General Headphone Audio

mrk said:
Agreed there, but the bolder claims need to be factored in too, whilst much of the results will no doubt be sound, As bold as the claim was, HD600 surely cannot physically closely match a HD800s, otherwise we may as well throw physics out of the window :D

I think for that kind of claim here, because this is still new, it gets people talking, like everyone on reddit is, and it's filtered to headfi and here.
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Their reactions to the HD 600 and that quote are hidden in the middle of a video where they didn't lead with it in anyway and never put it in the title, or thumbnail. As for the claim on the 600 they do explain it in the video. And the science has been explained to some level of detail. So I think the idea that FR is more important than we understand it to be currently, is probably believable. I suppose having recently heard the results of blind testing DAC/AMPs and suddenly had my beliefs challenged somewhat I'm not inclined to just dismiss it fully. I would say I think it would be more interesting to find a way to make these tools more accessible to all, but again I appreciate that may be impossible.
 
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Listening to Righteously and it's one of those songs that sounds like alive recording with the background "hiss" which improves the listening experience with how the song is mastered/recorded. A really good song for headphones.


Been on the X8's headphone amp all evening trying to find the smallest bit of difference to the A90D's headphone output and other than volume levelling between the two, they are for all intents and purposes identical. The SNR/THD etc between them favours the A90D in a big way on paper but the reality is both are way quieter/cleaner than what human ears can discern so it's not even worth quizzing over I guess.
 
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Redesigned my 3d printed headphones, they sound the same but are drastically different cosmetically.

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Don't know why I didn't think of this before but fired off a message to Rotel to see if I can get my hands on the DX-3 headphone/pre-amp to check out. It's ESS powered, so am intrigued to see if Rotel's implementation is a smoother/warmer one than Topping's. The unit looks rather nice too.
 
3.2KG, which is only a bit more than the 2.77 of the X8.

Quick look at review roundup says this about the ESS Pro in the DX-3:

Rotel's engineers selected this chip specifically after auditioning multiple options, and have added custom discrete analogue output filters to shape the resulting tonality. The result, per Headfonia's extended review, is "the most organic ESS DAC I've heard" — a smooth, unusually warm presentation that one reviewer said they "would believe to be an R2R DAC if I didn't know it's rocking ESS silicon". What Hi-Fi? described it as "clean, crisp and impressively detailed" with a "slightly etched presentation" that "highlights low-level detail but doesn't go as far as to become tiring".
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Kind of AKM+CS+R2R hybrid vibes going off that summary.
 
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mrk said:
3.2KG, which is only a bit more than the 2.77 of the X8.
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Thank you - I was asking Angst though! :p

Sounds like a good one to review if you can get a sample though.

Angst said:
The scales say 361 grams, i think a lot of the weight is from the TPU printed headband, they would be quite a bit lighter if I bought an lcd knockoff from aliexpress to use instead.
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I guess metal screws add a tiny bit of weight too. Interesting that an all plastic build is that kind of weight.
 
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Timber said:
Thank you - I was asking Angst though! :p

Sounds like a good one to review if you can get a sample though.



I guess metal screws add a tiny bit of weight too. Interesting that an all plastic build is that kind of weight.
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Yea, each earcup should only use 47g of plastic total(depending on density settings etc). Youve then got the 12 brass inserts and the screws per cup to add and the ear pads and drivers. The headband in total weighs around 100g. Looking at it they come out about the same as the hd800's.
 
Angst said:
Yea, each earcup should only use 47g of plastic total(depending on density settings etc). Youve then got the 12 brass inserts and the screws per cup to add and the ear pads and drivers. The headband in total weighs around 100g. Looking at it they come out about the same as the hd800's.
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So if you remove the capra strap and stuck on some foam instead (a la Sennheiser HD 560S, or PC 38X) that wouldn't save much weight?

mrk said:
It's midweek madness is what i reckon :p
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Np.

Btw I did bump into a Youtube short from DMS (I actually block YT shorts so I don't usually see them) and he was explaining the build of the headphone and how that can make a difference to the sound; resonance, build materials etc. He called it 'Acoustic Resistance'. So that no matter what your own personal HRTF the headphones will have an impact and why they sound different for people. However crucially he than goes on to explain that open-backs have a low acoustic resistance vs. closed-back. I don't know why he felt the need to do the video now (not explained in the YT Short, or comments) but I thought that fitted in with the debate the other day on the Headphone Show video.
 
It just highlights that there are so many factors that need to be considered but rarely are before coming to a definitive conclusion with things like that, and the fact that plastic fatigues over time even when not being used which will further cause different levels of acoustic resistance etc.
 
Timber said:
So if you remove the capra strap and stuck on some foam instead (a la Sennheiser HD 560S, or PC 38X) that wouldn't save much weight?
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Considering the headband is about a third of the total weight you could probably save some by replacing the whole thing but the "capra strap" part itself weighs very little. Having a Google, the AI ******** says that the hifiman/lcd style headbands are usually around 130g so about the same as the printed one, including the capra strap.
I could probably shave the total weight of the headphones by hollowing out the infil more and reducing the thickness of all the parts in non-structural areas.
 
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mrk said:
It just highlights that there are so many factors that need to be considered but rarely are before coming to a definitive conclusion with things like that, and the fact that plastic fatigues over time even when not being used which will further cause different levels of acoustic resistance etc.
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I actually think it's beholden on them (the Headphone Show) to really simplify what they are saying regarding that specific comparison, but again probably a moot point. Assuming it all wasn't an early April Fool joke...

Angst said:
Considering the headband is about a third of the total weight you could probably save some by replacing the whole thing but the "capra strap" part itself weighs very little. Having a Google, the AI ******** says that the hifiman/lcd style headbands are usually around 130g so about the same as the printed one, including the capra strap.
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I guess it makes you appreciate this sort of manufacturers process more and maybe where some manufacturers hit these low weights just how well they have done.
 
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Timber said:
I guess it makes you appreciate this sort of manufacturers process more and maybe where some manufacturers hit these low weights just how well they have done.
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Yea, with injection molded plastics its possible to have thinner part designs as they are relatively stronger than a 3d printed part of the same thickness, and where im using thick plastic, something like the hd600 is using a thin metal strip. I could probably get similar weight-saving and strength by thinning it out and paying a company to sls print it out of nylon as well. And to be honest I'm probably just overdoing it on the thickness of some parts to be on the safe side strength-wise.
Its definitely not heavy by any means though, half the weight of something like the LCD 2.
 
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Rotel did reply back, they only have 2 DX-3 units for review and both are currently with other outlets, they did emphasise that the DX-3 is aimed at high end sound quality first rather than features or adjustments, which is expected and fair. I suspect they specifically mentioned this because they've seen the coverage of cheaper models from other brands coming in with equally high end sound but with more features, otherwise I can't think of a reason why this would need to be mentioned.

Have asked for another model in the meantime, perhaps the DX-5... Though that is an integrated amp and DAC with no headphones out.
 
mrk said:
Rotel did reply back, they only have 2 DX-3 units for review and both are currently with other outlets, they did emphasise that the DX-3 is aimed at high end sound quality first rather than features or adjustments, which is expected and fair. I suspect they specifically mentioned this because they've seen the coverage of cheaper models from other brands coming in with equally high end sound but with more features, otherwise I can't think of a reason why this would need to be mentioned.

Have asked for another model in the meantime, perhaps the DX-5... Though that is an integrated amp and DAC with no headphones out.
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"aimed at high end sound quality first rather than features or adjustments"

Snake oil salesman at their finest. :D
 
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Don't know if you've seen this, but the HD 6XX is coming back...a bit pricier and US-only. A bit crap for us Europeans, as at least with Drop you could order from them. I guess the HD 650 is often available for the same price and this headphone sold too well for all involved.

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We have been working closely with Drop to ensure the HD 6XX remains available to the community it helped build. Beginning March 26th, the HD 6XX will be available at Sennheiser-hearing.com in its signature form without any changes to the product, accessories, parts or post-purchase support as provided by us, the manufacturer. In the spirit of community, we will share any updates about the HD 6XX here and on our site. You can view the product page here.
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