Greenlizard0 Premier League Football Thread ** spoilers ** [30/31 Dec 23 1/2 Jan 24]

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ArcticHeron said:
I'm a Villa fan and it amazes me this 'foul' in particular is garnering such attention. In the same week we took all 3 points from a penalty that came from a dive almost as obvious as Jotas. That game was both more contentious and more poorly refereed then the Liverpool game. I'd be disgusted if I was a Burnley fan.
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Were Villa fans all rushing to say it wasn't a dive? You clearly are calling it a dive. That there is the difference.
 
Colonel_Klinck said:
Were Villa fans all rushing to say it wasn't a dive? You clearly are calling it a dive. That there is the difference.
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On Twitter they were. I also saw a lot of Liverpool fans saying that Jota's was a dive and that they wouldn't want it given against them. That's football and how varied people's opinions are on these things.

You can't really judge from this forum alone, there are only two prominent Villa fans who post here regularly I think.

There must be at least ten Liverpool fans here.
 
Colonel_Klinck said:
Were Villa fans all rushing to say it wasn't a dive? You clearly are calling it a dive. That there is the difference.
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I'm sure 'most' Liverpool fans would agree that it was a dive.

Regardless, the context of the games makes all the difference. Newcastle where getting battered and would most likely have lost either way. Burnley had every right to take a point home and where robbed.

I'm not saying it's fine in one game and a disgrace in the other, just that the Jota dive was largely meaningless. I suppose the most contemptuous thing about Jotas incident is that he doesn't really need to go down at all... I was that baffled initially that I thought the ref was blowing to card him!
 
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BaZ87 said:
A 5 second forum search raises serious doubts over this statement. Here you will find you claiming one of your players "went down easy but it wasn't a dive" when every other member, supporting multiple different teams claimed he had dived.
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Oh is the the one and only time Sky has dragged a TV screen in and confronted a player about an incident like that?

I said it wasn't a pen. There was contact so how does it fall outside into my definition of a dive?

Oh and Kane has dived, so have other Spurs players.
 
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ArcticHeron said:
I'm sure 'most' Liverpool fans would agree that it was a dive.

Regardless, the context of the games makes all the difference. Newcastle where getting battered and would most likely have lost either way. Burnley had every right to take a point home and where robbed.

I'm not saying it's fine in one game and a disgrace in the other, just that the Jota dive was largely meaningless. I suppose the most contemptuous thing about Jotas incident is that he doesn't really need to go down at all... I was that baffled initially that I thought the ref was blowing to card him!
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Just not Liverpool fans on here.
 
Colonel_Klinck said:
Oh is the the one and only time Sky has dragged a TV screen in and confronted a player about an incident like that?

I said it wasn't a pen. There was contact so how does it fall outside into my definition of a dive?
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It's the one where Kane intentionally steps into the Arsenal player then throws himself to the ground. Everybody barring you said it was a dive, which I'm shocked by as you just assured us you call out your own players diving.

And I know we've just exposed your hypocrisy but you're taking the **** with that last question, aren't you? Read what you've said again and apply the Jota incident to that.
 
Could get some serious mileage out of this in this thread

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Colonel_Klinck said:
I don't understand why its difficult to get. In todays game if players feel contact in the box they go down and then the ref/VAR decide if its a pen. If a player chooses not to go down and the chance doesn't materialise and so they throw themselves to the floor 2 steps later its a dive.

I also don't get why fans can't just say their clubs players dive when they dive. I've seen players dive for my club and I'm happy to call it a dive. I can't stand diving and I find simulation to be just as bad. Its cheating pure and simple.
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"if players feel contact in the box they go down and then the ref/VAR decide if its a pen. If a player chooses not to go down and the chance doesn't materialise and so they throw themselves to the floor 2 steps later its a dive."

So in your view the difference between a dive and a foul is not whether it's enough to take a player off his feet, but imposing an arbitrary time limit on when a player may decide to go down?

And not only that, but that difference is enough to change your opinion from an incident being a legitimate penalty to it being cheating?

You now basically seem to be suggesting that players who are better at going down quickly should be rewarded for it, and those who try to stay upright, even to their detriment, should be called cheats.


"If a player chooses not to go down and the chance doesn't materialise and so they throw themselves to the floor 2 steps later its a dive."

Surely this directly contradicts how advantages should work? Surely players should be encouraged to try to play on, to take a chance, in the knowledge that play can be pulled back should the chance cease to be available?


The upshot of your position seems to reward players who go down quickly, and to call players who try to play on cheats.
 
BaZ87 said:
It's the one where Kane intentionally steps into the Arsenal player then throws himself to the ground. Everybody barring you said it was a dive, which I'm shocked by as you just assured us you call out your own players diving.

And I know we've just exposed your hypocrisy but you're taking the **** with that last question, aren't you? Read what you've said again and apply the Jota incident to that.
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This isn't the win you think it is. I defined what I think a dive is and that isn't it is it. Kane might have looked for the contact but that doesn't make it a dive. I said in that post that it wasn't a pen. I've not seen you say Jota dived or that it wasn't a pen yet.

Kane has dived dived though.
 
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manic111 said:
"if players feel contact in the box they go down and then the ref/VAR decide if its a pen. If a player chooses not to go down and the chance doesn't materialise and so they throw themselves to the floor 2 steps later its a dive."

So in your view the difference between a dive and a foul is not whether it's enough to take a player off his feet, but imposing an arbitrary time limit on when a player may decide to go down?

And not only that, but that difference is enough to change your opinion from an incident being a legitimate penalty to it being cheating?

You now basically seem to be suggesting that players who are better at going down quickly should be rewarded for it, and those who try to stay upright, even to their detriment, should be called cheats.


"If a player chooses not to go down and the chance doesn't materialise and so they throw themselves to the floor 2 steps later its a dive."

Surely this directly contradicts how advantages should work? Surely players should be encouraged to try to play on, to take a chance, in the knowledge that play can be pulled back should the chance cease to be available?


The upshot of your position seems to reward players who go down quickly, and to call players who try to play on cheats.
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You are talking about how refs treat advantage and you think it should be done differently. That isn't what we are talking about though. Of course it should be treated differently in the penalty area. He didn't try to play on, he changed his mind 2 steps later and threw himself to the ground.
 
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Colonel_Klinck said:
You are talking about how refs treat advantage and you think it should be done differently. That isn't what we are talking about though. Of course it should be treated differently in the penalty area. He didn't try to play on, he changed his mind 2 steps later and threw himself to the ground.
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No, I'm saying that I don't understand where you are trying to draw the line between a foul and a dive
 
Colonel_Klinck said:
This isn't the win you think it is. I defined what I think a dive is and that isn't it is it. Kane might have looked for the contact but that doesn't make it a dive.
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So this isn't a dive? What's the difference between the 2? We'll ignore how sky have treated the 2 instances, even though its a perfect example of media bias.

 
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C Kent said:
So this isn't a dive? What's the difference between the 2? We'll ignore how sky have treated the 2 instances, even though its a perfect example of media bias.

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From that angle I don't see any contact so its a dive. Looks like the pundits think its a dive as well. Just as they all seem to think Jota's is a dive.

LOL surprise surprise you think the media is biased against Liverpool. Best print up some t-shirts.
 
Colonel_Klinck said:
From that angle I don't see any contact so its a dive.
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There's clear contact on the foot that isn't planted... If you can't see it that would explain a lot. Ticks all the boxes for your definition of not being a dive.
Colonel_Klinck said:
Looks like the pundits think its a dive as well. Just as they all seem to think Jota's is a dive.
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The narrative around the 2 are entirely different, grealish is being clever, the defender is at fault, he's done nothing wrong etc
 
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C Kent said:
There's clear contact on the foot that isn't planted... If you can't see it that would explain a lot. Ticks all the boxes for your definition of not being a dive.

The narrative around the 2 are entirely different, grealish is being clever, the defender is at fault etc.
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I'm watching it on my phone. Doesn't look like a lot of contact. If there is then although he's made a massive mal of it its a pen. If he'd taken 2 more steps then thrown himself to the floor then it would absolutely be a dive. What about that don't you get?

That is because the 2 situations aren't the same are they.
 
Colonel_Klinck said:
I'm watching it on my phone. Doesn't look like a lot of contact. If there is then although he's made a massive mal of it its a pen. If he'd taken 2 more steps then thrown himself to the floor then it would absolutely be a dive. What about that don't you get?

That is because the 2 situations aren't the same are they.
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No they aren't the same that's the point, apparently the Grealish incident is a penalty according to you, because there's 'contact' and he goes down 'straight away' :rolleyes:

Colonel_Klinck said:
Oh I'm sure you can include more clubs than that, you're a Liverpool fan, that means every club is against you right :cry: :cry: t-shirts on order!
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Did you guys bring the kids and wives onto the pitch and act like they just won the league after the win against Bournemouth?
 
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