Ah so we're not all in this together, we can **** the young (well, FTB are now almost in their 40s you know!!) just be sure to protect those already on the ladder.
House prices rose 7.3% this year, average now almost £250k
- Thread starter HACO
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You should protest like BLM
Serious question: how many more yearly 7% prices rises (or more) can we take?
I mean we can price all but the top 5% out of being FTB if we want. Just let the foreign owners have it all. And the BTL landlords.
Let them have all the housing. Make every future generation a rental slave.
Why not, eh? Sounds like fun. Let's have peasants, serfs and robber barons again. Let's go feudal. **** the serfs.
E: And in case you think I'm joking... why not? We've let foreign owners buy all our infrastructure. We let foreign train companies subsidise their domestic market by bleeding UK customers dry. We've let foreign state-owned energy companies take over UK suppliers. It's the raw capitalism everybody loves.
If we see gains in the next 10 years similar to those in the last 10 years, the median home will be £425k and average FTB age will go above 50 years old.
Another 10 years of that and the only path to home ownership becomes inheritance. A return to feudalism.
It's already happening. Any country that has a sovereign wealth fund heavily invests in the UK residential property market.
Our commuters subsidise train tickets of other countries.
Our bill payers subsidise utility bills of other countries.
Our renters subsidise housing/welfare of other countries.
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This is great! It means we're not becoming communists!
So long as we're subsidising other countries and not our own people, we're good old-fashioned capitalists.
Soldato
I'm not sure how a "correction" could work. If prices dropped and put loads of owners into negative equity, they would just stay where they are and not sell resulting in a drop in supply.
The only people selling would be people that really need to sell.
The only people selling would be people that really need to sell.
Soldato
And prices would go up. LOL?
Nar, makes us simps
Caporegime
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Well why not for one moment step back and think about all the wealth Britain and it's people stole to enrich themselves back in the day from foreigners.
It wasn't even that long ago that Britain stole £3.5 trillion from India and enslaved it's people some of which to this very day are still enslaved on tea plantations as well as massacring many innocent lives.
Now you are complaining about foreign investors profiting from British people legally.
Deal with it. That's your motto when it comes to taxation and changes in legislation for landlords. Yet you cannot deal with the truth.
I'd like to see how you would deal with a foreigner coming over here and saying you know what you can no longer live here. You need to go live in Newcastle but you have to move right now and be gone by tomorrow.
That's what happened to my grandad in the partition. The British ruled where he lived was now to belong to the Muslims and be called Pakistan. His family would now be forced to emigrate to India under extremely dangerous conditions where many were robbed and murdered. My grandad who's still alive today was a child when this happened and he still remembers it.
His family (my family) had their land, their home taken from them by the British.
But please do continue your sob story about how it's so much harder for you and my grandad had it so easy.
Last couple of months or so studio/1 bed flat type places have dropped quite a bit in price and supply has gone up with it - so I guess there have been a lot of people impacted by the current situation and moving back in with their parents and/or a partner, etc. on the other hand family sized homes, etc. have crept up even more - some quick checks on rightmove show around 8% increase.
You're letting some of your true colours shine through here.
How is it our generation's fault that the British Empire did some a) nasty and b) stupid things? It's not like other nations didn't do similarly regrettable things in the past. I'm afraid the entire history of human civilisation in *every* part of the Earth has been one of warfare, conquest, oppression, ethnic cleansing, and so on and so on.
We have to justify our own actions and make account for our own behaviours. Not our ancestors.
And besides, you're not the only one with immigrant grandparents. My own grandfather was Polish. Unless you have some gripe with the Poles too then how are modern-day Brits in any way responsible for what happened during partition?
Besides, I'm often a vocal critic of the UK govt and the **** it does in "our name". Often times and especially with the Tories I consider the UK govt to be the UK people's worst enemy
So we colonised India long ago so France, Germany and Italy should run our railways and energy grids now now? Not sure I follow your logic.
The country and environment I was born in is not that different to what you describe about your grandfather. I came here from thousands of miles away, at the age of 20 with £350 in cash and a university scholarship with very basic understanding of English.
I also don't believe I have compared my personal life with your grandad's, I obviously don't know him and would not make assumptions (that's what you do). Looks like he's been through a lot and I wish him nothing but the best.
You have to remember that roughly 50% of our population rent - although you wouldn't believe it from the government's housing policies!
If prices drop, a proportion of tenants will be able to buy. There'd be less demand for the rental sector which means rents will go down. Without being able to rinse their tenants for every last penny anymore, a lot of have-a-go landlords will sell (we can see this happening already). Thus you get more supply, and prices will drop more. The whole scenario will continue until we get rid of all of the over-leveraged amateur-hour landlords and are hopefully left with sensible ones in a decent rental sector (actually fit for purpose), and lower house prices to boot.
Soldato
Surely if prices drop then people just don't sell due to negative equity and so there's no liquidity and no houses for people to buy, landlords are also more likely to keep renting/buy up more cheap housing because yields will be much higher.
This isn't unlikely. Also, the larger institutions that invest in distressed assets have largely ignored residential real estate for years... they'll just flood into the market again and be able to outbid FTB'ers. As with most things, a correction won't solve a problem, it'll just result in distressed investors hoovering up more stock. The big PE funds are sat on something like ~$2tn in dry powder and there's very little for them to invest in at the moment.
Rent prices are tied to housing prices. As housing has been getting more expensive so rents have been increasing also.
It's hard to see why or how falling house prices would make rental yields higher..
Besides, non-commerical property (housing) is held by more than just home owner/occupiers. They are bought by all sorts of commercial concerns, including speculators and Russian oligarchs/Saudi wealth funds.
What a few of us are asking for is this kind of ownership of non-commercial property to be banned, as it is in other countries. So some property will be put onto the market as a result of this.
Also, the govt needs to allow councils to once again build housing and hold on to it (atm they are forced to sell what they build).
But it's all theoretical because the Tories are opposed to social housing (well, social *anything*) on principle. And MPs of all colours have a vested interest in as much as they are landlords themselves.
Residential property needs to be off limits for investors/commercial enterprises/foreign speculators/etc.
Residential property should be for domestic consumption only, as already seen in other countries.
Caporegime
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You're letting some of your true colours shine through here.
How is it our generation's fault that the British Empire did some a) nasty and b) stupid things? It's not like other nations didn't do similarly regrettable things in the past. I'm afraid the entire history of human civilisation in *every* part of the Earth has been one of warfare, conquest, oppression, ethnic cleansing, and so on and so on.
We have to justify our own actions and make account for our own behaviours. Not our ancestors.
And besides, you're not the only one with immigrant grandparents. My own grandfather was Polish. Unless you have some gripe with the Poles too then how are modern-day Brits in any way responsible for what happened during partition?
Besides, I'm often a vocal critic of the UK govt and the **** it does in "our name". Often times and especially with the Tories I consider the UK govt to be the UK people's worst enemy
You have said many times it was easy for my grandad.
I can assure you that the things that he and the rest of my family went through were far from the perfect scenario you imagine in your head.
I could go on an tell you more. There are some yeah who likley don't deserve what they have and got it by luck more than anything else. The Duke of Westminster inherited what £8 billion worth of property in London.
His family were given that land on the back of many lives being taken and land being stolen as his family helped their allies take the crown and the country many centuries ago.
We are talking true stolen wealth and slavery. People who adapted to keep that wealth forever.
Not every landlord is sitting on £8billion like he is. But that's what you imagine in your head every time you describe and talk about landlords. You want to tax them guess what will happen? Small landlords who cannot afford to hold property in trusts and manage them will sell up and these bigger landlords will swoop in and become even larger. What your wanting is Waterstones to die and Amazon to take over everything essentially.
The real issue is wages. Okay so house prices have went up. They have to with supply and demand. You cannot simply build enough homes and will never be able to.
Wages though at the bottom haven't risen at the levels it has at the top. Essentially majority of those folk are working for someone else PAYE. I know plenty of self employed who make a killing. People doing essentially what is really simple jobs but they made that job for themselves. To give an example a roofer or a CCTV and alarm installer. Guys making £500+ per day. So what the average person earns in a week they earn in a day and they have the option to work weekends too to. Being your own boss is usually the quickest way to get wealthy not working for someone else unless it's an extremely specialist role with specialist knowledge and skill. The roofer I know drives a lambo and lives in a large detached home with lots of land. He's made millions by developing a successful roofing company selling it to a big national company then starting again, rinse and repeat.
That's the problem with people who cannot afford to buy large homes in nice areas. They don't earn enough. If John the plumber, mechanic, electrician is earning £500 a day fixing problems they can easily afford to pay more.
Nobody earning an average wage should be able to afford a large home in the best areas because demand is massively more than it was 50 years ago.
The official population of the UK has risen what 20% in the past 40 years. A lot more people are single than back then, divorced, etc so where before you had more people living in homes now you have less therefore more homes needed for them as well as the increase in numbers overall. Then you have the unofficial population. Illegal immigrants who are here and there's loads of them. We don't know how many there are because they are hidden. Could be in the millions. Remember those boats crossing from France that's just a drop in the ocean compared to illegal immigration over the past 30 years.
What was the divorce rate and single occupancy rate in the 40's, 50's and 60's? Far lower than today.
Even basic jobs like police officers and nurses earn around £40k after a few years and it's minimal entry barriers to both professions. I'm talking about a police officer who passes their first test after a few years and the nurses who have to go to college or uni for a couple of years and do a basic course.
So you have certain professions which earn a lot more than average and those that never bothered to chase the money.
You also have folk earning good money in London complaining about the house prices yet it's the fact they live in London they earn so much in the first place. Same job elsewhere earns significantly less. For example an immigrant came to London saw a large independent cash and carry had a large car park but it was never full. He approached the cash and carry and said I'd like to rent a space in your car park right in the corner where the entrance is. He started a car wash and valet business there. He makes a killing. He's paying fellow Romanians £10 an hour yet charging folk £15 for 5-10 mins of work. You do the math when he has 4-6 cars at any one time being cleaned.
People who are working hard for themselves or chased money in certain professions can easily afford to live in expensive homes. Why because of how much they earn.
How much do you think a mechanic who runs an independent garage makes? Same with an independent joiner who fits kitchens or does loft conversions?
Essentially you cannot work a basic job for the man and expect to live in a mansion or in the best of areas. Again it's supply and demand and risk based.
Second hand car dealers make £2k per car and they buy cheap well below market rate on trade in and price them high. I know because when I traded in my last car I looked it up on their site and saw the mark up on how much I got and it was huge. I was surprised I thought there would only be a grand or £1500 in it but was more.
Basically it's far more complicated than landlords. Taxation won't help at all. Nothing is going to change. Ideally you need to increase your own earning potential. How do you do that? Well that's for you to figure out. Maybe try and become a landlord and see how easy it is as you seem to think it's all smoking cigars and drinking brandy on the family estate in between fox hunting and games of polo.
As haco would say deal with it. Don't hate the player hate the game. As with everything there are winners and losers. Losers tend to have a lottery mentality. As in losers think that buying a lottery ticket will make them become rich, it will just magically be handed to them on a plate. Winners have a can do attitude and will take proper risks for actual rewards. Essentially you only have yourself to blame for the choices you have made.
Nobody is going to give you a cheap large home in the best of areas. So it's best you buy whatever you can rather than crying about how hard you have it. Loads of people have had it much worse. Imagine being born in Africa, Asia, etc. You have access to great free education, access to great free healthcare, excellent roads and pavements, access to clean drinking water. Maybe you should take a trip and see how the other half live in Zimbabwe? Complaining that you shouldn't have to move 20 miles away to buy a cheaper home that isn't a mansion. It's entitled snow flake thinking and mentality.
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