Greta Thunberg

[Threepwood]

You're moving the goalposts again and again.

There is the possibility he never meant ban all c02 emmisions there are... You would have to be a bit of a fool to think that, or super ignorant. Maybe you could treat folk as if they have a level of intelligence over a 5 year old and not take exactly what they so anally just so you can go off on a super intelligent rant?

But who can tell with folk nowadays

 

[4K8KW10]

If you want to be green you stop producing new cars full stop. Maintain old ones and keep them indefinitely this is why I laugh at people who think they are green yet change their phone and car every six months. A new car even an electric one to break even on a perfectly useable used motor is in the hundreds of thousands of miles. Things like this is why climate change is an absolute joke and I ignore it because everyone is basically a hypocrite unless you can live carbon neutral. It will never happen because the economy will be brought to its knees.

I am sure 99% will give the middle finger if they are told they cannot change their phone, TV, Computer, or car untill it blows up and will not work anymore which is what we should all be doing if we want to be eco friendly.

We can't be hypocrites because we have no choice but to be part of the system as is.
Once the fossil fuels burning stops, the excess carbon dioxide emissions will stop, too. The Planet simply can not at the present moment recycle the man-made carbon dioxide.

If you stop producing new cars, the economy will enter a very deep crisis because the automotive industries are quite significant in size.

They simply need to emit zero carbon dioxide when making them, and make them from recycled materials.

 

[Rroff]

Maintain old ones and keep them indefinitely

Be easier if the car manufacturers did a better job in the first place and were better designed for maintenance.

So many vehicles these days are in a poor state after a few years due to the manufacturer trying to save a few pence on better quality parts, etc. or taking other shortcuts or cheaping out at the expense of the customer and ultimately environment.

 

[Smokey Deza]

snip

Oh do stop.

Fossil fuels are not running out and burning them is certainly not going 'destroy the planet'.

Honestly, where to people get off with this 'save the planet' crap.

 

[Threepwood]

^^ I think people don't literally mean save the planet, as if our actions will actually destroy it. While that might be possible if all the nuclear weapons went off at once (lol) ... They mean making it uninhabital for humans and other forms of life. Carlin made all that pretty clear with his save the planet scetch years ago, though I must admit I've met a lot of folk who don't actually 'get it' tbh.

Where do folk get off with save the planet? Idk, I think its a bit like living in a tidy house rather than a proverbial pigsty.

Clean air, clean water, clean food... bio diversity, you know?

 

[adam cool dude]

We can't be hypocrites because we have no choice but to be part of the system as is.
Once the fossil fuels burning stops, the excess carbon dioxide emissions will stop, too. The Planet simply can not at the present moment recycle the man-made carbon dioxide.

If you stop producing new cars, the economy will enter a very deep crisis because the automotive industries are quite significant in size.

They simply need to emit zero carbon dioxide when making them, and make them from recycled materials.

It is your choice to be part of that system. You do not have to buy that shiney new car. You choose too because you want too. What if our planet is doomed as everyone says. Would you rather have the economy crash but your children live or carry on as is but suffer the consequences.

 

[Lopéz]

EVs are very cheap. You pay once to buy it and then you can charge it for free.
While your diesel car needs to be refilled every time for loads of $$$$.

Free? I pay for my electricity, it isn't free?

 

[Threepwood]

Free? I pay for my electricity, it isn't free?

There are lots of free EV charging places, quite a few workplaces have them too, I don't know of a single free petrol place.

It is your choice to be part of that system. You do not have to buy that shiney new car.

Any many dont buy that shiny new car, but they still need a car for whichever reason... and many of those folk buy the most economical second/thirds/fourth hand car they can for cost and enviromental reasons. Not a big fat guzzler.

Give them another option and at least they have a choice.

Example, a lot of folk don't fly.... but at least they can get on a train or whatever.

 

[adam cool dude]

There are lots of free EV charging places, quite a few workplaces have them too, I don't know of a single free petrol place.



Any many dont buy that shiny new car, but they still need a car for whichever reason... and many of those folk buy the most economical second/thirds/fourth hand car they can for cost and enviromental reasons. Not a big fat guzzler.

Give them another option and at least they have a choice.

Example, a lot of folk don't fly.... but at least they can get on a train or whatever.

What I am trying to point out is buying an electric car to be eco friendly is just a gimmick. You are not being eco friendly you are just adding to your carbon footprint. Using an old fossil burning car that has already had its carbon footprint is far more economical to the environment than ordering a brand new ev to be built. It would take thousands of miles to even out the carbon footprint of having a new car made. Just a quick Google but manufacturers say around 20-30% of a cars emissions comes from its production (Do not quote me but I guess electric cars is even higher) with a 100,000 mile cycle. That's 20-30k miles or 4-5 years on an average mileage before it even breaks even.

This point can be extended to various electronic goods but many of us including myself love a new toy but I don't go around saying I'm an environmentalist and is the least of my concern when purchasing.

 

[Nasher]

If you want to be green you stop producing new cars full stop. Maintain old ones and keep them indefinitely this is why I laugh at people who think they are green yet change their phone and car every six months. A new car even an electric one to break even on a perfectly useable used motor is in the hundreds of thousands of miles. Things like this is why climate change is an absolute joke and I ignore it because everyone is basically a hypocrite unless you can live carbon neutral. It will never happen because the economy will be brought to its knees.

I am sure 99% will give the middle finger if they are told they cannot change their phone, TV, Computer, or car untill it blows up and will not work anymore which is what we should all be doing if we want to be eco friendly.

But that isn't good for business, so they don't tell people do keep them running for as long as possible :/

If you buy one petrol car and keep it going for years and years, that is doing far less economical damage than a new EV every 3 years. It's building and shipping the thing which does the most damage.

 

[Threepwood]

You are not being eco friendly you are just adding to your carbon footprint.

Surely not, if like you say, you are going to buy a new shiney car anyway? We have to compare like to like no?

My criteria for a 'new, actually second hand' car is one that is as economical as possible which is two fold, enviroment and running cost.... the former because if I'm going to be a hypocrite I want to be the least hypocritical I can be, and the latter because I'm a yorkshireman.

Idk, its a known sad fact that to go green you have to go black first. There are plenty of things that trickle down, I mean, look at LED light bulbs.... tiny thing but have a large impact when all put together.

 

[Nasher]

Surely not, if like you say, you are going to buy a new shiney car anyway? We have to compare like to like no?

My criteria for a 'new, actually second hand' car is one that is as economical as possible which is two fold, enviroment and running cost.... the former because if I'm going to be a hypocrite I want to be the least hypocritical I can be, and the latter because I'm a yorkshireman.

Idk, its a known sad fact that to go green you have to go black first. There are plenty of things that trickle down, I mean, look at LED light bulbs.... tiny thing but have a large impact when all put together.

But it goes the other way to. When the whole world wants EVs the mining of rare Earth materials and battery manufacturing is going to be as big of a problem as oil extraction/refining. I guess no one plans that far ahead though...

 

[adam cool dude]

Surely not, if like you say, you are going to buy a new shiney car anyway? We have to compare like to like no?

My criteria for a 'new, actually second hand' car is one that is as economical as possible which is two fold, enviroment and running cost.... the former because if I'm going to be a hypocrite I want to be the least hypocritical I can be, and the latter because I'm a yorkshireman.

Idk, its a known sad fact that to go green you have to go black first. There are plenty of things that trickle down, I mean, look at LED light bulbs.... tiny thing but have a large impact when all put together.

This is not about comparing like for like. This is about people being as economical as possible to "save the planet". That being keeping your old car for as long as possible without buying brand new.

Lightbulbs are the same as cars. You go into the red first but the margin is so small you are quickly in the green. Larger more complex objects are a completely different thing as the return takes far longer but the throw away culture of the west means the economic benefit is not reached as the economy will crash as people are not buying new products. You can't have your cake and eat it as they say.

 

[Threepwood]

going to be as big of a problem as oil mining.

You admit oil mining is a problem?

Yes, I totally agree, it is ofsetting one problem with another problem...... but with the aim of eventually having less of a problem than if there with no change to the problem to start with. Anyway, battery tech changes fast when it does.

This is not about comparing like for like. This is about people being as economical as possible to "save the planet".

There aren't many second hand EV's on the market though, so if you are going to buy second hand you have no option, but if you are going to buy new... you do?

the throw away culture of the west cannot stop because the economy will crash. You can't have your cake and eat it as they say.

Seems a bit black and white, is there no grey area to be had that could slow down the throwaway culture while also not totally crash the economy?

As for having cake and eating it, the same goes with our enviroment etc...... can we not at least strive for a better balance?

 

[Nasher]

You admit oil mining is a problem?

OFC it's a problem, but still we need it for the world to run. EVs won't fix the problem, only move it somewhere else but Greta's disciples seem to dumb to think that far ahead.

 

[4K8KW10]

Free? I pay for my electricity, it isn't free?

There are three options to run your EV:
1. Use free charging places wherever and whenever possible;
2. Just plug it and charge it using your ordinary house 230V plug;
3. Invest in some type of autonomous energy production system in your house (like solar panels installation), pay once and then use it forever for free.

What I am trying to point out is buying an electric car to be eco friendly is just a gimmick. You are not being eco friendly you are just adding to your carbon footprint. Using an old fossil burning car that has already had its carbon footprint is far more economical to the environment than ordering a brand new ev to be built. It would take thousands of miles to even out the carbon footprint of having a new car made. Just a quick Google but manufacturers say around 20-30% of a cars emissions comes from its production (Do not quote me but I guess electric cars is even higher) with a 100,000 mile cycle. That's 20-30k miles or 4-5 years on an average mileage before it even breaks even.

This point can be extended to various electronic goods but many of us including myself love a new toy but I don't go around saying I'm an environmentalist and is the least of my concern when purchasing.

Having and driving an electric car is much more eco-friendly than this. I am already sick!

Look at what happens everywhere around the world right now because of the diesel cars - and these are relatively new cars!

 

[adam cool dude]

There aren't many second hand EV's on the market though, so if you are going to buy second hand you have no option, but if you are going to buy new... you do?

If you said you were buying an EV due to its instant torque and quiet engine I would agree whole heartedly but saying you are buying a brand new EV to save the environment is just a gimmick when the fact is there are far better options available to "save the environment".

People just totally ignore the carbon footprint producing a brand new car exerts.

 

[Threepwood]

OFC it's a problem, but we need it for the world to run. EVs won't fix the problem, only move it somewhere else until the dumb masses realise and kick off about that years later.

Depends how it is done really. More EV's will help in some areas, but not in others etc.


4k8k: Those photos do look a bit photoshoppy, sorry!

If you said you were buying an EV due to its instant torque and quiet engine I would agree whole heartedly but saying you are buying a brand new EV to save the environment is just a gimmick when the fact is there are far better options available to "save the environment".

Is that not allowed to be part of the reason then? Lowering your local enviroments emmissions?

 

[Nasher]

That's called "coal rolling", rednecks remove filters and tune the car to do that on purpose. Then they drive them past cyclists and Priuses etc.

It's really bad and they should get a driving ban for it if caught, but at the same time kinda funny.

 

[4K8KW10]

4k8k: Those photos do look a bit photoshoppy, sorry!

This is the reality on the streets! I would call it funny but it's a tragedy!

I thought they put some vegetable/sun flower oil instead of diesel, but I am told it's just defects in the engines, not properly running turbines, etc...