Greenlizard0 Weekend Football Thread ** spoilers ** [6th - 11th April 2012]

woppy101 said:
That's what people were saying about Newcastle "we haven't played anyone yet and our bubble would burst soon" and we have seen how that has ended
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Indeed we have; going back to this thread people got called up for suggesting Newcastle would falter when they faced the run of games against MC, MU and Chelsea, yet that was exactly what happened (1pt from 3 games and a fall of 3 places in the table): http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?p=20469073 :p

I say that slightly tongue in cheek (since I actually don't think we've yet seen how it has ended i.e. whether they will finish in the top 4 which was where they were at the time) but that situation was a bit different anyway because people weren't coming out and saying "without a doubt Newcastle will finish top 4" they just suggested it might be a possibility.

Not looking to knock the guy for having faith in his striker and all entitled to our opinions, he may even be right, but it just seems a bit early in his Prem career to put him so far ahead of everyone else as a poacher/finisher, people were probably saying the same about Hernandez 18 months ago. I dunno, I suppose when you look at the Premiership these days there isn't a huge long list of world-class finishers around, in terms of the calibre of Shearer, Fowler, RvN, Henry, Solskjaer etc.
 
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drunkenmaster said:
They're still making far far to much of a big deal about the scouts at Newcastle, while I've basically never seen anyone give credit to scouts at other clubs.... honestly it reeks of "we hate Cashley so we'll put the praise on anyone but the guy whose doing it".

Did Chelsea need a scout to find Torres?

I can't name a really good player Newcastle have..... who wasn't a star before joining, just not in the UK for a lot of them.

Who didn't know about Ba, Cabaye, Arfa, Tiote, Cisse, these weren't guys flying under the radar.

Scouts are the guys who pick up a star buy from some 2nd division player in Guatamala, or kids just about anywhere.

Cabaye, Ba, Tiote, Cisse, Arfa, were very very good players and the only thing exceptional about their deals was, other clubs were too stupid not to go for them, Newcastle persuaded them to join, and Newcastle picked in just about every case the god damned perfect time to do their business.

Every year hundreds of fantastic players, maybe not the worlds best, go to new clubs for practically nothing, Newcastle are doing exceptionally well in their transfer dealings, mostly exactly because they aren't buying unknowns.

Basically the current top 4 should all hang their heads in shame, there isn't a team in the top four who wouldn't be improved with Cabaye, Tiote, Ba, Cisse, Arfa and Guti, they aren't better than every other player in the top 4 but not far off at all. Next to nothing, lowish wages, great players, if Arsenal bought that lot instead of Gervinho, Arteta, Chamakh, Mertesacker and Santos I wouldn't have a leg to stand on complaining about Arsenal. :(
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Tiote is the really one that a lot dint know about he spent most of FC twenty league winning season on the bench just getting bought on to secure the win.

Cabaye yes was well known he was the guy pulling the strings in lile league winning season but Carr was trying to sign him a few years ago and has watched him since he was 19.

Carr had been round a long time so would have massive wealth of knowledge and has also managed teams.

An example would be. Ashely "We been offered 25million for tiote do you have replacements in mind ?" Carr "yes I watch whats his face and thingie majig for a while now and both would be well suited."

Carr is not just praised by Newcastle Fans this has come from the club's top brass. From the owner, the chairman and Pardew. They have all been singing his praises.

Think Pardew said once that he makes his job a lot easier lol.

His job title might be headscout but he took over from Dennis wise and has a lot more say in transfers than people think. If he really wanted a player sign he would be signed.

As for Carr going else where he's Basically got his dream job. Well paid 15 or so miles from his home town
 
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HangTime said:
Not looking to knock the guy for having faith in his striker and all entitled to our opinions, he may even be right, but it just seems a bit early in his Prem career to put him so far ahead of everyone else as a poacher/finisher, people were probably saying the same about Hernandez 18 months ago. I dunno, I suppose when you look at the Premiership these days there isn't a huge long list of world-class finishers around, in terms of the calibre of Shearer, Fowler, RvN, Henry, Solskjaer etc.
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True but this guy has managed a goal every other game everywhere he has went and has made the step up in harder leagues every time. If we Finnish top 6 he has already repaid his transfer fee :)

He's already a Gordie Legend for the "you paid for my flight sign" lol
 
Bigpig said:
True but this guy has managed a goal every other game everywhere he has went and has made the step up in harder leagues every time. If we Finnish top 6 he has already repaid his transfer fee :)

He's already a Gordie Legend for the "you paid for my flight sign" lol
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there is always 2nd season syndrome to get over (from next Jan strictly speaking)

wihtout a doubt as good a signing for Newcastle as Chicharito has been for Man Utd.



Always thought scouts (at least some of them) where paid members of staff....depending on the size of the club obviously
 
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Well we need a win but id take a draw! Im sick and tired of us losing!

A win is needed badly if we lose AGAIN im sorry KD must go i said it form the start KD was a great soulution for a short term problems but he should have never got the long term job.

Suarez for all his great play i hope he gets a goal today. Id like to see Gerrard too he has been non existent at times in recent matches
 
Anything that causes Alex "sunburnt, withered testicle head" Mcleish unhappiness on the football pitch is fine by me, but then do I really want to see that **** Kenny celebrating? A draw is the best outcome I think... :p
 
FrankJH said:
there is always 2nd season syndrome to get over (from next Jan strictly speaking)

wihtout a doubt as good a signing for Newcastle as Chicharito has been for Man Utd.

Always thought scouts (at least some of them) where paid members of staff....depending on the size of the club obviously
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Difference being, I said at the time and still say Hernandez didn't have anything to his game but tap ins, and his entire game is built on running in behind and hoping the pass comes early enough for him to be onside(which is getting rarer and rarer). He's a one trick pony, being unknown at first and beating the offside trap, which with defenders who now know him and his gameplan, catch him out far far more often.

he never had strength, any real ability to dribble, he's NOT a great finisher, he just made decent runs for the best team in the league. He was never that good, and never looked that good.

With Cisse, none of that is true, his interplay is miles ahead of Hernandez, he can scuff a ball in from 3yards or chip the ball over the defender/keeper perfectly into the far corner, power into into the top corner with a truly stunning strike, can generate amazing power and accuracy. Hernandez is barely even noticeable more than 10 yards from goal, Cisse looks a threat in the opposition half. Cisse's link up play with Ba is exceptional, his movement is fantastic, he'll happily take the ball in midfield, he dropped deep to create places for his team to pass, and moved the ball on well, he can go shoulder to shoulder with defenders, hold the ball up, take players on. These are things Hernandez is simply **** at, and Cisse isn't.

Most clubs want a Hernandez type limited player for specific situations and supersub-ness of them. Most clubs would kill to have someone like Cisse

Boils down to really, when Hernandez isn't scoring, he isn't doing anything worthwhile, when Cisse isn't, he's still a huge influence on the game. He could still have a bad time, most players do have bad seasons, and he probably won't continue a goal a game for Newcastle, though you never know. But Hernandez at no time looked like anything than a poacher, not a great footballer, Cisse looks like an incredibly good footballer AND a great poacher.
 
drunkenmaster said:
Difference being, I said at the time and still say Hernandez didn't have anything to his game but tap ins, and his entire game is built on running in behind and hoping the pass comes early enough for him to be onside(which is getting rarer and rarer). He's a one trick pony, being unknown at first and beating the offside trap, which with defenders who now know him and his gameplan, catch him out far far more often.

he never had strength, any real ability to dribble, he's NOT a great finisher, he just made decent runs for the best team in the league. He was never that good, and never looked that good.

With Cisse, none of that is true, his interplay is miles ahead of Hernandez, he can scuff a ball in from 3yards or chip the ball over the defender/keeper perfectly into the far corner, power into into the top corner with a truly stunning strike, can generate amazing power and accuracy. Hernandez is barely even noticeable more than 10 yards from goal, Cisse looks a threat in the opposition half. Cisse's link up play with Ba is exceptional, his movement is fantastic, he'll happily take the ball in midfield, he dropped deep to create places for his team to pass, and moved the ball on well, he can go shoulder to shoulder with defenders, hold the ball up, take players on. These are things Hernandez is simply **** at, and Cisse isn't.

Most clubs want a Hernandez type limited player for specific situations and supersub-ness of them. Most clubs would kill to have someone like Cisse

Boils down to really, when Hernandez isn't scoring, he isn't doing anything worthwhile, when Cisse isn't, he's still a huge influence on the game. He could still have a bad time, most players do have bad seasons, and he probably won't continue a goal a game for Newcastle, though you never know. But Hernandez at no time looked like anything than a poacher, not a great footballer, Cisse looks like an incredibly good footballer AND a great poacher.
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Wrong, so so wrong.

Hernandez is a great player in the air.

What your also missing is the intelligence he has in the way he makes his runs with and more importantly without the ball, taking defenders with him. Creating space for the other forwards and midfielders to run into.

If the majority of his goals come form 'Tap Ins'' no big deal really as long as he Scores.

Season 2010-2011 - 45 Appearances 20 Goals
Season 2011- 2012 - 33 Appearances (More as a Sub than last year & more Injuries) 12 Goals

Not taking anything away from Cisse but if most clubs would kill to have a Cisse type player then why didn't any team above Newcastle or just below went in for him or any of the other top teams in Europe.
 
I wouldn't worry about DM's opinion, he was spectacularly wrong about Valencia chances are he'll be just as wrong about Hernandez :p

Like he says though all players have bad seasons it just doesn't occur to him that this may be Hernandez's
 
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