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Intel has a Pretty Big Problem..
- Thread starter Purgatory
- Start date
They have gone up since. Board prices also went up, got mine for £180, now it's £230 in same place...
Are you sure you have the correct first vowel in your username?!
But with failure at anything from 3% to 30%, getting a bad one is still a matter of (bad) luck. Well except for those born under a bad sign, of course.
If turning off TVB reduced the Warcraft server failures from 30% down to 5% - at least when running with DDR5-3600 - then TVB must be fatally broken.
Just have to wait for someone to run a full benchmark suite at those settings.
Associate
Intels in serious trouble
As if things didn't seem bad enough with Intel CPU stability issues, things may get much worse! Watch more to find out! Want to undervolt your intel CPU and ...
youtu.be
Intels in serious trouble
As if things didn't seem bad enough with Intel CPU stability issues, things may get much worse! Watch more to find out! Want to undervolt your intel CPU and ...
Classic Jay jumping on the bandwagon while adding nothing of value
I did like the Intel Terminator meme at the end though , should shop Gelsinger's face onto it
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Associate
Yep, the unscripted nature of its videos are hilarious. So many mistakes and wrong information in them.
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Caporegime
I don't have one of these chips, but from observation, mainly tech jurnoes i see them running 1.5v or even a smidge above that in heavy MT workloads, i've even commented on it here, saying its utterly insane, its mental, and was told i don't know what i'm talking about.
Look, my CPU in low stress workloads will run up to 4.9 Ghz at about 1.5v, its low stress boosting, its done that for 4 years its obviously not hurting it, but if i put the MT stress on it the voltage drops all the way down to about 1.3v and the clocks are about 4.6 Ghz, there are options in the BIOS that allow me to override that behaviour, even on a granular level i can set by how much to override that behaviour right up to and including run the same 1.5v and 4.9 Ghz no matter what, effectively that Asus thing that on Intel CPU's turns the low core stress boost to all boost always, MCE... that's it... i forgot until i typed that out...
Now i've seen that in my BIOS, you have to unlock it behind a fat warning... and i've played with it slightly out of curiosity, only enough to see a noticeable difference and at that point i was already no.... no no no this is idiotic, i need my CPU to last more than 6 weeks!
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Anyway, here is Windell, again, talking about the fat elephant in the room everyone trying to avoid noticing, Memory Speeds...
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Unnamed Datacentre provider has stopped offering i9 servers.
The issue is Minecraft - the server provider leases 14900k blade servers for Minecraft. Apparently Minecraft servers are single thread performance limited so the 14900k was the best choice, they only need a CPU which has 1 core running fast and fast memory.
The problem: Minecraft killed 40x 14900k CPUs in 1 month. Some of these degraded CPUs were brought back to life by lowering clocks and voltages.
The issue is Minecraft - the server provider leases 14900k blade servers for Minecraft. Apparently Minecraft servers are single thread performance limited so the 14900k was the best choice, they only need a CPU which has 1 core running fast and fast memory.
The problem: Minecraft killed 40x 14900k CPUs in 1 month. Some of these degraded CPUs were brought back to life by lowering clocks and voltages.
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Associate
- Joined
- 8 Oct 2008
- Posts
- 1,296
Oof
More comes out, yesterday Intel issued a statement regarding voltages being the issue. Now they have quietly released another statement saying oxidation of the via's, a manufacturing flaw which leads to degradation.
I wonder what our options are ?
More comes out, yesterday Intel issued a statement regarding voltages being the issue. Now they have quietly released another statement saying oxidation of the via's, a manufacturing flaw which leads to degradation.
I wonder what our options are ?
Code:
As per Intel PR Comms:
Based on extensive analysis of Intel Core 13th/14th Gen desktop processors returned to us due to instability issues, we have determined that elevated operating voltage is causing instability issues in some 13th/14th Gen desktop processors. Our analysis of returned processors confirms that the elevated operating voltage is stemming from a microcode algorithm resulting in incorrect voltage requests to the processor.
Intel is delivering a microcode patch which addresses the root cause of exposure to elevated voltages. We are continuing validation to ensure that scenarios of instability reported to Intel regarding its Core 13th/14th Gen desktop processors are addressed. Intel is currently targeting mid-August for patch release to partners following full validation.
Intel is committed to making this right with our customers, and we continue asking any customers currently experiencing instability issues on their Intel Core 13th/14th Gen desktop processors reach out to Intel Customer Support for further assistance.
July 2024 Update on Instability Reports on Intel Core 13th and 14th Gen Desktop Processors - Intel Community
This video by RobeyTech is also helpful and gives some tips on how to check your system to see if you are affected:
https://youtu.be/wkrOYfmXhIc
So that you don't have to hun down the answer -> Questions about manufacturing or Via Oxidation as reported by Tech outlets:
Short answer: We can confirm there was a via Oxidation manufacturing issue (addressed back in 2023) but it is not related to the instability issue.
Long answer: We can confirm that the via Oxidation manufacturing issue affected some early Intel Core 13th Gen desktop processors. However, the issue was root caused and addressed with manufacturing improvements and screens in 2023. We have also looked at it from the instability reports on Intel Core 13th Gen desktop processors and the analysis to-date has determined that only a small number of instability reports can be connected to the manufacturing issue.
For the Instability issue, we are delivering a microcode patch which addresses exposure to elevated voltages which is a key element of the Instability issue. We are currently validating the microcode patch to ensure the instability issues for 13th/14th Gen are addressed.
Question about Mobile 13th/14th Gen Stability issues
So, from what we have seen on our analysis of the reported Intel Core 13th/14th mobile products we have seen that mobile products are not exposed to the same issue. The symptoms being reported on 13th/14th Gen mobile systems – including system hangs and crashes – are symptoms stemming from a broad range of potential software and hardware issues.
As always, if you are experiencing issues with their Intel-powered laptops we encourage them to reach out to the system manufacturer for further help.
I'll be on the thread for the next couple of hours trying to address any questions you folks might have. Please keep in mind that I won't be able to answer every question but I'll do my best to address most of them.
Thanks
Lex H. - Intel
Edits: added answers to Oxidation questions and questions about Mobile Processors
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Presumably they'll have to run a replacement program like they did with the p67 sandybridge motherboard's back in the day.
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Associate
- Joined
- 8 Oct 2008
- Posts
- 1,296
Possibly - if the media cause enough bad publicity.
However if the fix means lower performance, it's awkward.
I remember the original Pentiums couldn't count - that was fun.
There are a lot of things which aren't clear including interaction with TVB and whether these cores actually need the extra voltage to be stable, let alone if this is actually the fundamental problem, but largely it seems to be excess voltage and frequency for a given temperature situation affecting 1-2 cores which means performance loss would be from performance outside of "Intel spec" and minimal - up to 1% or so. But that assumes the CPUs would still be stable under intended settings. Given that some CPUs seem to be edge cases out the box I'm not sure Intel can fix this without resulting in some CPUs becoming unstable within nominal spec settings.
And that won't fix CPUs which have degraded past a certain point.
Soldato
So for the next few years, I guess we'll be seeing Intel's market share go down to AMD's Bulldozer era levels?
Now, people will get fired for buying Intel.
They are going to need some fantastic CPUs at solid prices, going forward. Should be good for us (if they can actually do that).
Now, people will get fired for buying Intel.
They are going to need some fantastic CPUs at solid prices, going forward. Should be good for us (if they can actually do that).
Soldato
They’d be right. That isn’t how these CPU operate at all. You’re only about 200 to 300mV off.
Just to make sure there's no misunderstanding, the above is using Intel Specification for ACLL. The below screenshot is using ASUS Optimised profile which uses a different milliohms value.
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Unreal Engine developer says 50% of their 14900k systems are not stable and constantly crash, says they will be switching all their PCs to the AMD 9950x
www.tomshardware.com
Unreal Engine supervisor at ModelFarm blasts 50% failure rate with Intel chips — company switching to AMD's Ryzen 9 9950X, praises single-threaded performance
Criticism increases.
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Associate
$1.67 24th July 2015, that was make or break time for AMD. They bet the company on Zen.So for the next few years, I guess we'll be seeing Intel's market share go down to AMD's Bulldozer era levels?
Now, people will get fired for buying Intel.
They are going to need some fantastic CPUs at solid prices, going forward. Should be good for us (if they can actually do that).
I can't be bothered to read back for context as the poster you are replying to I have on ignore - but are you saying here 14th gen CPUs aren't hitting voltages above 1.5V? because I've seen a fair few that on W680 boards where individual cores are getting into the 1.5s and on some consumer boards where they are getting into the 1.6s.
I can't say that is connected to the issue but doing so without consequences goes against everything I understand.