Has making a pass at a woman just become illegal?

The Funktopus said:
Christ, you mention Speakers corner constantly, no matter what the subject of a thread might be. What happened to you in there that’s seemingly left you so traumatised?
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He's never got over the butt hurt of being banned and the chip it's created on his shoulder has made his knuckles drag on the ground more than they used to :p
 
Minusorange said:
The issue here is what is considered reasonable, like is it okay to ask someone pretty for their number or is this now unreasonable ?
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Of course it isn't, it's just the usual MGTOWs in GD that try to portay it as such. No-one is going to get into trouble for normal behaviour any more than they ever have.

I mean, the whole thread title screams MGTOW, as if the things being cracked down on is what you constitute as "making a pass" at a woman, then this is directly aimed at you! :p

gingergundog said:
Its weird, I knew when I was crossing a boundary and the person I was interacting with wasn't interested. They quite plainly spelled it out for me. What did I do then? I moved on and found something else to do.
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And that's perfectly normal and this new guidance wont affect you will it. The bit you seem to miss is there's guys who don't act as reasonably as you do.

gingergundog said:
Society has got so damn weird.
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No more or less than it ever was, its just now we tend to discuss and try and tackle issues that used to be swept under the carpet.
 
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Freakbro said:
And that's perfectly normal and this new guidance wont affect you will it. The bit you seem to miss is there's guys who don't act as reasonably as you do.
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While I mostly agree with you, the problem is there are also people on the receiving end who won't be as reasonable, and laws like this make it worryingly easy for them to ruin your life for showing a bit of innocent interest
 
Fabricating a rape claim is tricky without physical evidence, although many women have attempted such acts of vindictiveness, but claims of inappropriate whistling or of a remark deemed potentially offensive are much more easily flung out in a moment of retribution, frustration, jealousy or anger.

Will inappropriate facial expressions be next to legislated against?

These onerous laws against any banter or risque compliment are the mental equivalent of the de-beaking and de-spurring of battery hens, an attempt to bring unnatural overcrowding and incompatible cultural mixing under government control rather than fix the real issues.
 
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wesimmo said:
A general rule of thumb would be, if this legislation bothers you, you're not a reasonable person.
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The legal test of a "reasonable person" that someone suggested I look up is claimed to be an objective test, whilst in reality any such metric is highly subjective. The test in tort was devised as a test of the actions of the perpetrator, but its now seemingly shifted to the belief of the recipient.
 
Haggisman said:
While I mostly agree with you, the problem is there are also people on the receiving end who won't be as reasonable, and laws like this make it worryingly easy for them to ruin your life for showing a bit of innocent interest
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Of course there's crazies on both sides, the same can happen with false rape claims, but that doesn't mean you'd not have laws against rape. I don't see the issue myself, as part of harassment is the sustained action, not just a one off advance, as certain people are trying to frame it ITT

And I know all about what a crazy can do, as I dodged a bullet from a previous gf! She went full on with the next guy who fell into her trap, accusations of abuse, coercive control etc etc, it ended up in crown court, where I submitted evidence in support of the accused explaining her irrational and unreasonable behaviour in our relationship. The judge saw right through her, tore her to shreds and threw the case out.

So yes, people will always abuse laws but they are a minority compared to the genuine cases.
 
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Freakbro said:
So yes, people will always abuse laws but they are a minority compared to the genuine cases.
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Absolutely, like I said, I do agree, but the fact it's extremely rare is of little solace if you're unlucky enough to be the 1 in 10,000 who falls victim to it. Saying you have nothing to worry about if you're a "reasonable person" is a little naive, since there's always that chance (however slim)
 
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wesimmo said:
A general rule of thumb would be, if this legislation bothers you, you're not a reasonable person.
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It takes two to be reasonable.

I have seen plenty of innocent people fall foul of the law because the other person was not reasonable.

I get that men can be a pain at times, but then men are traditionally the ones who make the first steps in a relationship. There are very genuine young lads who will make mistakes. The last thing you want is for them to be terrified to make any attempt.
 
SpellowHouse said:
I get that men can be a pain at times, but then men are traditionally the ones who make the first steps in a relationship. There are very genuine young lads who will make mistakes. The last thing you want is for them to be terrified to make any attempt.
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They won't be.

The bit that you are missing is that harassment is behaviour that happens on more than one occasion. This isn't about someone making an unwanted advance and it being rejected, it's when that person doesn't accept the rejection and persists with unwanted behaviour.
 
Freakbro said:
The bit that you are missing is that harassment is behaviour that happens on more than one occasion. This isn't about someone making an unwanted advance and it being rejected, it's when that person doesn't accept the rejection and persists with unwanted behaviour.
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You assume that all men are mentally sound and know exactly what they are doing.
 
Freakbro said:
Not sure where you're going with this....

"Please excuse my harassing and unreasonable behaviour because I'm not of sound mind"?

Sure, we take that into account with a stay in an institution rather than a prison ;)
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You can be so delusional you don’t even realize your behavior is harassing or unreasonable and yes a stay in a mental institution is a better option than prison.
 
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Freakbro said:
They won't be.

The bit that you are missing is that harassment is behaviour that happens on more than one occasion. This isn't about someone making an unwanted advance and it being rejected, it's when that person doesn't accept the rejection and persists with unwanted behaviour.
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The bill also says "cause alarm or distress", telling some woman she has a nice backside could elicit a beaming smile or could result in her claiming she now suffers nightmares and is afraid to leave the house. Mark my words if this bill passes there will be plenty of ultra feminists adding it gleefully to their arsenal of weapons.
 
Another sweeping law designed to target what is probably a fraction of interactions that could use existing legislation to combat.

Instead new laws make everything even more awkward and probably will make normal people even more reticent about normal interactions.

Lots of other laws lead to apocryphal rumours that never actually happened this law could provoke the same again. Hushed stories of how a man got a record for chatting to lady in a bar and now lost his job in XYZ.

And honestly I think 99% of men are usually gentlemen and know how to conduct themselves. They don't go cat calling, float around being pests etc. And I think the ones that do are not going to stop at the law. Or even more cynically ;) the police will be more afraid of offending their rights depending on their background and culture.

But overall I find this thread quite depressing as several names I recognise as being slightly older and thus assume they've already had a life of "normal" interactions in which they have rightly had no fear about such laws.... and now don't seem to care about what happens to the future generations.
 
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