Holiday Pay System vs. Time and a Half

The Halk said:
I didn't say I wasn't wrong. I'm barely wrong though. It's clear what I meant unless you're intentionally trying to find fault.

You're nitpicking to score internet points.

They're entitled to the equivalent of 28 days holiday, pro rata - which as you've said is easiest calculated by 5.6 weeks.
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No, I'm nitpicking because I've seen enough employees come screaming about their 'rights' and making fools of themselves in the workplace because of bad advice/information given out on the internet about employment law. You stated, without caveats, that

You're entitled to 28 days paid leave a year. The whole calculation they're doing is to work out how much they pay you during that point.
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Which is just plain incorrect. You also advised the OP that you thought the way his holiday was being accrued was against the law, which is also incorrect.

The working time directive, which contains the statutory requirements for annual leave, makes absolutely no mention of days whatsoever, it explicitly refers to the entitlement in weeks only. Now, it may seem a small thing, but if someone hadn't been there to clarify the entitlement to the OP, it could have led to unnecessary mistakes or confrontation with his employer for no good reason.

If you're going to give someone advice about their legal entitlements, you have to be spot on about it.
 
Lunawolfy said:
So to summarise working 1100h over a year meant that I was entitled to 5.5weeks of leave where I was paid my average work (3x8h shifts according to Dolphs maths) which at £5.37p/h means I have 5.5weeks of leave earning £128.88 a week?

When is the cutoff for leave?
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Back when I worked for the company concerned, the holiday year ran April to April, but best to check on the current situation.

But yeah, that's pretty much the long and short of it :)
 
Dolph said:
Back when I worked for the company concerned, the holiday year ran April to April, but best to check on the current situation.

But yeah, that's pretty much the long and short of it :)
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So if it ended with the financial year I'd have nothing now?
 
Dolph said:
No, I'm nitpicking because I've seen enough employees come screaming about their 'rights' and making fools of themselves in the workplace because of bad advice/information given out on the internet about employment law. You stated, without caveats, that



Which is just plain incorrect. You also advised the OP that you thought the way his holiday was being accrued was against the law, which is also incorrect.

The working time directive, which contains the statutory requirements for annual leave, makes absolutely no mention of days whatsoever, it explicitly refers to the entitlement in weeks only. Now, it may seem a small thing, but if someone hadn't been there to clarify the entitlement to the OP, it could have led to unnecessary mistakes or confrontation with his employer for no good reason.

If you're going to give someone advice about their legal entitlements, you have to be spot on about it.
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Ok Dolph.

When I give advice in a professional way I am paid for it, my client knows they are paying for it, and I am liable for any mistakes I make.

When I try to help people on an internet forum I am doing so in my leisure time with a reasonable degree of care, but not meticulous, and to the best of my knowledge.

It had already been established in the thread that the 28 days was for a full time employee, and he'd get pro-rata. I would have been more accurate to say 5.6 weeks, but I said 28 days, and I knew what I meant - I think everybody knew what I meant but as you said you were nitpicking.

Can you show me where "You also advised the OP that you thought the way his holiday was being accrued was against the law, which is also incorrect."

Also can you show me how you know the franchisee is calculating it correctly? Given that you don't have the faintest idea if he is or not because all we have is a vague understanding from the OP.
 
The Halk said:
Ok Dolph.

When I give advice in a professional way I am paid for it, my client knows they are paying for it, and I am liable for any mistakes I make.

When I try to help people on an internet forum I am doing so in my leisure time with a reasonable degree of care, but not meticulous, and to the best of my knowledge.

It had already been established in the thread that the 28 days was for a full time employee, and he'd get pro-rata. I would have been more accurate to say 5.6 weeks, but I said 28 days, and I knew what I meant - I think everybody knew what I meant but as you said you were nitpicking.

Can you show me where "You also advised the OP that you thought the way his holiday was being accrued was against the law, which is also incorrect."

Also can you show me how you know the franchisee is calculating it correctly? Given that you don't have the faintest idea if he is or not because all we have is a vague understanding from the OP.
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Post #10 for the holiday accrual point.

And to be honest, we don't know yet if the employer is calculating it right, because all we have is a theoretical calculation of what it should be (although with a wage of £5.37, then adding around 5p per hour is in the right ballpark for the 12% entitlement).

Sorry if I jumped you a bit, poor/unclear employment advice is one of my pet peeves, I've just seen it cause so many problems, more often than not for the employee rather than anything else.
 
Dolph said:
Post #10 for the holiday accrual point.

And to be honest, we don't know yet if the employer is calculating it right, because all we have is a theoretical calculation of what it should be (although with a wage of £5.37, then adding around 5p per hour is in the right ballpark for the 12% entitlement).

Sorry if I jumped you a bit, poor/unclear employment advice is one of my pet peeves, I've just seen it cause so many problems, more often than not for the employee rather than anything else.
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Fair enough - I felt jumped which is why I got defensive. If it looked like I was trying to indicate they had got it wrong.. then I wasn't - I even said in the post that I was unsure.
 
I am under the impression that the whole 5p per hour is in place of the time and a half system. Not as a means to calculate holiday entitlement.
 
I'm at a loss to how they're doing that then... did they drop all the time and a half pay and instead give everybody a 5p an hour pay rise? That's all I can guess.
 
The Halk said:
Yes, which happens to be 28 days.

They decided to have 28 days for someone who works 5 days a week, and put that into weeks so that it could be applied to everybody, which is 5.6 weeks.

I don't think someone who works 1 day a week is going to say "Oh goodie, 28 weeks holiday!" :p
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You're missing the point.....the 28 days (for 5 day/wk workers) is derived from the 5.6 weeks, not the other way around......whether you work 1 day a week or 6 days a week, you are still entitled to 5.6 weeks......:)
 
So apparently I'm payed that 5p per hour worked as a replacement of my payed leave.

My dreadful flat rate wage is just because they can :(
 
Back in the early 90's i was paid the average of the previous 8 weeks pay for holiday pay. Luckly as training squad and my stint in High wycombe while at Uni saw me earning more than some of the floor managers when i returned home to Burnley. £3.55 ph i was living the high life, i tell you ! :rolleyes:
 
I will tell you that companys like Mcdonalds dont like the minimum wage becuase they have to pay there staff it. It means they just have less staff working when the store is less busy and if you get a rush on you get royaly screwed over becuase there isnt enough staff to do the basics at least thats it in my experience.

I have to also add that every store is different some are better run than others. I know that when I started I used to get incentive pay for working after 7pm and then again after midnight but that stopped after a while as it seems has the incentive of working on a bank holiday that used to be double pay.
 
Lunawolfy said:
I've been told by one of the managers over FB that is what your holiday pay is for. However Its never had £600 in it :S
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You have to take at least 4 weeks of holiday (the rest can e carried over or paid in lieu).....that is actually taking time off paid at various (normally weekly/fortnightly periods through the year). They cannot simply pay you an enhanced hourly rate in lieu of this....If it is McDs that you work for, I doubt that this is happening and there is some confusion on how you are explaining things....

You are entitled to be paid during your statutory annual leave and contractual annual leave. Your holiday pay will be your normal weekly wage (excluding non-guaranteed overtime). If your pay varies from week to week, your holiday pay should be your average weekly wage over the previous*12 weeks.....[...].....Holiday pay should be paid for the time when you actually take your holiday. Your employer cannot include an amount for holiday pay in your hourly rate (called 'rolled-up holiday pay'). If your current contract still includes rolled-up pay, you and your employer should renegotiate it.
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I am paid an extra 5p per hour which goes into my holiday pay, which McDs hold onto until I ask for it out.

Any time I ask for leave it is always unpaid, I was always told we don't get paid leave and that is the purpose of the holiday pay.
 
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