If you were Merc negotiating Hamilton's next contract
- Thread starter rubberduck
- Start date
- Status
Soldato
Which part of "You can't compare 30 years ago to now" did you not understand?
@Stumble Bum You keep dodging the questions asked of you and you brush off the answers provided.
Why haven't Merc taken the chance to get and of the out of contract drivers in?
Why do you think Merc choose to pay Hamilton what they do?
This isnt a case of Merc could pay £10m if they want to, you could blanket say that about any other team and driver. You seem to have a massive burning hate for why Hamilton gets paid this much, but not care about the fact the other teams pay over drivers almost as much, or more (Vettel at Ferrari) without issue.
As for the reason why his contract has expired we have no clue. We can guess based on what both sides have said. Hamilton wants more involvement, maybe even a stake in the team, to be able to steer it in a direction of sustainability that he clearly champions. Ineos coming on board as well will be getting more heavily involved in the contract talks given they are now 30% owners. Also there are things to consider like the scale of the deal and how it can be seen by the outside world etc.
It really would not suprise me if Hamiltons new contract does actually pay him less then he currently gets, but there are elements to it like team stake etc. Thats a lot more complicated to complete then 3 years at £XXm per year.
Mercedes wont pay Hamilton £10m per year as his only renumberation. Never going to happen.
Why haven't Merc taken the chance to get and of the out of contract drivers in?
Why do you think Merc choose to pay Hamilton what they do?
This isnt a case of Merc could pay £10m if they want to, you could blanket say that about any other team and driver. You seem to have a massive burning hate for why Hamilton gets paid this much, but not care about the fact the other teams pay over drivers almost as much, or more (Vettel at Ferrari) without issue.
As for the reason why his contract has expired we have no clue. We can guess based on what both sides have said. Hamilton wants more involvement, maybe even a stake in the team, to be able to steer it in a direction of sustainability that he clearly champions. Ineos coming on board as well will be getting more heavily involved in the contract talks given they are now 30% owners. Also there are things to consider like the scale of the deal and how it can be seen by the outside world etc.
It really would not suprise me if Hamiltons new contract does actually pay him less then he currently gets, but there are elements to it like team stake etc. Thats a lot more complicated to complete then 3 years at £XXm per year.
Mercedes wont pay Hamilton £10m per year as his only renumberation. Never going to happen.
Agreed. I don't think it's purely money which is causing the delay but other things. I wouldn't be surprised if he wants a stake in Mercedes-AMG F1 and/or wants them to be partly involved in his Extreme-E project or things like PR duties/getting to keep his WDC winning cars and so on
But that's what you tried to do, saying Senna would drive for free. So i just pointed out that actually he demanded a very high amount of money relative to the highest paid drivers of today, and 1994 he was on similar amount when he moved to the best team on the grid.
- Joined
- 8 Feb 2004
- Posts
- 4,539
Almost all all of which revolve around money either directly or indirectly.
In F1 what doesn't revolve around money directly or indirectly?
Soldato
No I didn't. Let's make it clear in small words and short sentences.
The commercial side of F1 is much different. There's no tobacco money being dispensed liberally. Here's a suitcase of money for putting this sticker on your car disappeared 20 years ago. There's commercial partnerships everywhere down the grid.
An F1 driver is still an F1 driver. They want to win races above all else. They live in Monaco to minimise taxes, like to party in private and the nice trappings of life.
Senna presented himself two options for 1993 :
1) Drive the best package for no salary
2) Drive another less competitive package, but demand $1m a race if option 1 isn't available.
Like Senna, Hamilton wants to win. Mercedes have the best package.
Last edited:
- Joined
- 8 Feb 2004
- Posts
- 4,539
Certainly not Lewis Hamilton!!!!
No need to be an ass fella.
The whole conversation is about drivers salary, you comment that Senna offered to drive for free, i counter and point out he didnt drive for free, and that situation never materialised. There was also more to that story and that is Senna offered to drive the Williams and Williams wouldnt have to pay him, but Senna would keep all the sponsor and image rights...Like that was going to earn him no money at all, and not affect Williams to the same degree or greater then a large Salary????
You really need to go back over the relative money spent in F1 and understand that the "liberally dispensed tobacco money" really wasnt endless suitcases full of limitless money. It was less in relative terms then today.
Also saying that this money disappeared 20 years ago, do you even watch F1 any more?? BAT have heavy sponsorship on the Mclaren, while Phillip Morris have been blocking out the Ferrari's for decades and still do.....
No top driver has ever seriously offered to drive any top car for free, and been in a position (ie out of contract etc) and done it, so why anyone thinks thats going to happen now, with the Merc is hilarious.
- Joined
- 8 Feb 2004
- Posts
- 4,539
Can someone complain about him being a tax exile too so we can complete the Hamilton bingo card?
Soldato
That ship sailed with your attitude from mid-afternoon yesterday.
I'll ignore the middle bit - already covered in previous replies.
I never suggested he should drive for free. I suggested that sticking out for $40m a year is excessive.
I was never rude to you in any of my replies. I responded to your points with counterpoints that you either blanket ignore or brush off.
So my attitude, as you put it, never warranted your sarcasm.
Again brushing it off so it fits with your narrative when actually the situation is very different to what you've made it out to be. You brought to the conversation that Senna offered to drive for free, that wasn't the full picture, he offered to drive for rights to sponsorships and images, likely worth significantly more to him then he got from McLaren that year. So Senna offering to drive for "free" actually being Senna offering to drive for effectively the equivalent sum people are throwing around about Hamilton today, is a very very different outcome that you are willingly ignoring.
You also keep bringing up the limitless tobacco money, and I keep urging you to relook at it, it wasn't limitless and it is less money then by todays standards that teams get from sponsors.
Also tobacco money is still very much in F1 today, so not much has changed, except the formality around it, but that's changed in all aspects of life, not just F1.
Seeing as I've asked this of others, ill ask it of you, why is $40m for Hamilton excessive, but for apparent lesser drivers based on stats, exposure, and demand, similar amounts are acceptable?
Also the only source of the $40m per year is media rumour, with both sides involved in the conversation categorically saying that figure has not come from them, so why are we so attached to it, and think that it is the sticking point?
Ive suggested other things that are more likely sticking points that are delaying things, which are a far more interesting converstation then "HaMiLtOn Is GrEeDy MeRc ShOuLd HiRe AnYoNe ElSe FoR FrEe ORRRMMMAAAGGGOOODDDD" (this last bit not aimed at you but basically what others are trying to say...)
Soldato
I'd honestly just offer him something comparable to the rest with the major benefit being he has a seat in a championship winning car. Don't like it? Hello George.
Other sports are cutting down expenditure. Daimler made big losses. Deciding that you need that amount per year to inevitably beat your less talented teammate and get an 8th WDC? I don't like it.
Other sports are cutting down expenditure. Daimler made big losses. Deciding that you need that amount per year to inevitably beat your less talented teammate and get an 8th WDC? I don't like it.
Soldato
What do you think Russell has been doing at Williams?
Don't forget that Russell has a 10 year contract with Merc\Wolf
Learning his craft? But he has still had a few mistakes (which is to be expected of someone in only their 2nd year) which aren't too bad when you're in a Williams but can you imagine how happy Mercedes would be if he binned it under the safety car, binned it into the pit entrance and got caught napping at a restart and caused a huge crash (though you can argue he wouldn't be at the back of the grid and wouldn't have been in an issue such as that)
Exactly. Russell has his whole career to get into the #1 seat, why rush it? If I was Toto this would be Bottas' last year in the team and I'd give Russell the seat alongside Lewis in 2022. It gives Russell a chance to get used to the team without having the pressure of being expected to lead and allows him to learn a few tricks of off Lewis. It benefits everyone and then by the time Lewis leaves George will have a nice few years under his belt.
There's been quite a few times over the last few years where it was Lewis' experience that got them the W. They'd be foolish to lose that.
Just look back at the Turkish GP. George didn't have the necessary experience to know going into the pitlane at that point in the race was a bad call. He just accepted the strategy and he ended up crashing in the pitlane entrance. Lewis had the exact same order but challenged it and said it wasn't worth the risk and that he'd manage it - experience allowed him to do that and it won them the race that day.
George will get his time soon enough.
Russell has also tested with Mercedes and been on par with both Bottas and Hamilton when he’s been measured against them. The team knows him and knows his level of feedback. It speaks volumes that they wanted George rather than Stoffel. It was a test of sorts and George scored A+ IMO. Without the rear slow puncture he’d still have won the race. He was catching Perez at seconds per lap.
Soldato
Next you will be saying that Leclerc isn't that good.
Or what about Max when he first came in?
Your just against anyone taking over from Hamilton.
- Status