What's the problem kid ? ... Ran out of popcorn ?
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GTX 1060 Vs RX 480 - head to head showdown
- Thread starter Gregster
- Start date
What's the problem kid ? ... Ran out of popcorn ?
Wasn't suggesting it was a bad thing.
Just than in a more 'balanced' PC setup(weak CPU/weak GPU or good CPU/good GPU), it is no way representative of what kind of performance gains to expect. It's misleading if you try and suggest it is a 'typical' scenario.
I also wonder how many of the people who say they are prioritizing DX12 performance over DX11 performance would gladly choose an 8320 over a 6600k if they built a new PC right now....
I would say it's a pretty common occurrence low and mid range cpu's combined with good GPUs. I come across this kind of setup regularly.
Ah ok. I imagine the games where the minimums are improved(like with Tomb Raider), it's because DX12 is helping improve CPU performance.
In fact, CPU intensive games are really where DX12 should be most useful.
That said, frametime consistency is just as important for smoothness and it still looks like it's something of an issue for AMD even in DX12:
Majority of near-future games will still be DX11. Not to mention I reckon most gamers dont only play brand new games.
I think if somebody doesn't prioritize DX12 over DX11 performance, it is an entirely sensible stance.
Are those ROTTR graphs using the latest patch where async is enabled?
As before that patch, dx 12 was barely any better than dx 11 for me but with that latest patch, the game is far far far smoother than dx 11 for me.
Obviously it depends on the users CPU as well, people with high end i7's won't be seeing anywhere as much benefit as people on older i5/i7s like myself.
Yup mantle was/is a god send for my PC in bf 4, with latest drivers and game patches, the difference isn't as big as it previously was but mantle still feels just that bit smoother "overall"
My results here:
https://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showpost.php?p=28634955&postcount=174
+1
Don't forget all those people who were/have been saying that nvidia were working with microsoft on dx 12 for many years before public announcement and some even were saying long before AMD...
Surely if all that was true then we would be seeing nvidia benefiting from dx 12 just as much, if not more than AMD from day 1?
Here is one of the many threads where it was touted that nvidia would have great, if not better DX 12 results than AMD due to their hardware and drivers plus cooperation with Microsoft etc.
https://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?t=18674807&highlight=Directx+12.1
Its reading things like this that makes me wonder what is sensible.
I actually look forward to DX12 improving and bringing possible better performance to more mainstream cards like the 1060 or 480. If it or Vulkan includes developers bringing more console titles to PC and more PC titles to consoles then that is welcomed too.
Also for me HDR is one of the major benefits in looking forward for, inc games we will see soon from Microsoft at least and possible patches for other current titles. Not sure how many upcoming games are to have it but for monitor manufacturers to sell displays more titles obviously have to start using it.
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Soldato
- Joined
- 6 Feb 2010
- Posts
- 14,582
The sheer amount of double-standard is frankly hilarious for some people:
- AMD perform better than Nvidia due to boost from Mantle and does not affect the dx11 performance of Nvidia in anyway: Blame AMD for grimping Nvidia
- AMD get shoved through the GameWorks's black box and performance significantly than the should: All is just, blame AMD for being incompetence, claim it doesn't matter AMD cards perform far worse than they should "as long as it is playable"; when AMD perform better than Nvidia in dx12 (a neutral API): Same people with pitchforks out blaming AMD for grimping Nvidia (ignoring the fact that Nvidia skimped on the hardware that support that aspect of dx12 feature but go with a software approach to cut cost and wave the big "efficiency flag")
- AMD perform better than Nvidia due to boost from Mantle and does not affect the dx11 performance of Nvidia in anyway: Blame AMD for grimping Nvidia
- AMD get shoved through the GameWorks's black box and performance significantly than the should: All is just, blame AMD for being incompetence, claim it doesn't matter AMD cards perform far worse than they should "as long as it is playable"; when AMD perform better than Nvidia in dx12 (a neutral API): Same people with pitchforks out blaming AMD for grimping Nvidia (ignoring the fact that Nvidia skimped on the hardware that support that aspect of dx12 feature but go with a software approach to cut cost and wave the big "efficiency flag")
I remember this well, No one suggested foul play at all, i suggested that amd got a good boost from mantle while nvidia was always quite a bit ahead using dx11, so it evened itself out when nvidia was on dx11 and amd were on mantle.
A little bit like it is now although amd have better performance in dx12 than nvidia generally, whilst nvidia dx12 performance is about the same as dx11.
Not sure you are reading the same thread as us, or even the same forum. Nobody is whinging about these things you mention except you. All your points in fact have no relevancy in this thread at all. Who has blamed AMD for anything?
Good article HERE regards DOOM
As for DX12 and Vulkan, Alex had this to say:
“DirectX 12 and Vulkan are conceptually very similar and both clearly inherited a lot from AMD’s Mantle API efforts. The low level nature of those APIs moves a lot of the optimization responsibility from the driver to the application developer, so we don’t expect big differences in speed between the two APIs in the future. On the tools side there is very good Vulkan support in RenderDoc now, which covers most of our debugging needs. We choose Vulkan, because it allows us to support Windows 7 and 8, which still have significant market share and would be excluded with DirectX 12. On top of that Vulkan has an extension mechanism that allows us to work very closely with AMD, NVIDIA and Intel to do very specific optimizations for each hardware.”
As for DX12 and Vulkan, Alex had this to say:
“DirectX 12 and Vulkan are conceptually very similar and both clearly inherited a lot from AMD’s Mantle API efforts. The low level nature of those APIs moves a lot of the optimization responsibility from the driver to the application developer, so we don’t expect big differences in speed between the two APIs in the future. On the tools side there is very good Vulkan support in RenderDoc now, which covers most of our debugging needs. We choose Vulkan, because it allows us to support Windows 7 and 8, which still have significant market share and would be excluded with DirectX 12. On top of that Vulkan has an extension mechanism that allows us to work very closely with AMD, NVIDIA and Intel to do very specific optimizations for each hardware.”
I'm looking forward to DX12/Vulkan becoming more widespread and better adopted, too. I dont think anyone was suggesting otherwise. I just have a different outlook on how quickly that's going to happen than some of the more optimistic folks out there, who often tend to be AMD fans...
DICE pushing harder for it is no surprise as they've always been on the forefront of tech changes/adoption and obviously have low level PC experience already as the headline supporter of Mantle. Acting like their attitude is in anyway 'the norm' is perhaps rather naive though, if you ask me.
Some people seriously see all these threads and discussions in a 'war' perspective. Anybody saying something they dont like or want to hear or against what they think/believe are 'the enemy' and are out to get them and those like themselves. It's all a battleground to them. Over graphics processing units. lol
Yer and sadly it is the way, which is odd. I enjoy hardware regardless of who makes it, albeit I haven't owned an AMD CPU in a desktop for a number of years. I like to think we all enjoy games as well and want the same smooth fluid game play but if I dare say the 1060 is a good card that beats the 480, I am a raging fanboy apparently lol.
Soldato
- Joined
- 6 Feb 2010
- Posts
- 14,582
I sort of adding to what Ian said about looking back. Nvidia users kept complaining about Mantle giving AMD unfair advantage, despite it did not reduce the performance of Nvidia's cards but only widen the gap by increasing the performance of their own cards.
...and then came GameWorks, which widen the gap between Nvidia cards and AMD cards via excessive tessellation and often making higher tier cards such as 290x become slower than a 770 (at the cost lower performance for BOTH Nvidia and AMD users), and I recall YOU in particular said something along "as long as the AMD cards get playable frame rate in the GameWorks title, does it matter/who cares?"
To address what you said about "Not sure you are reading the same thread as us, or even the same forum. Nobody is whinging about these things you mention except you", may I direct you to your post in the Warhammer thread where you drawn a questionable conclusions toward the graphs (when all Nvidia cards performance dropped going from dx11 to dx12, and AMD all seen increase in performance for all their cards majority of their cards?
I honestly don't get what some of you are on about? Look at the graphs and then you might see something that is questionable regardless of AMD or NVidia
So in DX12, the 980Ti and 1080 are roughly 34% faster than the Fury X and in DX11, the 1080 is 86% faster than the Fury X. Hell even the 970 is giving the Fury X a run for the money but some of you guys are missing this and we are getting silly comments like "Nvidia only have themselves to blame" but shouldn't people be looking at the lackluster performance of the AMD cards and questioning why the performance is so bad in the first place and even DX12 isn't helping AMD here?
It just looks like a poor implementation of DX12 all round to me but don't let common sense ruin a good thread.
...and also to D.P.'s post?
On purpose or not, the two of you seem to always try to put AMD in bad light via misinformation or justified as "opinions".
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Tbh Marine I personally just thought mantle gave Amd the performance they should have had at that time over dx11, I did however disagree that on bf4 mantle was way better than dx11 on nvidia.
All water under the bridge now and we all know DP likes his nvidia tech, As does flopper with Amd but maybe DP comes across more serious than flopper and that's why flopper gets no real stick as people mainly laugh with him or ignore him.
All water under the bridge now and we all know DP likes his nvidia tech, As does flopper with Amd but maybe DP comes across more serious than flopper and that's why flopper gets no real stick as people mainly laugh with him or ignore him.
AMD has dedicated hardware sat there doing nothing unless Async is used. Nvidia mimic it in software at present, or just flat out have the driver say they can't do it.
If AMD had used that space for normal processing then they would also be on the same level as Nvidia.
If AMD had used that space for normal processing then they would also be on the same level as Nvidia.
Well a review of the Asus 480 Strix appeared in a German web site and it looks like it's trading blows with MSI 1060 Gaming even in DX11 games. 480 beats it on Witcher 3 and Call of Duty (2 out of 5 games tested).
EDIT: Another interesting thing is that the Strix seems to run in 4 modes: regular, OC and silent. There's also a "Strix Max" there, not sure if it's a separate model or a "Max OC" mode...
EDIT: Another interesting thing is that the Strix seems to run in 4 modes: regular, OC and silent. There's also a "Strix Max" there, not sure if it's a separate model or a "Max OC" mode...
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Nope this has never been suggested.
There's 8 slots on the PCB but only 6 are used. That's because it probably shares in design with the other models. But the only rumours out are that there's might be a 3GB model.
Of course, there's always the possibility of a 1060ti model which may get 8GB I guess but nothing has come out on that as far as I know.
Thanks. I thought that I had imagined it but I found the link that I read before. I forgot it was just a rumor.
http://ocaholic.ch/modules/news/article.php?storyid=14767