If only she was armed.

The Gun Violence Archive, a not-for-profit organisation that compiles data on gun violence in the US, says 559 children aged 11 or under have been killed or injured in the United States in gun violence so far this year.
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WOW, that is absolutely shocking and ridiculous.
 
anything I don't mind said:
Violent crime per capita is actually higher in the UK and other countries that ban guns than the us.
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No it isn't.

The FBI defines a violent crime as one of four specific offences: murder and non-negligent manslaughter, forcible rape, robbery, and aggravated assault. The Home Office on the other hand, defines violent crime as all "crimes against the person" including simple assaults, all robberies and all sexual offences (the FBI only counts aggravated assaults and forcible rapes).

Puts the figures in perspective a bit doesn't?

anything I don't mind said:
UK approach works until there is a group of people running after you with a knife and you are not legally able to defend yourself. Too late then. Police always show up after crime is committed.
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Of course you can legally defend yourself! You are allowed to use reasonable force. I thought this was common knowledge?:confused:
 
Twirlywoos said:
There needs to be a revolution in America to ban these things. However we know how weak minded the general American population is. Look at the Arab spring, people who weren't afraid of death to get what they wanted.
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You don't understand the gun laws here.
 
shorttricky said:
It's a shame you didn't get any further than seeing "Harvard" in the links, or you would have spotted that they just cited other studies from journals. Let's not let the facts get in the way though, hey :rolleyes:

What about all the times some idiot waves a gun around "defending his property" illegally?

From your link:
The monsters. How dare they tell you exactly where they stand and where their funding goes. I'm sure the NRA is as transparent?

That's an interesting choice of studies there - you've picked a study that argues Obama is wrong because you can't prove causation from statistics, then picked a "study" (I'm being generous there) that uses statistics to show causation.

That's the heart of the argument. Fear. America is a scared child with a big stick, beating away at every shadow it can see.
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I responded to the harvard links by pointing out how they just redefine terms. Instead of looking at de-escalated incidents and counting incidents that never occurred because a gun was present. They twist that in to "intimidate intimates", absolute non sense.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_traffic-related_death_rate

Look at the traffic related incidents, many times greater than homicide rates, even more times greater than gun only related homicides. So it can be said that the risk associated with cars, is an accepted cost of still using cars. ie we should continue using cars because the utility and benefits outweighs the tragic cost of the negatives associated with them. The relative small amount of deaths as a result of guns is worth keeping them legal.

As you can see from this graph http://www.gunfacts.info/wp-content...Ownership-and-Homicides-Rates-per-Country.png

There is no evidence that gun ownership is correlated with homicide rates.
 
anything I don't mind said:
I responded to the harvard links by pointing out how they just redefine terms. Instead of looking at de-escalated incidents and counting incidents that never occurred because a gun was present. They twist that in to "intimidate intimates", absolute non sense.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_traffic-related_death_rate

Look at the traffic related incidents, many times greater than homicide rates, even more times greater than gun only related homicides. So it can be said that the risk associated with cars, is an accepted cost of still using cars. ie we should continue using cars because the utility and benefits outweighs the tragic cost of the negatives associated with them. The relative small amount of deaths as a result of guns is worth keeping them legal.

As you can see from this graph http://www.gunfacts.info/wp-content...Ownership-and-Homicides-Rates-per-Country.png

There is no evidence that gun ownership is correlated with homicide rates.
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Cars however, have practical utility that has many benefits. Guns have no utility for most people outside of entertainment. If cars only had entertainment benefit we'd probably ban them.
 
enkoda said:
No it isn't.

The FBI defines a violent crime as one of four specific offences: murder and non-negligent manslaughter, forcible rape, robbery, and aggravated assault. The Home Office on the other hand, defines violent crime as all "crimes against the person" including simple assaults, all robberies and all sexual offences (the FBI only counts aggravated assaults and forcible rapes).

Puts the figures in perspective a bit doesn't?



Of course you can legally defend yourself! You are allowed to use reasonable force. I thought this was common knowledge?:confused:
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How will you defend yourself when someone has a knife or a gun?
 
Burnsy2023 said:
Cars however, have practical utility that has many benefits. Guns have no utility for most people outside of entertainment. If cars only had entertainment benefit we'd probably ban them.
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Guns have utility, they can defend yourself from criminals and protect your family. They can also be used to prevent government from becoming genocidal. They can also be used for sport and entertainment. Also zombie apocalypse. If we had zombie situation in the UK, we would be destroyed. Nothing but blunt butter knives.

I agree if the government could get away with banning cars they would.

What about knives? they obviously have utility outside of violence but that didn't stop the government from banning them. Now you can get in trouble for carrying a knife, even if its for protection or for fishing.
 
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anything I don't mind said:
What about knives? they obviously have utility outside of violence but that didn't stop the government from banning them. Now you can get in trouble for carrying a knife, even if its for protection or for fishing.
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I carry knives all the time when i go fishing. As long as the knife complies with the law, you are fine.

-It must be for good reason
-It must be 3" or less
-It must not be able to lock unfolded if the blade can be hidden away

One of the lakes i bailiff for is next to a huge Samsung office building and has officers regularly patrol the area. They often check whether the fisherman have anything they shouldn't have on them and openly ask if you have any knives on you. I usually show them everything i have and they say that it is fine. One of my knives have a cross guard, serrated edge with a mean bladed hook on the end and they don't even bat an eyelid at it, as its clearly for fishing.

If you have received trouble for having a knife while fishing while upholding the current knife laws, then it was wrongful and the police officer was acting outside the law by confiscating it.
 
anything I don't mind said:
What about knives? they obviously have utility outside of violence but that didn't stop the government from banning them. Now you can get in trouble for carrying a knife, even if its for protection or for fishing.
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You can carry a knife if you have a reasonable excuse - going fishing being a perfectly good reason.

You don't need a knife for protection if you're not in a gang and if you are, you shouldn't have one anyway.
 
Avenged7Fold said:
I carry knives all the time when i go fishing. As long as the knife complies with the law, you are fine.

-It must be for good reason
-It must be 3" or less
-It must not be able to lock unfolded if the blade can be hidden away

One of the lakes i bailiff for is next to a huge Samsung office building and has officers regularly patrol the area. They often check whether the fisherman have anything they shouldn't have on them and openly ask if you have any knives on you. I usually show them everything i have and they say that it is fine. One of my knives have a cross guard, serrated edge with a mean bladed hook on the end and they don't even bat an eyelid at it, as its clearly for fishing.

If you have received trouble for having a knife while fishing while upholding the current knife laws, then it was wrongful and the police officer was acting outside the law by confiscating it.
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Once the right to bare arms (guns, knives) is taken away it is next to impossible to get back. It took in some instances 100s of years of struggle for our ancestors to get the right to defend themselves. Often at times of peace it appears logical that we would be better off without weapons. Unfortunately it is not for times of peace that we need those rights, it is times when the government turns bad or we have internal strife and problems. The first thing the government does when anything happens is sort out their own. Look at Fema and katrina situation. The government is not going to be there when a big problem occurs, they will be defending their own buildings and the buildings of the rich. They won't be stopping looting and other violence. What happens in 300 years time when the EU decides it wants to take over completely and what is left of sovereign states have to try and defend their home lands or be put to work? It is very naive to think that anyone can rely on the government and police for their safety. Sure right now it seems unlikely, it always does.
 
Burnsy2023 said:
You can carry a knife if you have a reasonable excuse - going fishing being a perfectly good reason.

You don't need a knife for protection if you're not in a gang and if you are, you shouldn't have one anyway.
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Well you can tell that to all the innocent people stabbed that are not in gangs? like the guy on the bus? Criminals don't follow the knife and gun bans.

When was the last time someone in texas was stabbed for opening a window on a bus?
 
anything I don't mind said:
Well you can tell that to all the innocent people stabbed that are not in gangs? like the guy on the bus? Criminals don't follow the knife and gun bans.

When was the last time someone in texas was stabbed for opening a window on a bus?
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Not sure how guns or more knives would solve such problems: murder rate in the US generally (and including Texas specifically) is much higher than the UK - that's with guns and by other means.
 
anything I don't mind said:
Criminals don't follow the knife and gun bans.

When was the last time someone in texas was stabbed for opening a window on a bus?
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Criminals have guns here also, we do just fine avoiding getting shot without needing access to heavy weaponry.

Most of these US shootings are with legally held firearms, the case for defending oneself wouldn't exist if these weapons were not in circulation in the first place.

Your strawmen arguments are invalid. You can't claim you need guns to defend yourself from violent crime, when the death rate is massively lower here. School shootings are not frequent here, and hopefully we won't proliferate weapons until they are.
 
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