Greenlizard0 Weekend Football Thread ** spoilers ** [16th - 18th September 2016]
- Thread starter Cosimo
- Start date
No matter how well the other side plays it doesn't excuse certain things. City's first goal was a perfect example - in the first few games Bailly had been attacking everything (maybe too much) but for some reason he just stood there and looked lost, letting the City player win the flick on.
Caporegime
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Everyone with any sense knows what his best position is, striker. Just because you've become worse at football doesn't make you better in another position. At no stage in his career were through balls, clinical passing, tackling, positioning(defensively speaking) or any mostly midfield traits a part of his game and they aren't now. Every part of his game has gotten worse, the thing he used to do best is still the thing he does best now on the pitch, it's just at a lower level but so is every other part of his game.
He's a striker, full stop, he was never a no.10, he was never a AMC, he was never a CM or a DM, nor any other position. Managers are trying to wedge him into the team apparently trying to do so with the least amount of damage and oddly managers think central midfield is that place. that he can effect and ruin the game more from deeper seems lost on multiple managers, or maybe a more likely explanation is they think lack of goals as a midfielder becomes a public excuse where as if he scored 5-6 goals as a no.9, people would ask more questions when the media hypes up how well he's playing.
There is also nothing strange in the way the media are making excuses for him, they've been doing it for a decade. He showed a hell of a lot of promise and had two stand out seasons but that is in 12 years with Utd. As a striker he's been average in probably 6-7 seasons, had 2 actually very good seasons, a couple of pretty bad seasons and the last two have been abysmal. throughout that entire period of only a couple of great seasons the media treated him the same as the strikers who were actually great players. The overhyping and lying about how good he's been has been going on for a decade... it's just less excusable in the past 18 months and the lies have been bigger.
Caporegime
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Just watched a highlights reel of Rooney for the match.
LOL.
LOL.
Have some faith in Mourinho - he'll come good.
That's what we kept saying last October/November/December.
Dig of the day
I agree, I just think the main problem United have at the moment now is no identity. By that I mean Barca/Real/Bayern top clubs have a "way" of playing that seems entirely seperated from the current manager, they have an overall philosophy top down which means even with a blip they move in the right direction. Feels like ManU have no top level leadership and then their direction is changed by each successive manager, who add their own signings then they end up with what they have now. They'll always be thereabouts but I can't really see them competing when it comes to the crunch. Look at the signings, so many number 10 type players in the team, no real width, no real decent DM, still questionable CB's this is after spunking (this is a rough guess) probably 350-500 million in the last 5 years? Crazy!
On Mourinho I used to love him, now I'm just fed up of his constant whiny **** and "everyone's fault but mine" mentality. As soon as he comes on tv I tend to just turn over and I think most are the same boat including players and those involved in football. He's talented and probably will turn it round but wouldn't be hugely shocked if his ego imploded United like it did Chelsea last year.
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Even the guardian saying it as it is.
"That was largely – though not exclusively – because Wayne Rooney assumed exactly the role that Mourinho insisted he would not be given, the deep-lying playmaker with licence to dictate the tempo of play. A slow, ponderous tempo"
"That was largely – though not exclusively – because Wayne Rooney assumed exactly the role that Mourinho insisted he would not be given, the deep-lying playmaker with licence to dictate the tempo of play. A slow, ponderous tempo"
Rooney isn't the only problem Man Utd have, but he is probably the biggest. From what I've seen of him the past 12 months, he shouldn't be near the starting line up of any Premier League team. He brings nothing good at all. Unfortunately he will be playing plenty of games still for England and Man Utd alike.
Because he is the darling/poster boy of English football.
Unfortunately it seems he is well, well past it now and isn't good enough to play for a top team.
Soldato
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It's an odd one, all the fans says he is playing crap (including Man Utd ones) but he never seems to be dropped. It he getting worse or was it just not as noticeable when the team was playing well? I've just had a look as it goal tally over his career and bar two seasons where he scored 34 he has never been prolific, he usually barely scores over 20. It begs the question, was he ever that good? He certainly has promise in his early 20s yet hasn't seemed to get better, only worse.
Add fellaini to that as well. Stick Carrick in midfield cos he'll do the dirty work, put Pogba out wide with either Martial or Rashford and have one of them partner Zlatan up front.
EDIT
Also add Tom Jones as vocal coach so they can learn to speak to each other as well
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He has been very good but that should not give him a free ticket to be picked every game.
I can't remember a game in recent times where he has been stand out player. Even when we win he's played rubbish.
The trouble is he will do one half decent thing in the next few games and the media will go absolutely ape **** over it, calling him a footballing genious, "Rooney has responded to critics" etc. and that will buy him another dozen games of being mediocre until his next half decent contributation.
I think he just makes too much off the field to be dropped on it.
There's an article here about his rather special contract:
http://www.express.co.uk/sport/foot...third-tier-in-Man-Utd-contract-to-boost-wages
You don't know if some of the sponsorship contracts with him demand that he plays or will just mean too big a loss in income to the club to drop him.
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Personally think its unfair to compare Utd to any of those to start with. Barca and Bayern dominate their leagues year in year out without rarely having to get out of 2nd gear. When a manager swap happens, they already have a very good if not exceptional team to work with from day 1 so dont need to change anything , and they might bring in a promising youngster or change one or two senior players but nothing that alters the team majorly. Even though Real dont dominate quite as much, they still have a relatively stable 1st team that managers dont need to change that much to still perform well in 9 out of 10 matches.
Utd havent had even a very good team (ie functioning as good as they should be) for ......4 seasons? Fergie patched over a few things in his final season but it really wasnt a great team, Moyes didnt do anything at all and Giggs didnt really get a chance to do anything. LvG was a fish out of water most of the time.
Taking off-field considerations out of it for a moment, Utd have available players that would make a pretty decent (once they were used to it) 4- 3- 3 team and it would get the most out of the majority if not all of them.
Darmian , Smalling, Bailly, Shaw, Carrick, Herrera (or Schneiderlin), Pogba, Martial, Ibra, Mkhitaryan would be a really good line up - solid at the back but with creativity and speed up front with a lethal striker (even if he has missed some relatively easy shots , for him, recently)
Henry and a few other commentators seem to think Pogba excels at No10 and slightly less as an AM, either way he is a whole lot better than playing where he is currently and not always catching the runners behind like his current position requires.
Whether the legal behind the scenes issues doesnt allow for that I dont know, but its looking like Rooney is simply undroppable - and with his form currently that would ***** up any of the teams you mentioned.
Utd may well have "wasted" a lot of money in that time frame, but with no consistant base to work from , its not surprising different managers want to change different aspects to start with.
Premiership teams just cant "carry" 2 or 3 players any more due to the competivness of the league. Utd are currently carrying at least three (Valencia, Fellaini and Rooney) with an out of form Martial and an inexperienced Bailly. Martial carried Utd through multiple games last season nearly single-handedly, its unfortunate he has lost his form but Im sure he will find it again soon.
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Soldato
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I think it's harsh to criticise Valencia. I'm usually the first person to say he should be got rid of but he has improved significantly under Mourinho and I don't think Darmian showed anywhere near good enough form last year to be considered a suitable replacement. Obviously Valencia isn't a long-term solution, particularly given that he is nearly 32, but for the time being he's the best RB we've got.
Fellaini and Rooney are the main players being a burden on the team at the moment, they both need to be dropped and it boggles the mind that Mourinho continues to play them both even though there are perfectly good replacements in the squad. I also think dropping Rooney would free up Pogba to play in his most suitable position.
Fellaini and Rooney are the main players being a burden on the team at the moment, they both need to be dropped and it boggles the mind that Mourinho continues to play them both even though there are perfectly good replacements in the squad. I also think dropping Rooney would free up Pogba to play in his most suitable position.
He's only got one good foot and he isnt that good a defender, and while he maybe an attacking (width -adding) player, surely he has to be a defender 1st?
He has been "ok" so far, but he usually gets found out at least once every game because of his lack of defensive skills