Is Lewis Hamilton the GOAT (this thread is about Lewis as an F1 driver, not anything else)?

MrKnifey said:
I wouldn't call it showing up his team mate yet.... Also George is hardly a rookie is he? :rolleyes::cry:
Click to expand...

Well it's Russell's first few races in a completely new team, in comparison to someone who's known that team inside out for many many years, as said this is a discussion about if Ham is a Goat. Not just, is he better than his team mate. If you are a goat shouldn't you be consistently proving yourself to be a fair bit quicker than a new team mate? I know it's still very early in the season, but I don't think anyone can saying Lewis is doing well so far.
 
Stumble Bum said:
The thread is 8 pages long since a month ago, people are hardly just turning up now...

It would seem some people prefer to shut their ears and close their eyes at the thought of any criticism. Shame really.
Click to expand...

Criticism is welcome. Hamilton is by no means perfect, and neither is any other driver. He has bad races and even disappointing seasons occasionally, just like all the other world champions.

Poo pooing his life's work because his latest car is struggling/rubbish and his teammate has beaten him a couple of times (primarily due to bad luck) in the opening few races of a season is just stupid.
 
Stumble Bum said:
Well it's Russell's first few races in a completely new team, in comparison to someone who's known that team inside out for many many years, as said this is a discussion about if Ham is a Goat. Not just, is he better than his team mate. If you are a goat shouldn't you be consistently proving yourself to be a fair bit quicker than a new team mate? I know it's still very early in the season, but I don't think anyone can saying Lewis is doing well so far.
Click to expand...

So he's not a rookie then.. otherwise I'd be a rookie in my new race car this year in the same series I raced last year, as im not in same car as last year... Good logic :rolleyes:
 
Stumble Bum said:
Well it's Russell's first few races in a completely new team, in comparison to someone who's known that team inside out for many many years, as said this is a discussion about if Ham is a Goat. Not just, is he better than his team mate. If you are a goat shouldn't you be consistently proving yourself to be a fair bit quicker than a new team mate? I know it's still very early in the season, but I don't think anyone can saying Lewis is doing well so far.
Click to expand...
So Ronaldo and Messi are not goat contenders either because of how average they are currently playing in football? Gotcha
 
I'm surprised Hamilton is so far back. In hindsight I wonder if he should have left or regrets not leaving on a high?

If Russell does get the better of him over the season it's fair to say his reputation will be tarnished.
 
Stumble Bum said:
This analogy makes zero sense, but that is not surprising from you.
Click to expand...
How so? Both are not as great as before.

My point is, no driver/ sports person stays on top forever and you simply cannot ignore the history books of what Hamilton has achieved.

If sir George Russell wins 8 championship titles and breaks or come close to Hamiltons other records, then we can talk
 
jonneymendoza said:
How so? Both are not as great as before.

My point is, no driver/ sports person stays on top forever and you simply cannot ignore the history books of what Hamilton has achieved.

If sir George Russell wins 8 championship titles and breaks or come close to Hamiltons other records, then we can talk
Click to expand...

You're trying to compare two footballers who I don't think have ever had a bad season, at the top of the game until they reached the age where footballers physically peak. Football is an athletic sport and completely different to F1, you can't compare, and it's astonishing that you even try to. In fact it's actually quite a bad example. During their years of being fit enough Ronaldo and Messi have been exceptional and never have dropped from the top. What's Hamilton's excuse?

jonneymendoza said:
No, it makes your comments look pathetic and silly
Click to expand...

Again, it's these silly childish responses with no verbal reasoning or discursive ability that undermines any argument, but then you are a known resident troll.
 
JBeck said:
Have you even watched the races? Lewis took gambles on setups which ultimately didn't work, at least he tried something different, and yes, the SC screwed him last race.

And surprise surprise yourself, as always you're saying anything and everything to **** him off given the tiniest sniff of a foothold.
Click to expand...

Gambles with setup or being lucky or unlucky with the safety car the results are starting to show. Places for points are what’s it’s all about and he’s not performing, he can’t even beat his biggest rival at the moment and lie I said given he’s been in that seat for many years it’s embarrassing.
 
Scam said:
Prove it.
Click to expand...

Sakir Dec 2020, was hands down beating Bottas and was on for winning the GP. I’ll let you make your mind up about what happened with the tyre change.

loads of driver would have been multiple WC in that car and this is the whole crux of my argument about LH being the goat. I think it’s more of right car at the right time, as I’ve said on a par with Seb st best.
 
Stumble Bum said:
During their years of being fit enough Ronaldo and Messi have been exceptional and never have dropped from the top. What's Hamilton's excuse?
Click to expand...

So if someone like Lewis Hamilton, who like it or not has a tremendous record, cannot be considered a GOAT contender, who should?

Let's consider some of the contenders named in this thread:

Fangio - 2, 1, 2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 14
Surtees - 14, 12, 4, 4, 1, 5, 2, 4, 7, 11, 18, 18, 19, UC
Clark - 10, 7, 2, 1, 3, 1, 6, 3, 11
Senna - 9, 4, 4, 3, 1, 2, 1, 1, 4, 2, UC
Schumacher - 14, 3, 4, 1, 1, 3, DQ, 2, 5, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 3, 2, 9, 8, 13
Vettel - 14, 8, 2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 5, 3, 4, 2, 2, 5, 13, 12
Hamilton - 2, 1, 5, 4, 5, 4, 4, 1, 1, 2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2

Fangio, finished his last season 14th - what's his excuse?
Surtees, multiple seasons where he didn't even hit the top ten - what's his excuse?
Clark, an also ran in his first season and died in his last - not very GOAT is it?
Schumacher, disqualified and a midfielder for the last 3 years. So much for him!
Vettel, languishing outside the top 3 for years now, never a GOAT contender.
Senna, died at the wheel, doesn't sound like the sort of bloke who should be considered a GOAT if he couldn't even keep it on the tarmac.

Actually, on pure numbers in terms of average championship positions (not having done any actual maths) Fangio, Senna and Hamilton seem to be by far the best performers from that lot.

EDIT - just because people have a hard time dealing with sarcasm in this forum, I'd like to point out that Fangio, Surtees, Clark, Schumacher, Vettel, Senna and Hamilton are clearly all fantastic drivers who were at the top of their game for considerable periods.
 
jonneymendoza said:
How so? Both are not as great as before.

My point is, no driver/ sports person stays on top forever and you simply cannot ignore the history books of what Hamilton has achieved.

If sir George Russell wins 8 championship titles and breaks or come close to Hamiltons other records, then we can talk
Click to expand...

This. To be honest I fully expect Hamilton to start to drop off now compared to the upcoming younger excellent talent(LeClerc, Norris, Russell etc).

His ability to keep up with the younger, fitter and sharper minded talent is bound to reduce over the coming years . No one can defeat the aging process!

That doesn't detract from him being undoubtedly one of F1's legends and obvious contender for GOAT.
 
Lopéz said:
So if someone like Lewis Hamilton, who like it or not has a tremendous record, cannot be considered a GOAT contender, who should?

Let's consider some of the contenders named in this thread:

Fangio - 2, 1, 2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 14
Surtees - 14, 12, 4, 4, 1, 5, 2, 4, 7, 11, 18, 18, 19, UC
Clark - 10, 7, 2, 1, 3, 1, 6, 3, 11
Senna - 9, 4, 4, 3, 1, 2, 1, 1, 4, 2, UC
Schumacher - 14, 3, 4, 1, 1, 3, DQ, 2, 5, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 3, 2, 9, 8, 13
Vettel - 14, 8, 2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 5, 3, 4, 2, 2, 5, 13, 12
Hamilton - 2, 1, 5, 4, 5, 4, 4, 1, 1, 2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2

Fangio, finished his last season 14th - what's his excuse?
Surtees, multiple seasons where he didn't even hit the top ten - what's his excuse?
Clark, an also ran in his first season and died in his last - not very GOAT is it?
Schumacher, disqualified and a midfielder for the last 3 years. So much for him!
Vettel, languishing outside the top 3 for years now, never a GOAT contender.
Senna, died at the wheel, doesn't sound like the sort of bloke who should be considered a GOAT if he couldn't even keep it on the tarmac.

Actually, on pure numbers in terms of average championship positions (not having done any actual maths) Fangio, Senna and Hamilton seem to be by far the best performers from that lot.

EDIT - just because people have a hard time dealing with sarcasm in this forum, I'd like to point out that Fangio, Surtees, Clark, Schumacher, Vettel, Senna and Hamilton are clearly all fantastic drivers who were at the top of their game for considerable periods.
Click to expand...

I don't think there is a goat of formula 1. There are many top drivers who have all accomplished various impressive feats (and I include Hamilton in that), but personally I don't see any one name standing out.

Unfortunately it's the hardest sport to compare. Different eras of technology, against different competitors, even just the differences in driving a modern F1 car and the million things they need to do compared to drivers of yesteryear. Hamilton is certainly up there, but greatest of all time? Sorry, I fail to see it. I don't see how he stands out above everyone else.
 
Lopéz said:
So if someone like Lewis Hamilton, who like it or not has a tremendous record, cannot be considered a GOAT contender, who should?

Let's consider some of the contenders named in this thread:

Fangio - 2, 1, 2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 14
Surtees - 14, 12, 4, 4, 1, 5, 2, 4, 7, 11, 18, 18, 19, UC
Clark - 10, 7, 2, 1, 3, 1, 6, 3, 11
Senna - 9, 4, 4, 3, 1, 2, 1, 1, 4, 2, UC
Schumacher - 14, 3, 4, 1, 1, 3, DQ, 2, 5, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 3, 2, 9, 8, 13
Vettel - 14, 8, 2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 5, 3, 4, 2, 2, 5, 13, 12
Hamilton - 2, 1, 5, 4, 5, 4, 4, 1, 1, 2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2

Fangio, finished his last season 14th - what's his excuse?
Surtees, multiple seasons where he didn't even hit the top ten - what's his excuse?
Clark, an also ran in his first season and died in his last - not very GOAT is it?
Schumacher, disqualified and a midfielder for the last 3 years. So much for him!
Vettel, languishing outside the top 3 for years now, never a GOAT contender.
Senna, died at the wheel, doesn't sound like the sort of bloke who should be considered a GOAT if he couldn't even keep it on the tarmac.

Actually, on pure numbers in terms of average championship positions (not having done any actual maths) Fangio, Senna and Hamilton seem to be by far the best performers from that lot.

EDIT - just because people have a hard time dealing with sarcasm in this forum, I'd like to point out that Fangio, Surtees, Clark, Schumacher, Vettel, Senna and Hamilton are clearly all fantastic drivers who were at the top of their game for considerable periods.
Click to expand...

There’s too much sense in this post for it to be in this thread.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom