Free will

[Deleted member 77746]

But is it really my choice? What if it is determined that I post a picture of my cat and therefore I can't do anything else? Is it a choice if I can't choose?

If I had a cat. Which I don't.

So go on post a photo of a cat. It's your choice.

 

[Tuppy_Glossop]

Has anyone had any ideas about experiments that may prove/disprove such hard determinism in this universe/timespace/causal trajectory?

Also, a little playfully, I would like to suggest hard determinism may not be the end of free will... beyond this universe/timespace/causal trajectory. Perhaps the mechanism involves moving from one deterministic path to another. The Many Worlds Interpretation would be a suitable framework. Unless, of course, this trajectory between deterministic units is itself pre-determined.

 

[Irish_Tom]

I believe the correct term is "dowiehole"

(it's often because things get misrepresented when some details are important tbh...)

I wasn't going to say it!

I initially avoided using labels though as I'd rather just have a discussion in plain language without preconceptions or trying to put people's views into boxes etc... I don't think there needs to be expectations that because one person believes A they should also believe B because others who believe A also believe B etc.. that is something that I think can be unhelpful.

That's fair enough.

No, my point wasn't that the observer wasn't important - my point what that you were spending time introducing some new observer and I didn't think *that* was important given that I had already accepted the notion of some theoretical observer in a deterministic universe. I didn't see what spending more time adding in details about some limited observer added if the idea of one had already been accepted.

I see that now. I think I was trying to explain (badly) what I put in point 4 and just kept digging.

But I'm not going to make any preconceived judgements about what your specific views are, I wanted to know what you believe not just put you into some box because you're starting to sound similar to some other people.

And along with that if I'm putting forth my views then I'll state them, I don't feel the need to necessarily associate myself or disassociate myself with some other labels or views other people have.

Again, that's fair enough.

Has anyone had any ideas about experiments that may prove/disprove such hard determinism in this universe/timespace/causal trajectory?

Also, a little playfully, I would like to suggest hard determinism may not be the end of free will... beyond this universe/timespace/causal trajectory. Perhaps the mechanism involves moving from one deterministic path to another. The Many Worlds Interpretation would be a suitable framework. Unless, of course, this trajectory between deterministic units is itself pre-determined.

Let's add some more complexity to this!

Many Worlds is a fun one — I mentioned the mini-series DEVS earlier in the thread, which also incorporates Many Worlds into its narrative.