EV general discussion
- Thread starter Ricochet J
- Start date
Supply and demand.
But Tesla have positioned themselves as a premium brand, they have the biggest batteries/longest range, plus cutting edge tech e.g. Autopilot etc.
If you're looking at cars from comparable brands, e.g. BMW, Merc. JLR, then £10k doesn't even come close
If you're looking at cars from comparable brands, e.g. BMW, Merc. JLR, then £10k doesn't even come close
Even the same cars aren’t equivalent as EV versions tend to have a high spec.
Any old example:
VW Golf - manual heater/air con, halogen headlights, manual gearbox etc.
E-Golf - LED lights, dual zone climate, auto lights/wipers, adaptive cruise etc.
You therefore can’t compare the cheapest petrol car to an EV on a like for like basis. You need to spec up the petrol and then the gap closes significantly. There’s still a gap, but the EV running costs are very low if you do enough miles.
Same with BMW. The i3 comes with lots of spec as standard now, far more than the basic 1 series or whatever you consider their closest car.
Any old example:
VW Golf - manual heater/air con, halogen headlights, manual gearbox etc.
E-Golf - LED lights, dual zone climate, auto lights/wipers, adaptive cruise etc.
You therefore can’t compare the cheapest petrol car to an EV on a like for like basis. You need to spec up the petrol and then the gap closes significantly. There’s still a gap, but the EV running costs are very low if you do enough miles.
Same with BMW. The i3 comes with lots of spec as standard now, far more than the basic 1 series or whatever you consider their closest car.
But Teslas stuff is a bit janky really. The tech is annoying to use as it's all on a touchscreen and gimmicky. The autopilot keeps auto crashing.
Soldato
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What do you get out of posting in this thread exactly?
Proving their utter lack of knowledge on a subject with such cemented assurance they could never be seen as credible?
I find it funny that anyone can comment on usability of something they have never used (or intend to use) as well. Ultimately it is down to fear of them becoming irrelevant too, a bit like in the 60's when computers were really starting to gain ground, fear drove doubt and misinformation. You just have to accept the people who are fearful as unable to adapt, and showing their weaknesses to grasp and understand 'new' things.
about the (lack of) beauty in ev designs - apparently the eu tesla S had an active bonnet, with budget for that, you can probably go for a more aesthetic/aerodynamic shape, but, will the additional economy, even passive safety/visibility, offset that ?
(the S with that, plus panoramic glass, aero wheels, could have beaten the 3 ?)
the earlier point that, at least for toyota, the bev's cost less to manufacture than the hybrids, but they currently make more margin, whilst, there is high demand,
and, the bev, might be just about break even, all in, in the UK, versus diesel alternatives, but less so, versus a couple year old ICE still in warranty.
in the samme manner that police can trawl social media data with respect to crimes, they are soon going to more actively request data from car manufacturers about what (sole?) driver was doing when the crash occurred
(the S with that, plus panoramic glass, aero wheels, could have beaten the 3 ?)
but these options are probably cheap, you put your own value on them, it's liked the discussion on enabling the (default) heated seats in teslas.
the earlier point that, at least for toyota, the bev's cost less to manufacture than the hybrids, but they currently make more margin, whilst, there is high demand,
and, the bev, might be just about break even, all in, in the UK, versus diesel alternatives, but less so, versus a couple year old ICE still in warranty.
this does have validity, if you look at the (previously posted) unrespected NHSTA guidelines on touch intefaces in cars, but, OK, offset by other safety systems - assisted driving/radar. ... how much could road safety be improved if they/mftrs respected them ?
in the samme manner that police can trawl social media data with respect to crimes, they are soon going to more actively request data from car manufacturers about what (sole?) driver was doing when the crash occurred
Soldato
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The reason they spec them up is to help justify the material cost of an EV driveline and mask it with the high margin options to balance the offering.
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Morning all, have ordered an iPace to come in a few weeks.
I need a 7kw 32a charger type 2? to install in my workplace. It's a bit odd, it's more of a barn with an office. Any suggestions on which to buy? Doesn't need to do anything other than charge the car nothing fancy pants.
I need a 7kw 32a charger type 2? to install in my workplace. It's a bit odd, it's more of a barn with an office. Any suggestions on which to buy? Doesn't need to do anything other than charge the car nothing fancy pants.
I'm curious to know which Tesla you drove as I have never had such a probelm, in fact quite the opposite everything works very well.
The touchscreen is great as more stuff keeps appearing on the interface.
Probably the lesser spotted Model F, if you didn't guess the 'F' stands for Fictitious.
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Local petrol station has put a couple of chargers in. So now in 30 mins they can refill 2 cars. Compared to about 80 fossil cars they can refill in the same time...
A lot of them are now, trying to get themselves on the map so to speak. Local fuel station near me closed, and is now being made in to houses and they have 7kWh chargers fitted, and off-street parking, total of 12 residences on the land it took up, so that's pretty good.
Are Harry’s comments/findings regarding the radar cruise and autopilot accurate in this? He really doesn’t seem to rate it, he obviously has very extensive experience in all kinds of cars so I’d usually think he’s spot on. (love his channel, his house is very local to me so it’s very cool spotting all of the local roads knowing where he is!)
...but those 80 cars have to use a petrol station EVERY time they fill up. Those 2 EVs might be on their only trip of the year where they need to charge outside of their own homes. That must also be one hell of a petrol station if they can turn around 80 cars in 30 minutes!
Have they really though? Can you ever imagine BMW, Mercedes etc. ever fitting a fart app to their cars? As a brand I really don't get them no matter how advanced they might be.
Soldato
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There's a few issues here. One is that the long-term solution for EV use is charging at home or work, where you're near enough as guaranteed a spot as is possible and where there's the pure physical space to account for the growth/uptake in EVs. For me, public chargers are a last resort/in an emergency/to support longer journeys, which is also why I bought into the Tesla infrastructure. Obviously having fuel stations install EV chargers is far more of a positive thing than them not.
Secondly the mindset between filling up a car and charging an EV is different. Most ICE drivers fill their car up to full regardless, whereas most EV drivers (should) charge enough for what's needed. In terms of public chargers this is enough to get you to your next destination. So whilst a full rapid charge takes 30 minutes, you would only expect a few people to use them in that way, instead stopping for 5-10 mins to add enough miles as is needed. As charging speeds increase this obviously reduces wait time; Tesla's planned 250kw chargers would give you ~60 real world miles in 4 minutes, for example.
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Remember there's loads of people who can't charge at home or at work. They're going to have to rock up to the petrol station and join the queue of cars spending 30 mins each, instead of the current ~3 mins each. They're going to need 10x as many chargers as there currently are petrol pumps just to get the same number of customers through, which there isn't room for, and cars would still be queued out the door and down the street.
Soldato
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probably make more money charging two cars and selling break snacks...