UK to stop exactly the same thing happening again next year assuming Russia are still invading Ukraine and being boycotted somewhat by the EU/UK

in truth I have no idea how much can be done in a year or whether the exact same thing will happen again

 

[the shadow]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/...eveals-surnames-people-left-houses-death.html

 

[chrcoluk]

No the opposite, those paying in arrears should pay more, but it should be marginal, something like 1-2%

So only when in arrears.

 

[chrcoluk]

wholesale gas prices are now below what they were at before last February but the government/ofgem are still increasing prices by 20% next March

Until market conditions are changed, nothing will improve.
Only fix I see for gas at this point its reducing reliance on it, heat pumps etc. Easier to fix electric.