Is the situation really this bad?

[CREATIVE!11]

The whole state of the countries economy is screwed, I don't know if it's various wars or what, maybe because it's happening gradually (well ish) but doesn't seem to be making the news, but it's bad and it's starting to sniff a bit like 2008.

Although unlike 2008 which was top down, this seems more like bottom up.

What I mean by that before the innuendos come in, is 2008 was really bank to bank lending and investments etc all tanking, the value of a lot of money ended up being worthless which was obviously a huge issue, and of course has a knock on effect to the average Joe. But the problem started at the top of the food chain, financially.

But this time it's looking like it's the opposite.

Fun isn't it.

I graduated right after the big 2008 crash, spent a long time bouncing around. I decided in 30's to make a career switch to software dev as I always had an interest in it, finished up my year and bit of self teaching + a bootcamp into an inflation crisis that seems to be teetering on the edge of another recession.

Luckily............ I have now landed a job. But it could have easily not happened. Both pivotal moments rocked by similar circumstances.

 

[Zirax]

This has been a great read, thanks. It has confirmed my findings for finding Test automation / devops contracts. The market is beyond bad for work.

A bit stuck as I can't walk otherwise I would retrain as a plumber (in the family). I am considering abandoning tech and doing something else.

 

[BongoHunter]

I don't think it's dead in the South East yet for contracting, rates are fractionally down as an average but I'm still getting calls for roles (though it's definitely less than last year).

I always find this site pretty useful for getting a feel across different locations for different roles, E.G DevOps in South East https://www.itjobswatch.co.uk/contracts/south east/devops.do

Tbh I think if your a DevOps engineer you'd be better off pitching yourself as an SRE as that appears to be a common shift that's going on in a lot or organisations at the moment.

 

[malachi]

This has been a great read, thanks. It has confirmed my findings for finding Test automation / devops contracts. The market is beyond bad for work.

A bit stuck as I can't walk otherwise I would retrain as a plumber (in the family). I am considering abandoning tech and doing something else.

That something else doesn't mean you be better off when tough times are here like now. You are in a very good position as you can apply for work anywhere.

Don't strict yourself to your location when you don't have to.

 

[Zirax]

I don't think it's dead in the South East yet for contracting, rates are fractionally down as an average but I'm still getting calls for roles (though it's definitely less than last year).

I always find this site pretty useful for getting a feel across different locations for different roles, E.G DevOps in South East https://www.itjobswatch.co.uk/contracts/south east/devops.do

Tbh I think if your a DevOps engineer you'd be better off pitching yourself as an SRE as that appears to be a common shift that's going on in a lot or organisations at the moment.

I'll take a look at SRE. I kind of do that anyway with the testing background.

That something else doesn't mean you be better off when tough times are here like now. You are in a very good position as you can apply for work anywhere.

Don't strict yourself to your location when you don't have to.

Location wise I have always moved about. IR35 plays a massive factor on hotel costs.

I do take your point on roles, having no heating / hot water tends to act as a requirement (Though not for me).

 

[HangTime]

My view has changed on this of late, there's been a noticeable uplift on LinkedIn (a reasonable barometer) of noise around the "market conditions" and I've also had a lot more unsolicited approaches from recruiters (hawking their services for hiring, rather than just offering roles like it was a couple of years back). Clearly, the recruiters are in the mode of having too few vacancies to fill and are hitting the phones, spamming inboxes and generally back to the cold-calling days to try and drum up some business, get their name out there so as and when you have hiring needs they hope there's a slim chance you might consider them.

I think quite a few recruiters are going to be let go in the coming months, Christmas is a quiet time anyway so I see them getting shipped out before then.

 

[Housey]

It is a tough time in tech for recruiters and many saying the worst they have known. There are always pockets of buoyancy but in the main it’s really hard out there for them.

 

[jonneymendoza]

It is a tough time in tech for recruiters and many saying the worst they have known. There are always pockets of buoyancy but in the main it’s really hard out there for them.

no just recruiters but for devs too.

I dont understand why? has everyonoe stopped using tech?

 

[chrismscotland]

Its really quiet here too (Edinburgh), I'm lucky I've got a really interesting IT role at the moment and we're going through a fair IT transformation so I've been extended into next year but I know most of the more generic BA's are being let go.
Agency are saying its the quietest they've ever seen it, I know we're now into that pre-Christmas slowdown anyway but it seems to have been quiet all year.

 

[Housey]

no just recruiters but for devs too.

I dont understand why? has everyonoe stopped using tech?

Budgets are getting slashed, projects getting frozen or cancelled, development plans realigned. Additionally the big tech companies have been focusing on profitability over growth at all cost, a real sea change that has impacted many people across the sector. For well over 10 years we have been in an invest for future growth culture but not any more. Investors now want their returns and that is why large tech has been removing thousands of people.

I'm in the middle of it so see it first hand.

 

[jonneymendoza]

Budgets are getting slashed, projects getting frozen or cancelled, development plans realigned. Additionally the big tech companies have been focusing on profitability over growth at all cost, a real sea change that has impacted many people across the sector. For well over 10 years we have been in an invest for future growth culture but not any more. Investors now want their returns and that is why large tech has been removing thousands of people.

I'm in the middle of it so see it first hand.

Will this ever normalised or is it all doom and gloom?

 

[malachi]

Will this ever normalised or is it all doom and gloom?

Plenty of smaller companies will still recruit. All the focus seems to be on the bigger companies.

Cant find my replacement and I leave my current role in 2 weeks to start another in December. My role has been advertised on the companies website and LinkedIn for months. Still nothing.

We have the same vacancy open for our Greek office, its been over a year. We have interviewed less than 10 people. We offered the role to two of them and they both rejected.

 

[peterwalkley]

I think the market is pretty dead at the moment too. Very few approaches from recruiters and most of it is either a fishing expedition for open roles where I am or someone throwing keyword poo at a wall to see if it sticks.

Don't know if its related, but I'm seeing a huge number of linkedin "suggested" posts where people are just putting some some trivial bit of knowledge that just comes across as desperate attention seeking. Most recent was someone just listing a bunch of git commands with no context or explanation - including rebase, which is really dangerous if you don't know what you're doing ! Its getting annoying as there's no easy filter to remove the garbage.

 

[Housey]

Will this ever normalised or is it all doom and gloom?

I think it will improve but the days of just recruiting roles for future expected growth are not likely to return anytime soon. As I’ve said previously, there has been a lot of money spent on average talent and now that is being “un spent” but sadly some decent people are getting hit too. We are all just numbers on a spreadsheet in the end, even if you control the spreadsheet.

 

[D.P.]

We have many positions open but hard to fill them. Salaries are soaring, candidate come with multiple offers on hand. But These are data science, MLOps and similar roles.

 

[jonneymendoza]

I think it will improve but the days of just recruiting roles for future expected growth are not likely to return anytime soon. As I’ve said previously, there has been a lot of money spent on average talent and now that is being “un spent” but sadly some decent people are getting hit too. We are all just numbers on a spreadsheet in the end, even if you control the spreadsheet.

I hope so

 

[Housey]

We have many positions open but hard to fill them. Salaries are soaring, candidate come with multiple offers on hand. But These are data science, MLOps and similar roles.

As I said some specialities are still showing strong demand but most are pretty dead or low.

 

[Cleisthenes]

I work for a big recruiter and our tech business has died this year, not expecting anything miraculous in 2024 but one can hope.

 

[jaybee]

Tbh I think if your a DevOps engineer you'd be better off pitching yourself as an SRE as that appears to be a common shift that's going on in a lot or organisations at the moment.

Why do you think it would be better to pitch as an SRE? Do you mean so that one can differentiate more from Devops engineers to stand out more?

 

[BongoHunter]

Why do you think it would be better to pitch as an SRE? Do you mean so that one can differentiate more from Devops engineers to stand out more?

From what I'm seeing SRE is a growing trend and DevOps is flat/declining. At least in my business (very large tech company).

SRE principles are also showing up in all the marketing materials from the major vendors so it's something the directors/C-suite will be getting an earful of at all those dinners/conferences/golf days...

Edit: A lot of the skills are the same when you look at the roles, SRE just has more monitoring in it with a slight twist on the mindset. The Google SRE book is free and well worth a read.