Hitler: Substance to the views?

Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact. USSR was completely unprepared for war. How can hitler could have thought that soviets would attack germany if soviets were not prepared for war.


And for most of the Cold war the Americans thought that the Russians were far ahead of them ("Missile Gap"). Turns out that the US was far ahead the whole time. What you believe and what is true are often miles apart. And while the idea that the world was run by a cabal of Jewish bankers was widespread after WW1 (much pulp British literature deals with it), there's no evidence it was true: it was just the same centuries-old anti-Semitism with a new slant.


M
 
I am half way through a book called 'The rise and fall of the third reich' this is a really interesting book but it is a bit of a read but very very worth it.


While it does have some unique insights (the author was there at the time), it is now rather dated, and some of what he says now turns out to be wrong.


M
 
I have spent the last ten years reading everything I can about Hitler trying to find answers and the conclusion I keep coming too is quite frightening.

He was in a nutshell "boring". A teetotal, vegetarian, loner, who had extreme views and due to the times he lived through managed to gain power. He had massive megalomania of course but it's scary how such an banal person managed so much destruction.

He was a great actor as well and the best book I have read about Hitler is the one written by Albert Speer, the only person that maybe could be called Hitlers friend.

The other aspect that people often overlook is the snowball effect. I do not believe Hitler set out to physically kill all the Jews but it just got out of hand if you see what I mean. Through his style of leadership his subordinates would try and out do each other and that is the result of the holocaust. Hitler was ultimately responsible as he sowed the seeds.

Fascinating subject.
 
he was evil..he was happy to send children to their deaths as his manpower began to dwindle..only and insane man would do this

and I know under age troops have volunteered to get into the trenches or into the navy in wartime..but they were never conscripted en masse

and sane men negotiate when there is no hope for the good of their country..hitler led germany to utter destruction when it was inevitable that the war was lost, but insted of doing something about it he hid in a bunker and hoped it would all go away
 
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I often wonder, if you were to take a random person off the street, put them in the same position of power as Hitler, with the same political and economic climates and so on, would we be looking back at them as being just as evil.

Without being mean, the average person is an idiot and I'd imagine all the ass-kissing and boundless power would go straight to their heads. Whether they would slaughter millions depends on what's whispered into their ears by men working behind the scenes.
 
Tbh, I always just assumed hitler was a figurehead for blame rather than 'evil'. I mean, I imagine most world leaders are blamed for things that were actually the machinations and decisions of people technically below them.

Not that I'm being sympathetic here, don't get me wrong. :D

He is absolutely a figurehead that basic historical analysis blames for the atrocities. Large numbers of Germans were Hitler's willing executioners, it's also incredible how Austria seems to have escaped a lot of the blame, how swiftly Europe has forgotten. The NSDAP had support from various countries, even France had its fair share of NSDAP sympathisers yet collective memory tends to look upon how amazing and rebellious the French resistance was, when in reality it was a minority.
 
Some of his views had some groundings - that the Jews were heavily involved in the financial businesses. Given that Germany was so heavily indebted and unlikely to recover due to hyperinflation, he could use these simple facts to cleverly play on the minds of a largely disaffected and unhappy population. Hitler was a great many things; one of his more positive - if you can call it that - aspects was his incredible skill as an orator.
 
Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact. USSR was completely unprepared for war. How can hitler could have thought that soviets would attack germany if soviets were not prepared for war. Stalin was gobsmacked, he could not believe hitler invaded ussr.

I believe that once Germany declared war on the USSR Stalin allegedly sulked/cried in his room for several days, much like Hitler did when Britain declared war on Germany.

It's quite incredible that Germany went to war with the USSR, you would've thought that Hitler would've learnt from Napoleon not to mess with the motherland!
 
I think people shouldn't forget that Hitler didn't kill a single person (as far as I know), it was soldiers who killed all the Jews, gypsies etc. Yes he was an evil person, but everyone who killed all those millions of innocent people had a choice, and they chose to murder. People tend to focus on the dictators as being some sort of evil force wiping out thousands/millions of people, but it's just people killing people because someone in a position of authority told them to. I'm sure most people know about the studies regarding this like the famous "prison" experiment in the 70s I think.

I think it is in the nature of humans that when there are no consequences to our actions, we will do whatever we want, which is usually evil actions. Especially in wartime, after your first few kills I think life becomes worthless. The only reason it doesn't spiral out of control in modern western armies is that soldiers can be prosecuted for "misbehaving", but even so, they still do terrible things (eg. Americans torturing Iraqis, murdering civilians, raping).

Also, I think it's common for us to want to blame a specific evil thing for human actions - in the Bible it's Satan, and historically it's dictators.
 
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The anti-Jewish sentiments had a lot to do with the Jewish takeover of Russia and the implementation and export of genocidal communism. Also the Jews represented much of the economic and political elite who extorted Germany at Versailles.

OP - read this book. It will be a revelation.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/36253652/Jewish-Supremacism-by-David-Duke

David Duke, that well known exponent of goodwill to mankind.
Just another perpetrator of crackpot ideas, if you think his book is a "revelation" then I'm sorry for you.
 
And for most of the Cold war the Americans thought that the Russians were far ahead of them ("Missile Gap"). Turns out that the US was far ahead the whole time. What you believe and what is true are often miles apart. And while the idea that the world was run by a cabal of Jewish bankers was widespread after WW1 (much pulp British literature deals with it), there's no evidence it was true: it was just the same centuries-old anti-Semitism with a new slant.


M

My point was that hitler was always going to attack russia, it was not because he though russia would attack and he had no choice. Timing on the other hand was because of poor intelligence. Point being he couldn't have been sane thinking he could take on russia :p

and yes hitler thought russia was controlled by jewish elit. Still his grand plan was to wipe out most people in russia to provide living space for his aryian nation
 
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David Duke, that well known exponent of goodwill to mankind.
Just another perpetrator of crackpot ideas, if you think his book is a "revelation" then I'm sorry for you.



I take it that you've not seen Ivan Drago's posts here before then?


M
 
He was a great actor as well and the best book I have read about Hitler is the one written by Albert Speer, the only person that maybe could be called Hitlers friend.
Many people discount everything Speer says purely because Speer lied about his knowledge of the holocaust.
 
Psychology has spent the entirety of the post-war era addressing just this. For example, right in the aftermath of WWII Adorno et al. began researching authoritarianism and fascism (which is where the F-scale, or Potential for Fascism Scale, originated) amongst the general population.

It was found that, regardless of background and culture, a frighteningly high proportion of randomly selected participants scored highly on the f-scale and tended toward ethnocentrism. While the implications of this have been re-dissected and discussed greatly over the years (and further improvements and conclusions made) the fact remains that as a society we tend to want to isolate such individuals (Hitler, Mao, Myra Hindley) as 'monsters'; something unique and alien to the rest of humanity.

Unfortunately, research bears out that given appropriate environmental and cultural backing (for example an authoritarian ethnocentric upbringing, cultural acceptance etc) that many of us are equally capable of such atrocity. Stanley Milgram's research in this area, especially, confirms this latent streak amongst the general population in a willingness to follow orders and impose pain and punishment to fatal levels simply upon pressure of instruction.

Frightening revelation, but an important one nonetheless as it's only by understanding and confronting our true selves that we can shape and improve our behaviours.

I don't know much about Naziism per se (aside from its fascistic root) but I thought this might provide an interesting aside for you on the matter. :)

Yeah thanks :D
 
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