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Gameworks, Mantle and a pot calling a kettle black

I see the PC as the pinnacle of hardware but not gaming. Take me back 14 years when i first got into PC it was both as most PC games were not touched by console. Now it's the other way around as the console gets just about all PC games that are worth playing and i would say they are a little inferior in looks and some the controller ain't as good as kb and mouse but in the main it's the same game. The consoles have the biggest selling exclusives like gta5 and you can tell how much went into these games compared to what the PC gets.

Lets be honest though in hardware terms the PC is where it's at as when a console launches there's not to much to talk about afterwards as the majority is known. There's no way i wanna get involved with ps4 v xboxone as that's all drivel. Games interest me and so does hardware.
 
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You're using your opinion as facts again :rolleyes:
PC gets far more exclusives, and whether they're better or not isn't up for debate as, lets face it....is subjective and has no definitive answer.

Now onto the subject of your 3 year dry spell of buying games, what gives?
 
Tonester0011 said:
You're using your opinion as facts again :rolleyes:
PC gets far more exclusives, and whether they're better or not isn't up for debate as, lets face it....is subjective and has no definitive answer.

Now onto the subject of your 3 year dry spell of buying games, what gives?
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3 years? Playing mmo's like SWTOR and Eve Online is not exactly buying games but you do pay monthly. SWTOR is free if you wish but EVE is not. There's plenty of games i have bought. No idea where you got that lol.

Have you been drinking a little of Grandpa's secret cough medicine?
 
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LtMatt said:
Lol did you even read it? This is why i can never have a proper debate with you. :p

The neutral party happens to be Epic and valve game devs, plus the ones who spoke off the record. I give up lol.
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And who says Epic and Valve (or at least the game devs interviewed) are neutral? The individual devs asked could be getting backhanders from AMD for all we know.
Didn't see it mentioned that GameWorks has a special code path for AMD GPUs that is purposely much more inefficient (maybe there are odd bits that Nvidia can do more efficiently using their CUDA cores, but that's not sabotaging AMD).
Maybe you could point it out for me?

The article also mentioned that developers were able to see the source code and that it has recently changed to make it easier for them to get the source code (this is not the same as "they couldn't get access to the source code but they can now").

It also has a quote from AMD saying that without the source code it's harder to optimise. I believe they are able to get the game's source code, but don't see why they should get Nvidia's.

I mean, take Heaven, now I don't believe that has GameWorks in it and I don't believe it's Nvidia sponsored. I do believe (despite 8 Pack's recent WR) that it generally runs better on Nvidia hardware. Maybe some games are the same, with no sabotage involved just run better on one vendor's hardware than the other. Maybe Ubisoft tend to make games that run better on Nvidia cards due to re-using code that has worked better on Nvidia cards or just the knowledge they have as a development company. This isn't sabotage.


TheRealDeal said:
In your opinion which is wrong. My experience leads me to my opinions but what's going on with Nvidia and games over the years is my common sense tbh not preference. It's a little like if people start dying in good health around the same person i would start looking towards him/her. If you don't then you are obviously blind to this kind of logic. It's not 100% effective but that's my way off thinking.
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You mean like how people die in hospitals? Like the Doctors and Nurses are killing them? I see your point, that is conclusive evidence...

Also...
TheRealDeal said:
I see the PC as the pinnacle of hardware but not gaming. Take me back 14 years when i first got into PC it was both as most PC games were not touched by console. Now it's the other way around as the console gets just about all PC games that are worth playing and i would say they are a little inferior in looks and some the controller ain't as good as kb and mouse but in the main it's the same game. The consoles have the biggest selling exclusives like gta5 and you can tell how much went into these games compared to what the PC gets.

Lets be honest though in hardware terms the PC is where it's at as when a console launches there's not to much to talk about afterwards as the majority is known. There's no way i wanna get involved with ps4 v xboxone as thats all drivel. Games interest me and so does hardware.
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Think that's a bigger selling exclusive (which is apparently coming to PC (and XB1 and PS4), but if you don't know what exclusive means then that's on you) than World of Warcraft?
 
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GoogalyMoogaly said:
And who says Epic and Valve (or at least the game devs interviewed) are neutral? The individual devs asked could be getting backhanders from AMD for all we know.
Didn't see it mentioned that GameWorks has a special code path for AMD GPUs that is purposely much more inefficient (maybe there are odd bits that Nvidia can do more efficiently using their CUDA cores, but that's not sabotaging AMD).
Maybe you could point it out for me?

The article also mentioned that developers were able to see the source code and that it has recently changed to make it easier for them to get the source code (this is not the same as "they couldn't get access to the source code but they can now").

It also has a quote from AMD saying that without the source code it's harder to optimise. I believe they are able to get the game's source code, but don't see why they should get Nvidia's.

I mean, take Heaven, now I don't believe that has GameWorks in it and I don't believe it's Nvidia sponsored. I do believe (despite 8 Pack's recent WR) that it generally runs better on Nvidia hardware. Maybe some games are the same, with no sabotage involved just run better on one vendor's hardware than the other. Maybe Ubisoft tend to make games that run better on Nvidia cards due to re-using code that has worked better on Nvidia cards or just the knowledge they have as a development company. This isn't sabotage.




You mean like how people die in hospitals? Like the Doctors and Nurses are killing them? I see your point, that is conclusive evidence...
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Did you not see the healthy part in that post. I know healthy people still die now and then. I think you know what i meant anyway.
 
TheRealDeal said:
Did you not see the healthy part in that post. I know healthy people still die now and then. I think you know what i meant anyway.
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So if sick people started dying around that same person that the healthy people were dying around it'd be ok? That's.... is there and "-ist" for treating sick and healthly people differently?
Yeah I knew what you meant :)
 
GoogalyMoogaly said:
I mean, take Heaven, now I don't believe that has GameWorks in it and I don't believe it's Nvidia sponsored. I do believe (despite 8 Pack's recent WR) that it generally runs better on Nvidia hardware.
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Somewhat off topic here but I always see confusion on this subject.

Let me educate you guys since I actually bench :p

HWbot world records include scores where AMD cards do not run any tesselation at all. The same tweak does not work on Nvidia hardware so it creates the illusion that AMD is doing better in some benches.

Since heaven is specifically designed to be a tesselation bench Nvidia literally can't win there since the AMD cards aren't running any tess.

Same goes somewhat for 3dm11. With Firestrike it's not as clear cut but if you compare normal scores to non tess scores you'd still need about 150-200MHz more on the normal run compared to non tess run to achieve the same score, so even there it gives a huge advantage.

Only reason NV cards are able to overcome this disadvantage in benches like Firestrike is because they're actually considerably faster when compared in equal situations (due to OCing much higher than AMD cards)
 
GoogalyMoogaly said:
So if sick people started dying around that same person that the healthy people were dying around it'd be ok? That's.... is there and "-ist" for treating sick and healthly people differently?
Yeah I knew what you meant :)
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Watch some crime programs, after a while you will get what i meant. Keep going if you want but i will not be engaging.
 
_Alatar_ said:
Somewhat off topic here but I always see confusion on this subject.

Let me educate you guys since I actually bench :p

HWbot world records include scores where AMD cards do not run any tesselation at all. The same tweak does not work on Nvidia hardware so it creates the illusion that AMD is doing better in some benches.

Since heaven is specifically designed to be a tesselation bench Nvidia literally can't win there since the AMD cards aren't running any tess.

Same goes somewhat for 3dm11. With Firestrike it's not as clear cut but if you compare normal scores to non tess scores you'd still need about 150-200MHz more on the normal run compared to non tess run to achieve the same score, so even there it gives a huge advantage.

Only reason NV cards are able to overcome this disadvantage in benches like Firestrike is because they're actually considerably faster when compared in equal situations (due to OCing much higher than AMD cards)
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Then you might as well have a word with our resident overclocker 8Pack who also works for OcUK:

http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?t=18604831

He does overclocking stuff(including record attempts),with both AMD and Nvidia hardware.
 
CAT-THE-FIFTH said:
Then you might as well have a word with our resident overclocker 8Pack who also works for OcUK:

http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?t=18604831

He does overclocking stuff(including record attempts),with both AMD and Nvidia hardware.
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What do I need to have a word with him about? :confused:

He uses the exact same tesselation tweaks I do when I bench AMD hardware. It's completely pointless to bench AMD hardware for the bot with tesselation on. The only people who do that are the ones who just randomly upload a random score to the bot (some random enthusiast league people).

And 8-pack was a part of the same OCing team (OCN) as me for a long time...
 
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