Harsh ruling or fair?

I think the moral of the story is not really about how old someone does or does not look, it's a cautionary tale about the perils of engaging in intercourse with someone you don't know.
 
On something like this you HAVE to take the hard stance of the law.

Even though the girls consented (not legally able to), if they were acquitted or given a soft sentence it will set a TERRIBLE precedent. Partly for policy reasons there is not way in hell the judicial system will let that happen. The line has to be drawn when it comes to protecting children.
 
britboy4321 said:
So it's freezing cold in the middle of the night in some public park and some bird has just had 4 of your mates in turn and beckons you in for, erm, sloppy fifths?


No matter what her age -- the answer should be a clear .. 'er, no thanks love' !
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As awful as the base issue here is, ^this^ , I mean, why on earth would you want to do rounds with your mates on the same girl in a park, why would you even want to do it in a park, let alone with your mates ? Its just skanky!
 
kylew said:
Yes you really can, did you not go to school or something? It can be very hard to tell the age of some people, especially those type of girls who do it purposefully to hide their age.

This is the whole problem with the situation, you can't categorically state that they didn't look 16, but in fact looked 12, as if it's simply impossible. At the age of 13, I looked like I was over 18 and many times, say when getting train tickets and that, I was accused of being 18-20 many times when requesting a child's ticket.
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Interesting about the 13 bit.

Legally, as people have said, consent age is 16. However, if the person is 13-15, and the 'offender' reasonably believed she was above 16, then it would be ok.

But if the person is under 13, then what she/he looks like etc. is completely irrelevant. You are guilty. (not of rape if that wasn't the case. No idea why that article is saying guilty of rape since judge admits she was willing. Highly unlikely that's what they were convicted of. (I may be wrong, my knowledge is admittedly limited, but I would've thought that rape has a minimum sentace much longer than 2 years). More likely it was sexual activity with a child).
 
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Skyfall said:
I think the moral of the story is not really about how old someone does or does not look, it's a cautionary tale about the perils of engaging in intercourse with someone you don't know.
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This, pretty much.

Unfortunately you can invite all sorts of crap into your life, such as being called a rapist, or being lied to.

The men should obviously be punished, but not simply for what they have done - but why they have done them. The girls should also face some sort of punishment for their roles.

It should also be recognised that a person aged 12, in 2011, is not the same as someone aged 12 say, 20 years ago. There's a huge difference in attitudes, sexual maturity and the like.
 
rypt said:
Surely that has a worse punishment than rape?
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Not sure, but I don't think so. If the person is a child, then you can also commit rape, assault etc. and are prosecuted under a different section of the act.

Sexual activity is a different part of the relevant act which is likely the case here due to consent.

I don't know the difference (if any) in sentances for the above offences, but I would presume that if you are separatley prosecuted for rape, rape of a child and sexual activity with a child, the latter would carry an easier sentance.
 
No way can a 12 year old look 16, especially with their pants off.

Even if they were only just 16, only one of the boys falls within the 1/2 + 7 rule.
 
kylew said:
let's not pretend it's fact that no 12 year olds can look 16.
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Surely you do get the odd 12 year old looking like a 16 year old to some guys but all 6 guys falling for it ?
Not only that but her other 12 year old friend looking like a 16 year old too ? and they both were together looking 16 and all 6 guys fell for it ?
 
Skyfall said:
I think the moral of the story is not really about how old someone does or does not look, it's a cautionary tale about the perils of engaging in intercourse with someone you don't know.
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True...although one-night stands (with legals!) are too much fun to avoid! :p
 
Well if you think about it if a girl can convince 5 guys she looks 16 there's a fair chance she does and hence can convince the 6th guy - also in some ways having a mate with her could tip the balance, it's not 1 person saying she's 16, it's two of them.

Personally I'm still sceptical, although I'm crap at ages, I mean I was watching that 'viral' video earlier, you know the Friday song by some 13 year old girl, where they are cruising around in their car (...), and I'm thinking "she looks older than 13".

Height can make a big difference, tall girls often look older.

I used to work with a girl who said she went clubbing when she was 12-13, she didn't strike me as the type to be making that up. To get into clubs, she must have looked vaguely old enough (this would have been mid-late 90s probably, before the real clampdown started).

Anyway I think it was right to punish them, they clearly didn't take any steps to get to know the girls properly (which might have given a clue to their ages), thinking with their ****s and on this occaison they ended up in hot water.
 
Ricochet J said:
How can you physically not tell that they were not 16? :/
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In some cases, easily. In humans, development varies a lot between individuals. It is possible for a person, especially a female person, to be physically adult before reaching 13, with her full adult size and shape. No doubt she wouldn't be psychologically mature, but people often aren't psychologically mature until well past 18 so you can't use that to determine age.

Judging by the summing up quoted from the judge, these men were wrongly punished on the basis of the judge disapproving of women having sex with more than one man in quick succession and them blaming men for it. That was what the summary was focussed on, not their age.

Bottom line from me is that I disapprove of people being labelled rapists solely because they were deceived and lacked the magic spells necessary to detect convincing lies. That's not a fair basis for law.
 
Sudden said:
Legally, as people have said, consent age is 16. However, if the person is 13-15, and the 'offender' reasonably believed she was above 16, then it would be ok.
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Are you sure? When did the law change? It certainly wasn't like that the last time I looked for details during an argument, which wasn't that long ago.

When I looked, the law was very explicit about reasonable belief not being a legal defence - one second under 16 was enough and no evidence, not even a sworn affadavit from the Queen stating the person was over 18 combined with a detailed medical report stating they were an adult, was enough. For no stated reason, you might get one go at a reasonable belief defence if you were also young enough, but it would not be "OK", it would remain on record and you could only use it once, ever.
 
Who cares whether they looked 16 or not. When a girl tells you they are 16, alarm bells should be ringing.

As for these 'footballers', they should know better and deserve worse tbh. Honestly, gangbanging a girl one after the other in the middle of a park is so sad and beyond desperate. Shame on them all.
 
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mglover070588 said:
How the heck can you mistakr a 12 year old for a 16 year old.

That is beyond me.
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Very very easily.
I was on holiday in Tunisia and there were these twin girls who turned every blokes head when they walked past.
I don't normally look at anything younger than 30 but these two were stunning.
At night they were even more stunning dressed to kill and then my daughters got friendly with them.
They were 12 but looked in their early 20s.
It does happen.
You must have noticed in a class of 14 year olds some look 10 and some look 20.
 
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