Hansen: Suarez goes down too easily

The video quality is very poor, but to me this looks like a 'good' dive. I still don't see any evidence of a foul, but will concede that the video is unclear.

Just goes to show that a refs job is hard :)



I disagree. In super slow-mo, Suarez does touch the ball first (stands on it). The defender then touches the ball, causing it to pop out to the side after Suarez has stood on it. Suarez then goes over the outstretched leg.

It's not a foul, it's not a dive. It's just a tackle.

Well pundits disagreed on both although the Evans one was very hard to call in real time considering the direction the ball went but Evans never touched it, O'Shea one is stonewall penalty in better quality then :p.

Evans one probably wouldn't be brought up if Valencia didn't get a penalty for a five star frog splash.
 
Suarez is a diver. Yep. Next.

Seriously though the problem is:

"I can watch on television an incident 15 times and not work out if there's contact"

The refs see it live and it's near impossible/a lottery.
With divers, it's like the boy who cried wolf....their own fault for diving before.
 
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There's definitely some terrible tackles in there on him, but a whole load of those are not penalties.

1:30: Nice bit of skill from Suarez, then nicks the ball in front of the defender and throws himself to the ground. Verdict: Dive. I'm not even sure if he does get touched or not, but I've watched it a good few times and it doesn't look like he's fouled, just that the ball's heading out and he decides to throw himself down.

Disagree, his left leg is clearly taken out.....infact its bleedin obvious it is.

1:55: Suarez stands on the ball at the same time as the defender sticks a toe on the ball. Suarez then goes over the defenders leg. Verdict: No penalty, no dive. Both players just played the ball fairly. For me O'Shea gets to the ball through Suarez. Would be hard to give tho.

2:11: Defender wins the ball and Suarez goes over his leg. Verdict: No penalty, no dive. Suarez is just late and his momentum takes him over (albeit very dramatically). Agree, suarez played it against his foot.

I can't be bothered going through them all, especially as some are only viewed from distance, but if that video is meant to show 'fouls' that Suarez should have got, then I think there's a lot of cases where it's wrong. Sure there's a lot where it looks like he should have had a free kick, but there's also a lot where he throws himself about, usually because he's arriving at speed just as the defender touches it away.
 
So what do you call defenders who keep fouling players and getting away with it since we have boy who cried wolf for people who supposedly dive every game?
 
Fifa vice-president Jim Boyce has joined calls for players who dive to be punished retrospectively and claimed simulation is becoming a cancer within the game.

The issue has come to the fore following Liverpool striker Luis Suarez's clear dive at the weekend, after which Stoke boss Tony Pulis called for players adjudged to have been guilty of simulation to be banned for three matches.

The Football Association does not currently allow players to be punished for diving retrospectively however - referees can only show a yellow card at most - but Boyce, Britain's representative on Fifa, believes all associations should.

Boyce told Press Association Sport: "I have seen several incidents recently, and I watched the latest Suarez incident two or three times, and to me it is nothing less than a form of cheating.

"It is becoming a little bit of a cancer within the game and I believe if it is clear to everyone that it is simulation then that person is trying to cheat and they should be severely punished for that.

"It can be dealt with retrospectively by disciplinary committees, and it is done so in some associations, and I believe that is the correct thing to do.

"It can at times be very, very difficult for referees to judge whether something is a foul or a fair tackle and if players are diving then it makes their job even harder."

The issue has been discussed by the FA and the leagues before without any change in policy. The Premier League have previously suggested a three-man panel to review contentious incidents after every weekend, which could include simulation, and would be open to renewing discussions on bringing in such a system.

The FA said the issue was often reviewed. A spokesman added: "Simulation is not something that the FA currently take retrospective action over but it is an issue that is often reviewed and discussed by the game's stakeholders."

Liverpool boss Brendan Rodgers yesterday leapt to the defence of Suarez, saying: "At this moment there seems to be one set of rules for Luis and another set for everyone else.

"Diving and simulation is obviously a wider issue in football and one that we all agree has to be eradicated from our game but there were other incidents this weekend that didn't seem to generate the same coverage.

"I believe some people need to develop a sense of perspective and I also believe in this moment the vilification of Luis is both wrong and unfair."

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/...cheating-says-fifa-vicepresident-8204163.html

Why is Bale not being called out who had the most booking for simulation last season? Or did it on the same weekend as Suarez except he had absolutely zero contact, Suarez had at least lost balance before his retarded dive.

Why wasn't this brought up by fifa when say for example Drogba was doing this for 4 years on the trot, granted he stopped (when he wasn't being played as much or the 09/10 season) but then restarted last year in the CL run and FA Cup final.
 
Tony Pullis is a genius!

He has managed to get sundays games focused on Suarez, diving and bans, when the focus should be why the ref hadn't shown half a dozen yellow cards to the Stoke players in the first 45 minutes.
 
Anyone seen that the Fifa vice-president has said that he thinks diving has become a 'cancer' on the game? The guy's an idiot, he's saying it like it's a surprise or that Suarez is somehow more guilty of it than any other player. I don't like Suarez at all, I think he's a cheat pure and simple, but to highlight him so much is unfair. There are far, far worse divers in the football world, he's just unfortunate that he plays in a league where the fans care about fair play.

If he was playing in Spain, he wouldn't be the subject of such scrutiny, in fact lots of people wouldn't even recognise that he's prone to diving. The Latin countries (i.e. Spain, Portugal, South America, etc) all see it as part and parcel of the game, and beneficial if it helps them win things. It's just a completely different cultural mindset, they don't consider it embarassing or emasculating to throw themselves about because their attitude is that it helps them to win so why not do it?!

I'm not condoning what Suarez is doing, and I think it's ridiculous for someone like Rodgers to try to portray Suarez as a victim when he's caused his own problems by going down so easily on several occasions, but it's unfair for someone prominent within international football to highlight him when there are other players in the prem who are just as bad, and many abroad (particularly in Spain) who are much, much worse.
 
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Problem with that is because it's not really in our cultural mindset (it happens more than we'd like) when someone does dive it is jumped on, though it's certainly not only foreigners. Our media have protected young and gerrard plenty.

Refs already have a hard enough time deciding if it's a penalty or not, never mind whether it's simulation too. It doesn't have to be one or the other, it can just be a tackle. It's not a non-contact sport and pundits sometimes struggle with that.
 
I'm not condoning what Suarez is doing, and I think it's ridiculous for someone like Rodgers to try to portray Suarez as a victim when he's caused his own problems by going down so easily on several occasions, but it's unfair for someone prominent within international football to highlight him when there are other players in the prem who are just as bad, and many abroad (particularly in Spain) who are much, much worse.

Who in the prem is a worse diver than Suarez exactly, and who in Spain? Because the reality is, there isn't anyone worse in the prem, and likely not in Spain either.
 
Who in the prem is a worse diver than Suarez exactly, and who in Spain? Because the reality is, there isn't anyone worse in the prem, and likely not in Spain either.

Carl Jenkinson's dive against Chelsea was pretty bad, he's technique is worse than Suarez's! :D
 
Bale is a shockingly bad diver and I am a Spurs fan. Especially the one from the weekend which was exceptionally bad !!!

Yup, he dives, and he's bad at it, though I still can't remember as many incidents as Suarez by a LONG shot. Also while the "i went down to avoid injury" excuse IS valid in SOME instances, for example I think Eduardo did go down easily because he didn't want his leg to be planted and as soon as he felt contact he just lifted his weight off his legs, I don't think Bale has a lot of reason to do so.

Against some players you'll have someone slide in on you all game long , 5 times fouling you then the 6th time you jump over the incoming tackle.... which he pulls out of, forgiveable. Most of what Bale does isn't forgiveable diving wise, however when you watch Spurs play, does Bale scream at EVERY single decision like a complete a-hole? Does he foul people then go and rant at the ref? Attitude of a player plays a HUGE role on if people put up with behaviour or don't, as does success, this is true of just about everyone. Bale isn't the biggest **** in football so if he did dive as much as Suarez, wouldn't be treated with the same disdain... though lots of people regard him as a diving moron.

Diouff doesn't actually do that much wrong, quantity wise, but when he does something wrong its normally an extreme, same goes for Barton, and both are absolutely hated largely because their attitudes even when they arent' doing things wrong is disgraceful.

Everyone in the Spanish national team for a start.

They really aren't, Busquets dives, not anywhere near as much as Suarez, he also doesn't tend to go down in the penalty box and what most of the Spanish team do is make a meal of it when they are fouled rather than cause contact or flat out dive. Villa, Silva, Xavi, Cesc, Alba, Puyol, Torres(surprisingly), Llorente, Negredo, Navas, and plenty more aren't divers at all, will you find 1-2 dives, sure, same as everyone else, every game, not a chance. Busquets, Iniesta have at times been incredibly bad divers however both have significantly improved over their World cup period diving escapades.

Carl Jenkinson's dive against Chelsea was pretty bad, he's technique is worse than Suarez's! :D

He must be better than Suarez... he got a freekick for it :p It was a really embarrassing dive, all players WILL do that now and then, hopefully he regrets it and doesn't make a habit of it.

This is one of the things people seem to ignore, every single person on earth makes mistakes in the heat of the moment, we constantly react without thinking, sometimes that will be a stupid handball like Henry's, sometimes a stupid dive, sometimes a rash tackle. How we react to our rash decisions determines what kind of person we are. Henry, regretted it, was clearly pee'd off with himself and in no way at all made a habit of cheating.

Suarez handballed it to ruin a home nation progressing in a world cup, did he regret it or say sorry... or did he say he'd do it again given the chance, he's happy and was generally a **** about it.

I even said at the time I give him the benefit of the doubt because I didn't know him well enough then, what he said after it, what he's done since, he doesn't regret cheating, he consistently does it, has a terrible attitude and has exactly no sympathy from me(and he doesn't ask for it... though Liverpool fans constantly bang on about it).
 
I agree DM, for most of Bale's dives it can be logical to presume he doesn't want to get battered from a speeding goalkeeper a la the weekend as he could have been really injured if the keeper had clattered him. You're also bang on the money that he doesn't complain and rant when he does go down too.
 
Sorry don't know how to embed but an interesting video RE Suarez and the fouls he doesn't get. He really does get kicked about !

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=LeCZQ7nwD-Q

So many of those aren't bad tackles, a Sunderland one mid pitch which couldn't possibly of sent him down yet he throws himself down, Mertesacker, stone wall penalty, not sure he needed to go down though. Vermaelen, bit of a foul but he see's it, launches himself in the air, spins dramatically, is grabbing his leg rolling and pretending he's been shot when the contact wouldn't have hurt much at all.

This is his problem, for me the O'shea one is a complete dive, and also I mentioned that Norwich one earlier in the game that most didn't mention before the penalty he should have got. Same player, they have that in a list of bad tackles, the guy CLEARLY gets the ball and look at Suarez, absolutely launches himself into the air, massively massively massively over dramatic for an absolutely not a foul at all situation.... then he went down again against the same player and the ref thinks he's already trying to get the guy sent off?

He gets fouled a lot, he makes a meal of the genuine fouls and he makes a meal of non fouls and he makes a meal of the few situations he should have gotten a penalty.

Differentiating between a real foul/penalty and a fake one in real time without all the angles is next to impossible, whats better giving a fake one to a guy who cheats all game long, or not giving a real one against a guy who cheats all game long? Don't cheat all game long, don't make a meal of everything, stop causing fouls and stop whinging about everything and the decision for the ref becomes "it looked like a penalty, he hasn't been cheating all game/season long, there is a much much smaller risk of it being a dive" then he gives the penalty.
 
I agree DM, for most of Bale's dives it can be logical to presume he doesn't want to get battered from a speeding goalkeeper a la the weekend as he could have been really injured if the keeper had clattered him. You're also bang on the money that he doesn't complain and rant when he does go down too.

I wouldn't say most, but some, and that goes for Suarez as well and most players. But if you "dive" to avoid contact 4 times a year and don't dive at other times, as said its completely forgiveable/understandable. When its dive to avoid contact 4 times a year, + 15 other dives... people add the 4 dives to the "absolute cheating" pile because why the hell not. Bale goes down far too easily and too often and against keepers I think is the worst excuse for avoiding contact.

The guy coming out to potentially smack him when he dived this weekend, that is one thing, goalkeepers are fairly predictable in one on ones, where they will dive in, when they'll dive, how they'll dive in(normally hands first for one thing) making them pretty easy to avoid. That is when I recall Bale going down most, the knock it past a low keeper and leave a foot in.
 
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