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Intel to Cut Prices of its Desktop Processors by 15% in Response to Ryzen 3000

chrcoluk said:
probably not, the gap has closed no doubt tho.

But in games like lightning returns I be surprised if ryzen matches or beats intel.

I have a friend who got a 3700X and am waiting for him to build it and fire up the game so I can analyse it. :)

I see lightning returns as the ultimate test for the games I often play.

I see it like this.

Value for money AMD providing you dont buy X570 which is a money pit chipset.
Multitasking performance, AMD
Content creation AMD
Gaming whilst streaming on one rig AMD
Gaming on thread heavy games AMD/Intel tied
Gaming on low threaded, single threaded games Intel

I think both cpu's are fast enough now to not worry about generic windows eerformance, boot times, notepad etc.

Dont know about linux compilers etc.

Virtual servers, I would say AMD is the clear winner, they should be nailing that market now.
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Gaming @ 720p or 1080p with a 2080Ti = Intel maybe. Everything else AMD.

Even then the gaming gap is just 5% averaged out with the largest test suite of games (TPU) at 1080p. Which is nothing.

Looking at 3900X vs 9900K, with the Intel:

- You're losing 30-50% in productivity
- You got higher load power draw despite having 4 fewer cores
- You have to buy a good cooler
- You haven't got the most modern platform features (PCIe4)
- There's no upgrade path (whereas AM4 will see Ryzen 4000 most likely)
- You have slower memory support

In short, you'd have to be pretty silly to buy Intel's 14nm processors now Ryzen 3000 here.
 
chrcoluk said:
probably not, the gap has closed no doubt tho.

But in games like lightning returns I be surprised if ryzen matches or beats intel.

I have a friend who got a 3700X and am waiting for him to build it and fire up the game so I can analyse it. :)

I see lightning returns as the ultimate test for the games I often play.

I see it like this.

Value for money AMD providing you dont buy X570 which is a money pit chipset.
Multitasking performance, AMD
Content creation AMD
Gaming whilst streaming on one rig AMD
Gaming on thread heavy games AMD/Intel tied
Gaming on low threaded, single threaded games Intel

I think both cpu's are fast enough now to not worry about generic windows eerformance, boot times, notepad etc.

Dont know about linux compilers etc.

Virtual servers, I would say AMD is the clear winner, they should be nailing that market now.
Click to expand...

It depends on which X570 board you are talking about. Some have dual multi gigabit networking and Wi-Fi with 12 SATA ports and three M.2 slots. Boards like that aren’t going to be cheap. At the other end of the scale your looking at £160 and you have everything in between.
 
OpenToSuggestions said:
Out of interest why a 3600X over a 3600? There aren't many reviews at all on the 3600X. Is it really worth the extra £60?
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I am hoping it will be like the 2600X in that it overclocks itself. The 2600X does 4.2 Ghz on all cores in gaming without much tweaking.

If that's not the case with the 3600X then I will just get the 3600 but it will be one of these awesome processors.
 
Davanius said:
I am hoping it will be like the 2600X in that it overclocks itself. The 2600X does 4.2 Ghz on all cores in gaming without much tweaking.

If that's not the case with the 3600X then I will just get the 3600 but it will be one of these awesome processors.
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Fair enough. I am leaning towards a 3600 over the 3600X because at the moment there aren't any reviews to cover it.
 
OpenToSuggestions said:
Fair enough. I am leaning towards a 3600 over the 3600X because at the moment there aren't any reviews to cover it.
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I know that the 3600 would suffice. I had a 1600 first gen Ryzen at 3.9 Ghz which was decent but I regretted not getting the X.

So next time I went 2600X and was totally happy with the little to no fuss getting good clocks.

I will most likely do the same even though I know that it isn't a good value as the non X.

AMD has earned my money. :D
 
awaybreaktoday said:
Ryzen 3000 CPUs are currently useless for virtualistion, linux vms will not boot... cant use ryzen master or PBO if virtualisation is enabled in bios.
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PBO is potential tiny gains for lots more power/heat most people using virtualisation dont care about it. In fact its not that uncommon for people to disable XFR, its all about power efficiency and thread count with virtualisation, 60% power load at 80-90% clock speed? take that all day.

Ryzen master isnt relevant on virtualisation anyway. Although this seems a very silly bug in the software that it doesnt function if virtualisation is enabled.

Linux VMs not booting, is probably a temporary issue until a kernel update, ESXi initially had issues on ryzen launch, just teething issues, once sorted for £ to £, amd will rip apart intel because on intel's security issues virtualisation is by far the worst affected in terms of both risk and performance.

Bear in mind I am talking about proper virtualisation, not toy stuff like virtualbox.
 
Boot_Loop said:
Gaming @ 720p or 1080p with a 2080Ti = Intel maybe. Everything else AMD.

Even then the gaming gap is just 5% averaged out with the largest test suite of games (TPU) at 1080p. Which is nothing.

Looking at 3900X vs 9900K, with the Intel:

- You're losing 30-50% in productivity
- You got higher load power draw despite having 4 fewer cores
- You have to buy a good cooler
- You haven't got the most modern platform features (PCIe4)
- There's no upgrade path (whereas AM4 will see Ryzen 4000 most likely)
- You have slower memory support

In short, you'd have to be pretty silly to buy Intel's 14nm processors now Ryzen 3000 here.
Click to expand...

Cant rely on official reviewers for gaming performance, their test suite of games is extremely narrow and too heavily weighted on AAA titles.

PCIe4 isnt relevant to probably 99% of people.
Agree on power load.
Agree on cooler.
Upgrade path is sort of, I think been sensible you dont upgrade more often than every 3 generations so the AM4 argument from that point of view is moot. But of course not all of us are sensible in that regard. I am even considering going from my 8600k to ryzen 3 which is nowhere near 3 generations.
Productivity? Seems to be only for content creators those type of gains, I think content creators (given all influencers are content creators) have hugely over weighted their workloads as importance for the general PC population, things like office applications and web browsers wont see anything like the gains you stated.
Memory latency in my experience is more import than memory bandwidth, regardless, I think most people might be ok buying faster ram providing the price premium isnt crazy, the faster ram you talk off has a price premium that makes it irrelevant to most people.

I consider PCIe4 as a hindrance not a benefit to ryzen 3000 as its main affect is pumping board prices up for no practical benefit which has harmed AMD as one of the strongest arguments for going to the AMD eco system has always been cost. I think the b550 chipset cannot come soon enough. b450 and older X chipsets I expect are carrying a lot of cpu purchases right now.
 
chrcoluk said:
PBO is potential tiny gains for lots more power/heat most people using virtualisation dont care about it. In fact its not that uncommon for people to disable XFR, its all about power efficiency and thread count with virtualisation, 60% power load at 80-90% clock speed? take that all day.

Ryzen master isnt relevant on virtualisation anyway. Although this seems a very silly bug in the software that it doesnt function if virtualisation is enabled.

Linux VMs not booting, is probably a temporary issue until a kernel update, ESXi initially had issues on ryzen launch, just teething issues, once sorted for £ to £, amd will rip apart intel because on intel's security issues virtualisation is by far the worst affected in terms of both risk and performance.

Bear in mind I am talking about proper virtualisation, not toy stuff like virtualbox.
Click to expand...
My threadriper runs KVM and lxd on top of zfs with 128gb of ram. My ryzen 1800x will soon become my zfs servervwith my threadriper running esxi. On my main desktop I will have vmware workstation installed, I will also game on this desktop..
 
Boot_Loop said:
In short, you'd have to be pretty silly to buy Intel's 14nm processors now Ryzen 3000 here.
Click to expand...
Put me on the silly list.

Grabbed a 9900k today for £414 delivered (new from a competitor with code) and a Gigabyte Z390 Pro ATX board for not much over £100 with discounts.

For my workloads which is 99% gaming and some LR work the Intel solution made sense. The 9900k is roughly 20% ahead at 1080p, 10% 1440p and error margins at 4k on average depending upon game compared with AMD. But i still wanted Intel due to the high IPC grunt. I play a lot of indie games and they're unlikely to get any AMD optimisations any time soon.

So for roughly the same money as a 3800X + X470 i've got a 9900k + Z390 with a decent VRM and something to huddle around on cold winter nights.

Don't get me wrong the AMD range is storming and i'd argue there is little reason to go beyond a 3600 because it is that good of a chip but it doesn't make AMD the only choice! I'm glad AMD are back in the game and this will hopefully push Intel into innovating once again :)
 
ChrisD. said:
That's not strictly true. 4 cores running at 5Ghz for example will be better than 6 cores running at 2Ghz. Assuming the same IPC performance of course.
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except the latter is more power efficient.

There is a reason datacentres are filled with core heavy chips at lower clock speeds.

Although you showed a very extreme difference in clock speed in your example, the newest chips arent as low as 2ghz, and no AMD chips are hitting 5ghz. (excluding extreme testing).

e.g. on my 2600x XFR will add about 25w, taken as system draw (so including entire system) thats about 32% added power for an extra 12% clock speed. PBO makes it even worse, as PBO adds almost nothing over what standard XFR does, but pumps up the voltages further and allowing limits to be breached.
 
awaybreaktoday said:
My threadriper runs KVM and lxd on top of zfs with 128gb of ram. My ryzen 1800x will soon become my zfs servervwith my threadriper running esxi. On my main desktop I will have vmware workstation installed, I will also game on this desktop..
Click to expand...

yeah your desktop is hybrid use not pure virtualisation which isnt what I meant, obviously on your desktop with it been used for gaming also you will want all the performance you can take, also on my own ryzen 2 esxi XFR is enabled, as I decided to go that way although given the system is idle/low loads 95-99% of the time, I think I am going to disable XFR on it again, but if you speak to people in datacentres and on reddit, you will see how power sensitive a lot of people are, especially in datacentres.

There was even some negative feedback piling up on one of buildzoid's videos from homelab virtual server owners, about his complete ignorance of power load as his videos are from the same perspective as reviewers, the focus been on content creation and high end gaming, typically those two user bases dont care about power draw, he was using a 1000w psu on low end cpu's and using the results of that to justify not doing things like adaptive voltage, saying 10-20w savings are meaningless etc. It was really interesting to see that there was a sudden surge of virtual server owners taking issue with that in his comments section.
 
chrcoluk said:
yeah your desktop is hybrid use not pure virtualisation which isnt what I meant, obviously on your desktop with it been used for gaming also you will want all the performance you can take, also on my own ryzen 2 esxi XFR is enabled, as I decided to go that way although given the system is idle/low loads 95-99% of the time, I think I am going to disable XFR on it again, but if you speak to people in datacentres and on reddit, you will see how power sensitive a lot of people are, especially in datacentres.

There was even some negative feedback piling up on one of buildzoid's videos from homelab virtual server owners, about his complete ignorance of power load as his videos are from the same perspective as reviewers, the focus been on content creation and high end gaming, typically those two user bases dont care about power draw, he was using a 1000w psu on low end cpu's and using the results of that to justify not doing things like adaptive voltage, saying 10-20w savings are meaningless etc. It was really interesting to see that there was a sudden surge of virtual server owners taking issue with that in his comments section.
Click to expand...
What storage do you use for your esxi server? local,iscsi or nfs? What do you use your esxi server for?
 
Sh4rkie said:
Put me on the silly list.

Grabbed a 9900k today for £414 delivered (new from a competitor with code) and a Gigabyte Z390 Pro ATX board for not much over £100 with discounts.

For my workloads which is 99% gaming and some LR work the Intel solution made sense. The 9900k is roughly 20% ahead at 1080p, 10% 1440p and error margins at 4k on average depending upon game compared with AMD. But i still wanted Intel due to the high IPC grunt. I play a lot of indie games and they're unlikely to get any AMD optimisations any time soon.

So for roughly the same money as a 3800X + X470 i've got a 9900k + Z390 with a decent VRM and something to huddle around on cold winter nights.

Don't get me wrong the AMD range is storming and i'd argue there is little reason to go beyond a 3600 because it is that good of a chip but it doesn't make AMD the only choice! I'm glad AMD are back in the game and this will hopefully push Intel into innovating once again :)
Click to expand...

I assume this deal you got was from rainforest? :)
 
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